We just got chicks this week - dog troubles

[Katz5617]

We got our first baby chicks this week. We took our time and built a nice coop. We fenced a chicken yard with shade area and sun area and even made certain to cover the top with fencing to keep out the owls. Underneath the coop we used 1/2 inch hardware cloth and the remainder of the fencing is six feet, heavy gauge, coated hex wire. We have a four year old Great Pyrenees and his instincts should be to act as a guardian. I began going to the fence with the baby chicks in my hand and he would nose it and sniff it, but wasn't aggressive. The first two nights we left the chicks in the house in a kennel, but each day I would take them out and put them down in their pen and let them run around. Our dog would go beserk. I would correct him and he would run round and round the outside of the pen and try to get through the wire. I caught him one time taking the wire with his teeth and trying to pull it loose from the fence boards. I would check him and he would stop, but he continued to stay totally focused on the baby chicks. This afternoon we left to go pick up something to eat and bring it back home. I wouldn't leave the chicks in the pen, but I did put them in their coop. We were gone less than 30 minutes and came back to find our dog inside the pen. He had literally used his teeth and chewed through the wire (we didn't use the light gauge, but the heavier wire that was coated). He had chewed a hole as big around as a 55 gallon drum. He got into the pen and was in front of the coop trying to nose the sliding door open. We tried to get him out and he refused to come. He's a large Pyrenees at 160 pounds. I had to spray him with the hose to get him out. What can we do to get him adjusted to the chickens.

 

[gamebirdsonly]

Good luck some dogs never adjust and will want to eat them no matter what you do

 

[islandgirl82]

Obedience training is a must and positive reinforcement when he ignores them. I've also seen people have great results using those collars that emit a high frequency with dogs who have a high prey/herding drive. Consistency is another must. I haven't tried the electric poultry netting but every post I've read from people who have, love it. Maybe you could use that as an additional barrier around your coop and run...though with his long coat it may not even phase him.

I grew up with 3 great pyrenees...this is extremely surprising behavior for them.

I hope he settles down and accepts them soon!
-Heather

 

[6of6chicks]

Deleted 7/24/2014.

 

[Katz5617]

I've held the chicks and as long as I have them he's fine. He'll nose them and sniff but he doesn't act aggressive. If I am in the pen with them, he will run from side to side and up and down, but he has only barked at them once. He hasn't growled at them he just tries to get to them and managed to chew through the wire. I take them out to the pen in a covered picnic basket and he follows me and sniffs the basket and tries to nose it, but he doesn't jump at it or anything. One minute he will run around the pen and he'll be down on his front paws with his back end in the air and his tell wagging. I don't know whether he wants to play with them or eat them, but he is extremely determined to get to them. I really don't understand what he is doing. We have had baby birds fall from the nest and have raised them around him. He'll let the black birds light and eat out of his food dish while he is laying beside it. He's never had a problem with birds - squirrels and possums he goes after with a passion. He doesn't chase cats, but he is obsessed with these baby chicks. I'm going tomorrow to buy hardware cloth to reinforce the bottom of the pen around the entire perimeter and going to get enough to lay along the outside ground a distance of two feet or so and stake it down to keep him from digging. I don't think the chickens will be free ranging in the yard at this rate, but we did build a fairly large chicken run so hopefully with the modifications for fortifications we can keep them safe. I'm going to keep trying to introduce him to the chickens. I have been trying to reward and praise him when he just sniffs at them and I correct him when he gets anxious. I guess I assumed because he doesn't have a problem with the birds in the yard he would just accept the chickens.

 

[cmchickens]

Unfortunately your first mistake is assuming that his "instincts should be to act as a guardian." Sorry, but that's wrong. Every dog needs training and socialization, regardless of what their breed is "known" for. Some dogs pick up behaviors you want easier than others, but none of them are born instinctively 'knowing' how to follow people rules.

Your dog needs to be introduced to the chicks in a controlled setting. Put him on a leash for EVERY interaction he has with the chicks. My dogs know the commands "gentle" and "leave it." With a tight grip on the leash, "show" your dog the chicks. Instruct him with the behavior you want ("gentle") and if he stays calm, reward him. If he whines, barks, growls, lunges, or gets excited, quickly correct him. When he is calm again, try again with the chick. Keep doing this several times a day until your dog consistently stays calm and you are comfortable relaxing your grip on the leash. One of my labs understood this in a day. The other one took two weeks.

When your dog has demonstrated that he can stay calm, gradually allow him more interaction with the chicks. For me that was allowing my dogs to be at the coop doors when I cleaned. They were off leash, but I was right there to correct if needed. Or, they were allowed to walk around the run and sniff at the chicks. If they barked, ran, chased, or got excited I took it back a notch and put them back on a leash.

The KEY is controlled settings. Meaning YOU have to be in control of your dog. He isn't going to act the way you want unless you teach him. It just takes time, patience, and consistency. But with proper training and socialization, you'll eventually get the dog you want - a dog that will see the chickens as friends, and his "guardian" instincts will take over.

Good luck!!

X2

6of6chicks is right. Please please please follow the training outlined above. For the sake of your dog and your birds. It is better to begin proper training now, then try and fix behavior after something bad happens. Have fun with your new chicks!

 

[Katz5617]

We've been working for hours this morning with Bear and making progress. I've never had any experience training dogs other than we did the obedience training with Bear and he knows the basic commands. He is a smart dog. I chose not to do the shock collars or the electric fence. I really would prefer he learn that he is not to mess with the chicks rather than to just fear the shock. Pyrs are strong willed dogs so for me it is important that his mindset be changed. We went out at daylight this morning. I carried the chicks in the basket by my side and Bear walked along with us to the pen. I locked the gate from the inside and the chicks and I were in and Bear was left outside. At first he would run along the fence and if he nosed it or tried to push in I would correct him and get between his line of sight and the chicks. He would be so focused he would move to another spot and I would move in front of him. Yesterday he was so focused he would not obey his basic commands. This morning I considered it a break through when I could break his concentration on the chicks and get him to sit or lay on command. While I am not using shock, I have a pump near the coop and I put a spray nozzle on the hose. If Bear keeps coming to the fence I spray him in the face with the water and he backs off. I put the chicks in the coop and Bear and I walked back to the house. He will lead with a hand to his neck. I praised him for coming with me and then I walked inside, but opened all the blinds. As soon as I walked in the door and he thought I was gone - back out to the pen he went - I called him and he didn't come so I went and got the hose and sprayed him. I then walked him back to the house with me - still holding the hose. He would look at the hose and the pen, but he came back with me. We did this repeatedly every time I would go in the house - and he would head back. Eventually he wised up and took a detour. He went to the far side of the yard and would go around the backside of the shed and boat house where he would think I couldn't see him. He would lay down for a minute and keep watch on the back door, but I could see his face and nose pointed toward the coop. After a minute or so in his hiding position he would begin a stealth mode heading toward the pen and I would open the door and shout at him no - he would slink back to his hiding spot - he would wait 5-10 minutes looking between the house and the pen and then try again, but I have been watching all morning - as soon as he headed toward the pen I would open the door and shout not. We got up to 30 minutes - then the longest was 45. At 45 minutes he went to the pen and I let him get all the way there - and just as I was about to open the door and shout - he walked back on his own to his hiding place. The shed is halfway between the house and the pen. During mid day it is his normal resting place because of the shade, but this time of the morning his normal place is by the back door. My aim is to get him away from the shed and back at the door without me having to go out - just now he has given up his position at the shed and meandered back to his normal spot by the door. He's smart, but he is stubborn so it will be a battle of wills. We had planned on leaving the chicks in the coop this weekend when we went to the beach house and just have our SIL check on them, but I think I will load them in the kennel and take them with us. We're going to put up the heavier hardware cloth fencing and the apron around the bottom this afternoon when my husband gets home from work, but I still don't want to trust it without us being here. I want him to learn to stay away - not stay away from fear. He's a good dog. He's well behaved and is excellent with the grandkids. He is an awesome watch dog and when we go off we know he is watchful of the property but we have made a commitment and invested time and money into raising these chicks so we have to reach a happy medium. If anyone has dog training experience they can share, we are willing to learn - otherwise we are flying by the seat of our pants here.

 

[6of6chicks]

Deleted 7/24/2014.

 

[Katz5617]

I am by no means confident yet, but we are heading in the right direction. If Bear goes toward the pen now I can call him away. I was gone for two hours and left the babies in the coop. Even when he got in the pen yesterday he could not breach the coop so I felt confident in leaving them there while the kennel dried and aired out. I went to Tractor Supply to get more fencing. I was the 1/2 inch hardware cloth to use in the smaller areas and enough to lay on the ground outside the perimeter. I went to Walmart and bought 12" metal tent stakes to stake the cloth down to keep it flat and will get quick crete to go over the ends to permanently secure it. I saw the recommendations for the 1/2" hardware cloth, but to go over the existing fence we already have, I bought a 1" square steel fence that was heavier than the hardware cloth. Even Bear's teeth can't penetrate this. We're not going to take the other wire down, but are going to install this straight over the top. I bought the U shape nails to secure it to the boards. Unless advised otherwise, we are going to leave the coated chicken wire that is on top of the 6 feet of fence. Bear is not coming through the top. We are going to take some 1x4's and do a tighter square on the top to tighten the wire more just in case the owls or hawks try to come through. Bear quickly dispatches possum and squirrels. He does not bother the cats, but so far they don't venture into the yard because even though he pays them no mind they are scared of him. When I took the chicks out of the coop for their second outing in the pen, there was only once that Bear ran toward the fence. I called him down and made him lay. I could see he was a bunched up ball of energy - his skin just twitching to get up, but he stayed. When he did get up, rather than run around every time, he would walk to the other side and then lay and watch. There were a couple of times he would start the running around and I would call him down. When he laid down I kept praising him. After I left the pen I got him to walk with me about half way when he decided he was going to turn back and go to the pen. I called and he didn't come immediately - he looked at me to judge how determined I was and decided it was worth the risk. I picked up the water hose and sprayed him - after that he walked the rest of the way back to the house with me. I left the back yard and went to the mailbox and he stayed at the back gate waiting for me. When I got back I gave him a treat of left over tenderloin we had last night. He is now laying by the back door. I know that each time I go to the pen his interest will be renewed. For that reason I am going to make more frequent trips in the hope that he will completely loose interest. I don't have a problem if he wants to lay by the pen to watch so long as he doesn't show any aggression or try to get back in. Again, not counting our chickens before they hatch - but I do think we may be heading in the right direction.