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My Flock Is Slowly Dying Off.... HELP!!!!! - Page 2

post #11 of 19
Thread Starter 

How do I treat for coccidiosis? I seem they are too far gone to move, but they walked fine yesterday.

 

So I'm thinking it's either coccidiosis or *gulp* Mereks. One of my hens legs are like that. Can I fix that? Can I even prevent it?

post #12 of 19
Corid will treat coccidiosis. Corid can be found in your feed store.
post #13 of 19
Thread Starter 

So I can't do anything for them till tomorrow when I go into town. I would head down to the local, but they are closed.....

post #14 of 19

Have you seen ANY bloody poop?  If you haven't I wouldn't treat for Coccidiosis. 

"When raising chickens you must think like a chicken...NOT like a human!"

http://www.backyardchickens.com/a/how-to-prepare-for-emergencies-diseases-injuries-before-they-happen 

 

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"When raising chickens you must think like a chicken...NOT like a human!"

http://www.backyardchickens.com/a/how-to-prepare-for-emergencies-diseases-injuries-before-they-happen 

 

Reply
post #15 of 19

If you have seen the classic one leg forward, one leg back, that is likely Marek's. Although, there are some other illnesses which mimic Marek's such as Botulism. With your high heat, you could be growing some manner of pathogen in the coop/run.

 

BYC has a very good, imho, definitive article on Marek's here: http://www.backyardchickens.com/a/the-great-big-giant-mareks-disease-faq

 

On the other hand, Marek's doesn't tend to spread that quickly and cause overnight collapse. It tends to be a bit slower, lame and limping one day, slowly growing worse, still eating/drinking, then wasting until death or recovery...slowly picking off your flock. Technically, if you believe the statistics, all chickens are Mareks carriers as Mareks is prevelent. It is like having the herpes virus in your body and only producing the cold sore when your immune system is down, which stress can do. Raising chickens with Turkeys can create an immunity to Marek's as Turkeys usually carry the Turkey Mareks which is much, much milder in chickens and often gives immunity to Chicken Mareks (original vaccines were based off the turkey virus)....akin to cow pox protecting humans against small pox. But Mareks is morphing into even more strains such that the industry is having a hard time keeping up with it. And, yes, there is even a super virus now that I think about it, that does move quickly. Hopefully you haven't stumbled onto that! (Let's assume not as that is not prevalent yet).

 

But you've got birds of all ages affected, quickly. That could be coccidiosis, which can very quickly emmaciate and weaken, and cause collapse overnight (but not one leg forward/one leg back paralysis). Coccidiosis can be brought on by stress as it too is something that is never eradicated from the bird's system, only held in check by a healthy immune system.  Coccidiosis does not have to produce bloody poo to be an issue. It depends on where the protozoa (coccidia) have taken up residence whether or not it gets into the lower track to produce bloody poo.

 

If they were my birds, I would treat with Sulmet (a sulphur drug) rather than Corid. It is cheaper and it would give you antibiotics against the common gram-negative bacteria in case it is something that has taken hold in the heat.  Follow the directions on the bottle treating full dose 2 days, then half dose 4 days. You often see great improvement by day 2.

 

And perhaps post a photo of the bird with the leg position. It could be classic Marek's working its way through. Support with ACV, yogurt, Chick Saver in water to boost immune as much as you can and hope for the best. Some birds will succumb to the tumors while others will keep them at bay. It's the way of the disease. Breed from those that survive and thrive as they will have a natural resistance.

 

I agree the only way to know for certain is to send/take the bird in for a necropsy.

 

My 2 cents.

LofMc


Edited by Lady of McCamley - 12/26/15 at 6:59pm
Keeper of 15+ layers, common to specialty types for colorful egg baskets. Brooding Queens: The Queen Mum Silkie and 2 Bantam Cochin handmaids. Preparing to breed my own Olive Eggers! Barnevelder roo with Splash Marans and CL for egg color and color coding :D Former 4H leader, GDB Puppy Raiser, Homeschooler. Current ESL tutor. Proud new grandma. Loving wife to a very tolerant husband.
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Keeper of 15+ layers, common to specialty types for colorful egg baskets. Brooding Queens: The Queen Mum Silkie and 2 Bantam Cochin handmaids. Preparing to breed my own Olive Eggers! Barnevelder roo with Splash Marans and CL for egg color and color coding :D Former 4H leader, GDB Puppy Raiser, Homeschooler. Current ESL tutor. Proud new grandma. Loving wife to a very tolerant husband.
Reply
post #16 of 19
It would not hurt to treat for possible coccidiosis. If you are outside the US, there are several drugs used, such as amprollium, sulfa drugs, and toltrazuril. Baycox and Coxoid are some other brand names. When you bring in outside birds that possibly are carriers of Mareks, it can take just 3 weeks or more for symptoms to show up in untreated birds. If you lose another, refrigerate the body in a plastic bage and contact your department of agriculture or poultry vet for a necropsy or try to get a PCR blood test on a living bird wsith symptoms. It can be common for birds with cocci to show similar symptoms of dehydration or Mareks disease.
Edited by Eggcessive - 12/26/15 at 7:11pm
post #17 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bridebeliever View Post

Have you seen ANY bloody poop?  If you haven't I wouldn't treat for Coccidiosis. 

There are several strains of coccidiosis that never show blood in cecal matter.
post #18 of 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady of McCamley View Post

If you have seen the classic one leg forward, one leg back, that is likely Marek's. Although, there are some other illnesses which mimic Marek's such as Botulism. With your high heat, you could be growing some manner of pathogen in the coop/run.

BYC has a very good, imho, definitive article on Marek's here: http://www.backyardchickens.com/a/the-great-big-giant-mareks-disease-faq

On the other hand, Marek's doesn't tend to spread that quickly and cause overnight collapse. It tends to be a bit slower, lame and limping one day, slowly growing worse, still eating/drinking, then wasting until death or recovery...slowly picking off your flock. Technically, if you believe the statistics, all chickens are Mareks carriers as Mareks is prevelent. It is like having the herpes virus in your body and only producing the cold sore when your immune system is down, which stress can do. Raising chickens with Turkeys can create an immunity to Marek's as Turkeys usually carry the Turkey Mareks which is much, much milder in chickens and often gives immunity to Chicken Mareks (original vaccines were based off the turkey virus)....akin to cow pox protecting humans against small pox. But Mareks is morphing into even more strains such that the industry is having a hard time keeping up with it. And, yes, there is even a super virus now that I think about it, that does move quickly. Hopefully you haven't stumbled onto that! (Let's assume not as that is not prevalent yet).

But you've got birds of all ages affected, quickly. That could be coccidiosis, which can very quickly emmaciate and weaken, and cause collapse overnight (but not one leg forward/one leg back paralysis). Coccidiosis can be brought on by stress as it too is something that is never eradicated from the bird's system, only held in check by a healthy immune system.  Coccidiosis does not have to produce bloody poo to be an issue. It depends on where the protozoa (coccidia) have taken up residence whether or not it gets into the lower track to produce bloody poo.

If they were my birds, I would treat with Sulmet (a sulphur drug) rather than Corid. It is cheaper and it would give you antibiotics against the common gram-negative bacteria in case it is something that has taken hold in the heat.  Follow the directions on the bottle treating full dose 2 days, then half dose 4 days. You often see great improvement by day 2.

And perhaps post a photo of the bird with the leg position. It could be classic Marek's working its way through. Support with ACV, yogurt, Chick Saver in water to boost immune as much as you can and hope for the best. Some birds will succumb to the tumors while others will keep them at bay. It's the way of the disease. Breed from those that survive and thrive as they will have a natural resistance.

I agree the only way to know for certain is to send/take the bird in for a necropsy.

My 2 cents.
LofMc
You mention a "super Virus" do you have any other info I could search? I believe we have Mareks. I realized it after I had 2 with leg/ wing issues but prior to that I had 2 just waste away so I didn't see it.
Thank you
post #19 of 19
This article explains the concept of the Marek's super virus.http://www.pbs.org/newshour/updates/tthis-chicken-vaccine-makes-virus-dangerous/

The idea is that traditionally when Marek's invades a flock, those nonresistant take ill and die which also kills off the virus (albeit doesn't discuss how the virus still lives in the soil on dander) but yet those hosts vulnerable to it are dead and no longer reproducing the virus.

With the advent of the Marek's vaccine, you now have birds living though they carry the Marek's virus and are replicating it. Remember the vaccine is imperfect "leaky" type as it does not stop the virus advancing, it just retards the tumor growth in the host affected.

The concern, and evidence, is pointing to the growth now of a super virus that is so virulent that it takes vaccinated birds and traditionally resistant birds very quickly.

Because of this concern, many in the industry are no longer vaccinating against it but breeding for natural resistance to the "natural" Marek's virus.

Research and theories are still emerging on this disease, so I take this article and others of its ilk as highly informative but not definitive as theories may change as well as responses.

LofMc
Keeper of 15+ layers, common to specialty types for colorful egg baskets. Brooding Queens: The Queen Mum Silkie and 2 Bantam Cochin handmaids. Preparing to breed my own Olive Eggers! Barnevelder roo with Splash Marans and CL for egg color and color coding :D Former 4H leader, GDB Puppy Raiser, Homeschooler. Current ESL tutor. Proud new grandma. Loving wife to a very tolerant husband.
Reply
Keeper of 15+ layers, common to specialty types for colorful egg baskets. Brooding Queens: The Queen Mum Silkie and 2 Bantam Cochin handmaids. Preparing to breed my own Olive Eggers! Barnevelder roo with Splash Marans and CL for egg color and color coding :D Former 4H leader, GDB Puppy Raiser, Homeschooler. Current ESL tutor. Proud new grandma. Loving wife to a very tolerant husband.
Reply
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