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Should I change to medicated feed?

post #1 of 8
Thread Starter 
So the barn I got my chicks from has a way of preventing coccidiosis besides medicated feed, they have you give half a dose of amprolium in the water once a week(along with feeding their blend of chick starter feed).. I read somewhere that antibiotics can cause vitamin deficiency and one of my chicks currently seems to be having problems similar to vitamin B2 deficiency. Their water has probiotic/vitamins in it right now, I've been giving a little extra to the problem chick with only mild improvement. They want you to do the treatment on Monday and I'm debating on if this is a good thing for her right now? I don't want to make her worse ;(

The only option right now seems to be to get medicated feed, I dunno what a good brand would be, if switching thir feed would stress them a lot (they really pick through their feed now anyway), they are about a week and a half old. I posted in another forum but I think I might drove out to the feed store now anyway...

(I also wonder what do do with old feed)
post #2 of 8

Amprolium isn't an antibiotic.

It is however, a thiamine blocker so not recommended long term and should be followed up after treatment with b vitamins.

 

Treating for coccidiosis isn't really necessary. I've been raising chicks a long time and have only used medicated feed once and only given amprolium once.

The trick is to keep the bedding bone dry so coddicia can't complete their life cycle and keeping feeders at least half full to limit the amount of pecking in litter.

 

I'd feed out what you have. Feed can be stored in refrigeration but it's best not to feed old feed.

NPIP 43-813

“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts.

Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime.”                  Mark Twain

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NPIP 43-813

“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts.

Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime.”                  Mark Twain

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post #3 of 8
Thread Starter 
Yes I guess I was confused about that, is having thiamine deficiency similar to riboflavin deficiency? She's hock sitting/scooting despite being able to walk, she's very alert but a bit lazy and perches on a dowel 80% of the time... I'm gonna also try to find the supplement while I'm there, I hope it helps her ;(
post #4 of 8
People do all kinds of strange things to “help” their chickens, our chickens usually survive and often thrive in spite of it. I have no idea what kind of dosage half a dose once a week works out to be or how much of that mixture they are actually drinking. I assume you are using Corid to get the Amprolium. The dosage in Corid is meant to be a treatment, not a preventative, but at that dosage and way of giving it I have no idea what effect it might have, probably not much. The amount of Amprolium in medicated feed is specifically designed to be a preventative, not a treatment.

Amprolium is not an antibiotic. It is a Thiamine blocker, intended to help reduce the reproduction rate of the protozoa that causes Coccidiosis to a level that allows the chick to develop immunity if that protozoa is present. It does not destroy any probiotics in their system the way an antibiotic would. If that protozoa is not present, it does no good at all.

A little bit on the life cycle of the protozoa may be helpful. The bug lives in the chicken’s digestive system. It reproduces by oocysts that eventually develop into new bugs, sort of like eggs that hatch. It’s not the right terminology but I’ll us use it anyway, I think it’s easier to understand. That bug thrives in wet manure-rich soils, especially warm soils. People on the Gulf Coast are much more at risk than someone in the upper Midwest but it can still show up anywhere. After about two days in warm wet manure-rich soil the egg has developed enough that it will hatch if the chicken eats it.

The problem is not that a few are present, that just lets them build immunity. The problem is when those numbers get out of hand, then it can become deadly. Since it thrives in wet conditions, keeping your brooder, coop, or run dry is usually enough to keep it under control but some strains are stronger than others. You still have to watch for symptoms, whether you feed medicated feed or not or keep your brooder dry or not. Another important preventative is keep the water clean. That bug can thrive in poopy water too.

I do not feed medicated feed, although I know that bug is in my flock. I keep the brooder dry and the water fresh. To introduce the protozoa and keep it present so they can develop immunity I feed them some dirt from my run every few days.

One very common occurrence on this forum is that people that do not understand the life cycle of that bug or even how Amprolium works will feed medicated feed while the chicks are in a sterile brooder and never come into contact with that bug so they can develop immunity. They stop feeding medicated feed when the chicks leave the brooder and hit the ground, coming into contact with that bug. The chicks get sick and people complain about how medicated feed does not work.

If it were me I’d stop putting that stuff in the water. Your circumstances and set-up are different than mine, but I’d feed the regular feed and just watch for problems. The Corid is handy if you see symptoms of Coccidiosis. You can switch to medicated feed if you wish, they will handle the switch to a different feed and save the starter until later. They can eat that non-medicated feed later without harm, just store it in a relatively cool dry place. The freezer would be optimum, but just cool and dry works as long as you don’t wait for several months. It does lose some nutrients the longer it is stored but cool and dry helps it last a lot longer.

When you come to a fork in the road, take it.

 

"If you make every game a life-and-death proposition, you're going to have problems. For one thing, you'll be dead a lot." — former North Carolina coach Dean Smith

 

http://www.backyardchickens.com/a/how-much-room-do-chickens-need

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When you come to a fork in the road, take it.

 

"If you make every game a life-and-death proposition, you're going to have problems. For one thing, you'll be dead a lot." — former North Carolina coach Dean Smith

 

http://www.backyardchickens.com/a/how-much-room-do-chickens-need

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post #5 of 8
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ridgerunner View Post
...
One very common occurrence on this forum is that people that do not understand the life cycle of that bug or even how Amprolium works will feed medicated feed while the chicks are in a sterile brooder and never come into contact with that bug so they can develop immunity. They stop feeding medicated feed when the chicks leave the brooder and hit the ground, coming into contact with that bug. ...
...

 

Oh how true.

 

Following the advice of the feed store employees can get one into trouble as well.

NPIP 43-813

“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts.

Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime.”                  Mark Twain

Reply

NPIP 43-813

“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts.

Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime.”                  Mark Twain

Reply
post #6 of 8
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChickenCanoe View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ridgerunner View Post

...

One very common occurrence on this forum is that people that do not understand the life cycle of that bug or even how Amprolium works will feed medicated feed while the chicks are in a sterile brooder and never come into contact with that bug so they can develop immunity. They stop feeding medicated feed when the chicks leave the brooder and hit the ground, coming into contact with that bug. ...

...

Oh how true.

Following the advice of the feed store employees can get one into trouble as well.

I really appreciate you taking the time to explain that to me Ridgerunner, although I'm still unsure how to proceed although you make it sound like there isn't a right way.

I never had a scare of cocci with the grown hens, we live in a rather damp /humid and cold place, their run is pretty muddy right now and I sometimes worry their coop isn't dry enough, but they seem relatively healthy?

Could the medicine still affect her after a week? How do I distinguish a genetic disorder over vitamin deficiency?
post #7 of 8
Don’t look at is as looking for the right way. There isn’t just one right way for everyone. Look at it more that there is not a wrong way, both ways can be right. That’s part of the problem, you have too many options.

I don’t know how you tell whether that is a vitamin deficiency, a hereditary problem, or something else entirely. If she is spending her time scrunched up, fluffed up, and looking miserable, that could even be Coccidiosis where you should start giving her Corid as a treatment. You might talk to a vet and see what it would cost to get a stool sample analyzed to see if it is worms or Coccidiosis.

When you come to a fork in the road, take it.

 

"If you make every game a life-and-death proposition, you're going to have problems. For one thing, you'll be dead a lot." — former North Carolina coach Dean Smith

 

http://www.backyardchickens.com/a/how-much-room-do-chickens-need

Reply

When you come to a fork in the road, take it.

 

"If you make every game a life-and-death proposition, you're going to have problems. For one thing, you'll be dead a lot." — former North Carolina coach Dean Smith

 

http://www.backyardchickens.com/a/how-much-room-do-chickens-need

Reply
post #8 of 8
Thread Starter 
She perches a lot but not fluffed up, she has periods of disinterest followed by periods of activity. Her poops tend to look normal or slimey. I see some red specks in their poop but I don't think it's blood? It stays bright red the whole time?
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