Difference Between Blue and Self Blue

I Love Layers said:

I've recently started raising Cochins, so I purchased my first pair last weekend. I bought a Blue Hen, and a blue frizzle rooster.
So lately I've been trying to find some breeders who have Blue Cochins, while looking I saw Blue and Self Blue.

I'm very confused by the difference and am hoping that someone can help me understand this

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Wappoke said:

Blue and self blue can be considered the same plumage color. Most often when breeders refer to blue ( also andalusian blue) they are talking about the phenotype produced by the blue gene. This gene is incompletely dominant so if a bird carries one blue gene the bird is a diluted black color or blue. A single blue gene dilutes a genetically black chicken to a blue color. If a bird carries 2 blue genes then the black plumage is diluted to a splash plumage- a light gray to white plumage that has splashes of blue/dark blue.
Incorrect. Blue and Self blue are not even close to the same plumage color. They are two different genes, and are completely unrelated.
Self blue refers to a chicken that has blue plumage that covers the entire body with no other colors in the plumage. Self blue many times refers to birds that are lavender. Lavender is a recessive gene; two lavender genes will dilute a genetically black chicken to a uniform blue color.
Self blue/Lavender not only dilutes black, it also dilutes red/gold coloring.
Most often when breeders refer to self blue they are talking about a lavender chicken and not a blue chicken, Chickens that carry one blue gene can also carry other genes that produce other plumage colors or secondary plumage colors- blue laced red is an example of a secondary plumage color- this is a red/gold chicken with a single blue lace on a feather. This bird carries blue but is not self blue because of the red.
The bird is considered blue and not self blue, because of it's genetics. If it was the lavender/self blue genes modifying the black, the red would also be diluted.
Lavender can also be used in making secondary color patterns. Birds that are laced and carry lavender are referred to as violet laced. Even though the violet laced bird carries two lavender genes the buff or silver found in the bird disqualifies the birds from being a self blue.
Violet Laced birds are Silver Laced with the Blue gene, not the lavender/self blue. The lavender/self blue lacing is commonly call Lilac laced. Color patterns that use Lavender/self blue include Coronation, Isabella, and Porcelain Mille Fleur.

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junebuggena said:

This post deals with the difference between blue and self blue. I did not see a reason to get into expression differences between blue and lavender.

Considering that self-blue and Lavender are the same gene, it is entirely appropriate. The effect the self blue/lavender has on coloring, other than black is a key feature of the gene; and one thing that sets it apart from the Blue gene.

And while Blue and Self blue both produce grey birds, they are very different. Blues are not a uniform color, even if they don't have the proper edging. The head is usually darker, and the color gets a bit lighter towards the back end of the bird. Blues can range in shade from deep charcoal to a light smokey color. And Splash can be so pale the look white, with flecks of darker greys throughout. Lavender/Self Blue is the same shade of pale grey all over. They do not look the same at all. The difference may be subtle, but to a practiced eye, it's obvious.

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junebuggena said:

That doesn't stop the APA from using it as a label for varieties. They don't recognize the term Lavender at all. They use the term self blue. From a genetics stand point, they are the same gene.

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