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Ameraucana thread for posting pictures and discussing our birds - Page 1277

post #12761 of 24919
Quote:
Originally Posted by draye 
Quote:
Originally Posted by just2rosey 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BarnGoddess01 

I can only hope that eventually we'll get to the point that ALL our Ameraucanas will lay as well as the Happy lavs and EEs!

I've got my incubator full - I'm doing my part in trying .... wink


Ok, so I am new to poultry breeding, and I have my own ideas about how I want to approach it, so prepare to shoot me!   hide       Several conversations along this line have helped shape my thinking.  I grew up in a rural area and with the thinking that all farm animals had to pull their weight or they were culled, and I still believe this.  It is common knowledge that production and fertility tend to be lower in many show quality lines in many breeds.  It is also a well documented fact that inbreeding/linebreeding is behind this trend.  By crossing two unrelated purebred lines of the same breed one can get the same hybrid vigor that is seen in mutts according to the the authors of "The Mating and Breeding of Poultry" .  I understand that by line breeding one concentrates the desired phenotype genes and achieves a more consistent 'type' of bird through out the flock.  But in our quest for perfecting the type we are losing what I feel are the most important things: production and vigor.  I myself would rather see a bit of variety of type and maintain the production and vigor.  So I plan on doing more careful outbreeding and minimize the linebreeding.  I know many of the experienced show breeders will disagree with my plan, but what is the point of having the most perfect looking bird if it  can't do its job?  hu  I can't afford a flock of freeloading chickens, I expect them to pay for themselves, or they are off to freezer camp.   

I see many trends in breeding show birds that don't make sense to me like breeding silkies to have such a big top knot that they can't find food and water when turned out in a large area, and breeding them to have a hole in the skull that the brain protrudes through.  sickbyc  This makes as much sense as it did breeding huge bodied quarter horses to have tiny feet for halter classes which gave us generations of navicular disease in horses.   I also know that many people are practicing AI in breeds like Cochins with a lot of fluff.  Does it make sense to breed them to be sooo fluffy that the can't procreate without human intervention? I don't think so.  ( My daughter is also raising bantam cochins for 4H, and we don't plan to pratice AI).    I just think we, the human breed, need to rethink our priorities and be careful about the long range effects of our choices are on the creatures we love.  Sorry this is a rant, I love a friendly debate, and I won't be offended if lots of people disagree with me.    wink  In fact I expect several will, but these thoughts have been bouncing around in my head for months and this topic is the perfect time to express them.    frow


Amen!


I'm new to chickens but I used to breed and show Pekingese. I feel exactly the same way you do. It's really sad how many faults Pekes have now. I have two Pekes now from a breeder in the Birmingham area and they have more problems than any Peke I ever had over the 25 years I showed. Thank you for posting the way you feel.

Home to all hens: 4 RIR/Ameraucanas, five Buff Orpingtons, one Ameraucana, two New Hampshires; also two Pekingese, 16 cats (10 need homes), & 1 parakeet.

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Home to all hens: 4 RIR/Ameraucanas, five Buff Orpingtons, one Ameraucana, two New Hampshires; also two Pekingese, 16 cats (10 need homes), & 1 parakeet.

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post #12762 of 24919
Quote:
Originally Posted by just2rosey 
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyMtn 

Oh I know where you are coming from. I have pondered many, many times about giving up on the wheatens completely. I spend all year feeding and cleaning up after these chickens that only produce 2 months out of 12? Its sooo frustrating, BUT I have also put so much time and money into them....I am giving them til February. If they don't improve (young ones should be laying soon) then I will take the few that do lay well and use them for making splits with my buffs. Certainly don't want to pass on the low-productivity genes.


So just a thought HappyMTN, why not try to introduce some new blood into the wheatons you have? Buy a roo or hatch some eggs from a breeder whose lines you haven't used before that have good qualities you would like to see in your flock.  You could improve the weaknesses and give your vigor and production a jump start at the same time?  I don't think you need to give up on them, just freshen up your genetic pool so to speak.  smile


I don't think you could get any more diverse wheatens than my birds. I have stock from everybody and their sister. The ones that produce the best have either been clean faced or lay white eggs. Murphy's law!


Edited by Goose and Fig - 11/1/11 at 11:39am
The secret of happiness, you see, is not found in seeking more, but in developing the capacity to enjoy less
-Socrates
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The secret of happiness, you see, is not found in seeking more, but in developing the capacity to enjoy less
-Socrates
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post #12763 of 24919

Nice birds! I just hatched 10 BBS Bantam Ameraucans. They are so sweet! And have 10 more eggs in the bator. I also have 12 LF Ameraucans eggs in the bator. Hoping for a good hatch!

100% Imported Orpingtons

Large Fowl: Pure Black, Blue, Black, Splash, Chocolate and Mauve

p>

 

Also have corgis, quarter horses, one super understanding husband and an amazing little girl!

 

Check out my facebook page for current listings and pictures of my breeders:

http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.498000483563488.125216.497976186899251&type=1#!/pages/Blue-Rein-Poultry/497976186899251



w...
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100% Imported Orpingtons

Large Fowl: Pure Black, Blue, Black, Splash, Chocolate and Mauve

p>

 

Also have corgis, quarter horses, one super understanding husband and an amazing little girl!

 

Check out my facebook page for current listings and pictures of my breeders:

http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.498000483563488.125216.497976186899251&type=1#!/pages/Blue-Rein-Poultry/497976186899251



w...
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post #12764 of 24919
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyMtn 

Oh I know where you are coming from. I have pondered many, many times about giving up on the wheatens completely. I spend all year feeding and cleaning up after these chickens that only produce 2 months out of 12? Its sooo frustrating, BUT I have also put so much time and money into them....I am giving them til February. If they don't improve (young ones should be laying soon) then I will take the few that do lay well and use them for making splits with my buffs. Certainly don't want to pass on the low-productivity genes.


Just2Rosey has a point but the two do not have to be mutually exclusive.  It's a matter of priorities.  HappyMtn, I had your problem a couple of years ago.  You don't have to make splits with your buffs.  I would submit there are some better alternatives.  For example, I was having several lines that were giving me birds that would not give me an egg for six months or more.  I also had one line that had two hens left in it.  These two hens would give me 5 eggs/week on a regular basis BUT one hen's egg was white and the other hen's egg was almost white.  Nonetheless, egg productivity became a priority for me so I bred those birds.  There were some other things going on that I was working on (like getting rid of any brown egg genes) simultaneously but it would make this a VERY long post to go into them all so suffice it to say that I wound up with a couple of lines that produced white eggs.  However, blue is dominant so I know I can get that back in a few years.

Another viable option that I would recommend is going outside your flock to another breeder who your birds came from.  Most WBS Ameraucanas can be traced back to Wayne Meredith.  From there Barb Cambell and Paul Smith would be two other good choices.  Talk to them and tell them you'd like eggs/chicks from whatever lines produce the most eggs for them.

You may be a much better breeder than me but, personally, I would not be making any splits.  I do line breed and at times I have even inbred - all with what I think are good results.  For those who get the Poultry Press and are familiar with the articles by Kenny Troiano from his book, my methodology follows his pretty closely.  I am not quite down to just two lines yet with an A & B subline to each of my primary lines but I hope to be in a few more years.  I do hope to one day be able to pick a male and female and know with a pretty good degree of certainty what the offspring will look like.  There's just no way to do that by outcrossing to a new breed or variety.

So let me end where I started.  I don't believe that producing APA SOP SQ birds is mutually exclusive from producing healthy, vigorous, and productive birds.  Granted, I will give you that there are some breeds such as some of the Exhibition breeds and others like, for the sake of an example Modern Games that I don't personally see a lot of use for and in those cases, other than procreation who really cares if they lay an egg?  But other than that I believe both can be done.

In closing, let me strongly encourage you Happy as much as I can to NOT give up on the WBS Ameraucanas.  They are afterall the best variety of Ameraucanas going!  We need serious breeders to continue to work on them.

God Bless,

post #12765 of 24919

I have 2 ameracuana hens I just got from Ivywoods that are about 7 months old. One is lavendar and the other black. droolin How the heck do I tell when these lovely ladies are going to start laying??? There aren't any wattles, etc. to judge by.  idunno  Just wait for the squat???

Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought. JFK     Home to a reluctant but willing DH, 1 fat black lab, 1 beagle x, 4 rsl, 6 bsl, 6 Delaware x Hampshire (Indian Rivers), 2 Ameracuana hens (1 blk., 1 lav.), 1 blk Am. roo, 1 bcm roo, and 1 mutt banty roo.  Obviously hoping for some oliver eggers
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Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought. JFK     Home to a reluctant but willing DH, 1 fat black lab, 1 beagle x, 4 rsl, 6 bsl, 6 Delaware x Hampshire (Indian Rivers), 2 Ameracuana hens (1 blk., 1 lav.), 1 blk Am. roo, 1 bcm roo, and 1 mutt banty roo.  Obviously hoping for some oliver eggers
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post #12766 of 24919

So, I have found a good home for "him", BUT before I send him on his way.......would like your opinions (again) so I don't make a mistake!
A boy?  13 weeks old.
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a25/lauriegerst/IMG_1264.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a25/lauriegerst/IMG_1257.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a25/lauriegerst/IMG_1259.jpg

I'm one bad relationship away from becoming the "Crazy Chicken Lady".
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I'm one bad relationship away from becoming the "Crazy Chicken Lady".
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post #12767 of 24919
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerry2011 

I have 2 ameracuana hens I just got from Ivywoods that are about 7 months old. One is lavendar and the other black. droolin How the heck do I tell when these lovely ladies are going to start laying??? There aren't any wattles, etc. to judge by.  idunno  Just wait for the squat???


Pick the gals up and turn them upside down with their legs facing away from you.  Find the vent and then come back toward you about 3/4 of an inch.  Feel for the two pelvic bones.  If you can only get one finger between them, they're not close.  Almost two, they're getting close.  Two or more, they should be laying now.

God Bless,

post #12768 of 24919
Quote:
Originally Posted by nincomcoop 

So, I have found a good home for "him", BUT before I send him on his way.......would like your opinions (again) so I don't make a mistake!
A boy?  13 weeks old.
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a25/lauriegerst/IMG_1264.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a25/lauriegerst/IMG_1257.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a25/lauriegerst/IMG_1259.jpg


Boy.

~Aspen

Breeding:

 

 

~ Seramas ~ Bantam Splash Cochins ~ LF Coronation & Light Sussex ~

 

~ White & Colored Sebastopols ~ American Buffs ~

 

 ~ Muscovys ~ Calls ~

 

~ Peafowl ~~ Lavender & Slate Turkeys ~

 

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Breeding:

 

 

~ Seramas ~ Bantam Splash Cochins ~ LF Coronation & Light Sussex ~

 

~ White & Colored Sebastopols ~ American Buffs ~

 

 ~ Muscovys ~ Calls ~

 

~ Peafowl ~~ Lavender & Slate Turkeys ~

 

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post #12769 of 24919

Mine are commnig in the mail from Peachick!  I cant wait!  I Just know they are going to be awesomly beautiful! big_smile  I'll have to post some pics when they get here!

post #12770 of 24919

I got Reserve Variety for my silver pullet and on my buff pullet!!! wee

Jean
President of the Ameraucana Breeders Club/UOC Member - Disclaimer:  "Not all opinions made by me are the opinions of the ABC"

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Jean
President of the Ameraucana Breeders Club/UOC Member - Disclaimer:  "Not all opinions made by me are the opinions of the ABC"

 

 

 

 

 

 

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