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Sebaceous adenoma help in old dogs

post #1 of 11
Thread Starter 

Our latest foster had a return trip to the vet today to recheck about 6 or 7 'things', one of which is growing horns this week.  He called them sebaceous adenomas, and called them aggressive.  On the 15th they will all be removed, which isn't normally done, and the one with horns is being sent in with a rush biopsy request.  They will also be lancing open several impacted 'ducts' to see if there are more adenomas causing them, up until today we thought they were pustules and had been draining them when they filled.
I know a decent amount of vet language and am fairly versed in what is normally done, what not to worry over, and what needs to be dealt with ASAP.  But I've NEVER dealt sebaceous adenomas nor have I ever heard of aggressive ones.  With the rush on the biopsy I'm assuming he thinks there's a possibility of it being a malignant form.  We talked over long term treatment for this issue and I'm aware that they will make an appearance again due to her skin but have been told to keep the oil out of her coat as much as possible.
This is a basset hound, 11 years old.  Most skin issues I've dealt with on bassets are yeast infections or seborrhea and require Selsun Blue or Nizoral AD to get the yeast under control.  Have one right now who has been enduring weekly baths for almost a year and his skin has finally recovered.  Vet recommend T-Gel twice a week until we can get her skin back into the right condition and then once a week after that for maintenance.

Anyone else dealt with sebaceous adenomas??  What do I need to watch out for?  Still going to research the heck out of this but wanting more practical hands on insight.

And before it comes up..... the bathing with these shampoos is being recommended by our vet who has many basset clients, he uses what works the best for these conditions in his experience.  On this in particular I trust him because it backs up my research and I've seen results.

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post #2 of 11

I don't know anything about it, but good luck.

In every fat person there may be a skinny one screaming to get out, but in every skinny person there is a fat one screaming to be fed!
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In every fat person there may be a skinny one screaming to get out, but in every skinny person there is a fat one screaming to be fed!
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post #3 of 11

In humans adenomas are aggressive cancers, more so than carcinomas. Sebaceous simply means it is growing from an oil gland in the skin (I'm pretty sure). My sister had a sebaceous carcinoma of the vaginal area membrane. It was successfully treated, but she later died of an adenoma. They are very aggressive.  Good luck.

mekasmom
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mekasmom
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post #4 of 11
Thread Starter 

From what I've pulled out of the manuals so far we won't know for sure exactly what type it actually is until we get the biopsy back, so treatment options are minimal at this point.  Hoping these aren't adenocarcinomas.  That would be devastating for her especially since she has so many.  fl that these are the benign form of this!!

Gah..... this is the hardest part about rescue.  No knowing and fearing the worst.

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post #5 of 11

Have you considered that she may have ended up in the "system" because her owners wouldn't make the decision to euthanize.  Sometimes very ill dogs are surrendered because their owners just do not have the heart to put them down. They pass them off to the pound hoping against hope that the system will treat them and find some miracle.

mekasmom
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post #6 of 11
Thread Starter 

Actually I've already spoken with her previous vet, so has my vet.  He wasn't aware of the adenomas either.  He did see the lump on her head in October at her check up but since it wasn't bothering her and looked fine at the time he applied a wait and see tactic.  Which for lumps is pretty normal.  She had great vet care for the last 11 years and her previous vet clinic wants to know the outcome as much as we do, they really liked her. 

This is one of those convoluted rescues that started with an ad on CL.  A foster person for a rescue up in the Dallas area saw the ad and offered to help with placing her, offered her a coveted spot in the rescue.  The owner refused and a month later, even with repeated contacts from my rescue and the one who found her originally, the kill shelter local to the other rescue called them with an owner surrender.  Same girl, we had pics to verify, she answered to the same name among other little things.  At this point most OS go straight back to euthanasia because there is just not enough room at these shelters out here any more.  The intake person detoured standard procedure and made a phone call, she was really upset that someone would drop off an 11 year old with all their records and having just seen the vet for shots and a check up.  The spot at the rescue had been filled already so I was called and 3 days later I drove 5 hours round trip to bring her here.  I only take senior or blind bassets and only one or 2 at a time so she was lucky 2 of ours were being adopted out.  She is an absolute angel, well behaved, biggest basset I've ever seen but she still deserves at least a chance and that's what we'll give her big_smile

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post #7 of 11
Thread Starter 

Well... she had surgery on the 15th and came home looking like frank-en-basset, she had 8 'things' removed and the vet was concerned enough to send them all out for biopsy due to how big they were and how developed.

Post surgery pics if you can stomach it:

Massive removed growth on her head, it was a bit more developed under
the skin and had a blood supply, it was sent for biopsy
http://krausdesigns.com/images/Dogs/DSCF4657a.JPG
Really hard marble sized 'thing' removed from leg, sent for biopsy, vet
thinks it could possibly be a pilomatricoma like our Gus gets, we didn't know it was there
until he had her sedated and felt her up.
http://krausdesigns.com/images/Dogs/DSCF4658a.JPG
Ear pustule removed, Timothy was glad that wasn't his ear
http://krausdesigns.com/images/Dogs/DSCF4659a.JPG
Massive pustule removed on right sent for biopsy, 2 more questionable
spots removed in the middle of her back, Onyx is double checking the
staple placement.
http://krausdesigns.com/images/Dogs/DSCF4660a.JPG
Butt cheek pustule removed, glued, not as big or as deep as we thought
http://krausdesigns.com/images/Dogs/DSCF4661a.JPG
Chest, massive thing removed that wouldn't heal
http://krausdesigns.com/images/Dogs/DSCF4662a.JPG

And the results, just got them about a half hour ago:
ALL BENIGN!!!!!!!!!!! But they may reoccur on occasion.
Sebaceous adenomas and trichoepitheliomas (these had erupted and were the ones bleeding on her head, chest, and the 2 on her back, the leg had not erupted yet, the rest were the adenomas).

Just like our Gus, if these come up again they have to be looked at to make sure they haven't become malignant. Constant bleeding is normally the sign of something going bad so it's really good that we caught this in time.

The trichoepitheliomas.... it's common in bassets:
http://www.merckveterinarymanual.com/mvm/index.jsp?cfile=htm/bc/72207.htm

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A few of everything and B/B/S Silkies 
I tend to kill threads, even when I post pics of day old fuzzy butts.
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More about "The Herd":  www.krausdesigns.com   http://strayneedle.blogspot.com/
A few of everything and B/B/S Silkies 
I tend to kill threads, even when I post pics of day old fuzzy butts.
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post #8 of 11

I'm glad she has a home with you.  We were contacted by a Bassett rescue tonight, and turned down.  Having 44 wooded acres, and the fact that we keep our dogs loose when we're outside aren't considered conducive to good Bassett keeping.  sad


Edited by Equus5O - 12/18/09 at 6:30pm
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Pride                             
Integrity                         
Guts                               It's a thin blue line between us and them.
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post #9 of 11
Thread Starter 

Huh???  That's the PERFECT kind of place!  At least it is for my rescue!  I've placed bassets on 200 acre ranches.  Try a different rescue!  Seriously, look at one of the rescues in NC, transport can be arranged and they are overflowing. 
If you want, pm or email me and I can get you in touch with a few people I know on the east coast that are basset rescues.

More about "The Herd":  www.krausdesigns.com   http://strayneedle.blogspot.com/
A few of everything and B/B/S Silkies 
I tend to kill threads, even when I post pics of day old fuzzy butts.
Reply
More about "The Herd":  www.krausdesigns.com   http://strayneedle.blogspot.com/
A few of everything and B/B/S Silkies 
I tend to kill threads, even when I post pics of day old fuzzy butts.
Reply
post #10 of 11

My Cockapoo has many of these sebaceous adenoma's. He is almost 13 years old. I am a holistic medical doctor. My comment on your case is that vets (like many MD"s) sell fear to vulnerable patients to enhance the bottom line. Your dog is older. When tests are recommended, always ask "what difference are the results going to make?" What treatment would they have offered, and what treatment could you have afforded if these common and typical lesions were actually found to be malignant? My view is that the vets "concern" was put on, and it resulted in deception and a very large increase in the clinic's income that week. The obvious sebaceous adenoma's should not have been biopsied, and probably should not have been removed either. I plan on trying a homeopathic remedy called Thuja topically on these wart like growths. When my son was about ten he developed a huge wart on one of his fingers. I applied a Thuja ointment and watched with great interest and amazement as the wart grew, matured, and then just fell off!

 

Don't expect your vet to affirm this idea, or most any approach that invlves nutritional or homeopathic (alternative ) therapies. Another example of their attitude from another blog which I responded to is pasted in below. Enjoy:

 

" Lenticular sclerosis (cloudy eyes, looks like catarracts) is a normal age-related change in the canine eye," explains Jeff Wayman, DVM, of Belton, Missouri.

 

My response:

Amazing how veterinary (like human) health professionals have such big blind spots resulting from inadequate understanding of nutrition, and lack of open mindedness to tools outside of their own (small) toolboxes. This quoted vet thinks nuclear sclerosis is a "normal" age related finding that should just be left alone. No doubt this is because of his inadequate education, and arrogant clinical closed-mindedness. Case in point is the use of vitamin C. This vet and most others would say dogs don't need supplementation because their bodies can make it on their own. Really? Don't they realize that aging and other physiological stressors can increase the need for vitamin C beyond the dog's abilities to synthesize it, and/or that aging may reduce the amount produced? For example, I noticed clouding of the lenses of my 12 year old Cockapoo's (Sneakers) eyes last year, and my Vet made the diagnosis of nuclear sclerosis. The clouding was very obvious and affected both eyes, tho his vison was not impaired that we could tell. The Vet recommended no treatment, no doubt because despite how frequently she sees it, in her mind it is untreatable. I guess when you think you know it all already, you don't bother doing any digging for alternatives. Well over the last 30 days I have been supplementing my dog with approximately 250mg of ascorbic acid powder twice a day. Both eyes are now completely clear. Since nuclear sclerosis is an age related finding, it appears vitamin C can not only slow, but can even reverse at least some of the underlying changes associated with aging. I would assume if it was so effective with the eyes, continuing the supplementation should help with other less visible processes of aging. The docs will ignore this and cry out "spontaneous remission" or "anecdotal evidence". Caring pet owners will give it a try.

 
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