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Vet suggestion for non-invasive bumblefoot cure - Page 14

post #131 of 269

So I have it and I wanted to know where can you buy the fish powder???

Owner of two wonderful geese and 6 hives of bees!
Every good thing given and every perfect gift is from above...
James 1:17
Jesus is the way the truth and the life...
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Owner of two wonderful geese and 6 hives of bees!
Every good thing given and every perfect gift is from above...
James 1:17
Jesus is the way the truth and the life...
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post #132 of 269
Quote:
Originally Posted by noahsgeese 

So I have it and I wanted to know where can you buy the fish powder???


The best price, $20.00 for enough to mix one gallon is  www.koiacres.com
I purchased this from them twice. The first time I paid the extra $4.95 for three day shipping
The second time I didn't pay for fast shipping.
Both times I got it in 3 days.
Good Luck wink

A Hen is only an Egg's way of making another Egg.
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A Hen is only an Egg's way of making another Egg.
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post #133 of 269
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilErvin 
Quote:
Originally Posted by noahsgeese 

So I have it and I wanted to know where can you buy the fish powder???


The best price, $20.00 for enough to mix one gallon is  www.koiacres.com
I purchased this from them twice. The first time I paid the extra $4.95 for three day shipping
The second time I didn't pay for fast shipping.
Both times I got it in 3 days.
Good Luck wink


Thanks!!!    We ordered it already from another source before (I think)!!   Thanks anyways!!!

Owner of two wonderful geese and 6 hives of bees!
Every good thing given and every perfect gift is from above...
James 1:17
Jesus is the way the truth and the life...
Reply
Owner of two wonderful geese and 6 hives of bees!
Every good thing given and every perfect gift is from above...
James 1:17
Jesus is the way the truth and the life...
Reply
post #134 of 269

Tea Tree Oil can be deadly to chickens.
I found out the hard way. It is the fumes from it.

Here is the post.
http://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=257857


Edited by Doug the Chicken Man - 7/6/10 at 7:14am
post #135 of 269

OK I need help here.

I just tried the surgery, I cut open the bumble after numbing it, there was just a small ooze of blood.  I can not find anything to take out of the inside.  It appears to be just a sack/lump of callused skin!  I used triple antibiotic ointment and bandaged her back up.  I really am stumped now.  She won't stand on the foot at all.  Ideas?

post #136 of 269
Quote:
Originally Posted by zenbirder 

I just tried the surgery, I cut open the bumble after numbing it, there was just a small ooze of blood.  I can not find anything to take out of the inside.  It appears to be just a sack/lump of callused skin!  I used triple antibiotic ointment and bandaged her back up.  I really am stumped now.  She won't stand on the foot at all.  Ideas?


Having not done surgery myself, I am no one to help. Have you treated in anyway before? Are you sure there wasn't a small kernel on the inside? It seems it might have been trying to heal itself by enclosing it in callous.
Sorry about the surgery not working out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by schellie69 

I have a question what happens if you notice red streaks going up the leg? We had a chicken this happened to us we made the hard decision to cull her. the soak and surgeries did not work we never found the bumble part. even when they did the dissection they could not find it. the infection was all the way to her knee joint. Her quality of life was suffering this is why we choose to cull her. It still hurts but the 3 vets we talked to did not hold out much hope that antibiotics would really help.


My rooster had red streaks going up the leg-- I think I mention something about that in this thread somewhere.
And he's absolutely fine now. I treated him with Tylan immediately though, but if it stopped that, it didn't do anything else for him afterwards.

Cocosandy's  experiences have been very different from mine with Tricide-Neo. So, newcomers, don't let some of these posts send you into an absolute panic. I've found that on advanced cases with Tricide-Neo, it is fully possible to heal the bird. You do eventually remove the bumble as cocosandy recommends, but only once the foot has swelled down a bit and is loose in the hole a bit. No blood. No pus going everywhere, because it is a dried up kernel with maybe, MAYBE some live infection still in the center. On cases you discover early, you don't have to remove a kernel, the small scab just disappears.
But for goodness sakes, FOLLOW DIRECTIONS. Like I said earlier in a bit of petulance, don't ruin a good thing for the rest of us by trying to skimp on treatments, and if you're cheap, by all means, dig around in your chicken's foot with a sharp instrument, causing them real pain, even if not the same pain as you. Leave the good stuff for the rest of us. Listen to cocosandy , because the threads on bumblefoot surgery have been deleted for the most part.

I'm so glad too that I seem to have fixed the problem that caused the bumblefoot in the first place, and have cured the bumblefoot, as well.

Good luck, all!

INTJ living with 4 Serama, a 16 member rainbow flocks (one each of many breeds), an African Gray, a Green Conure, Cockatiels, Finches, Doves and many non-birds, too!
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INTJ living with 4 Serama, a 16 member rainbow flocks (one each of many breeds), an African Gray, a Green Conure, Cockatiels, Finches, Doves and many non-birds, too!
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post #137 of 269

thumbsup

Thanks a million for posting this.  I have 4 chickens with bumblefoot and need to treat.  I do have one question.  Does anyone know if you can eat the eggs of a chicken with bumblefoot?

Happy mom to two wonderful children, Summer & Logan; wife of 11 years to my adorable husband, Kevin and now new mom to:  Colby, Kevin, Aflac, Big Horn & Jordan.
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Happy mom to two wonderful children, Summer & Logan; wife of 11 years to my adorable husband, Kevin and now new mom to:  Colby, Kevin, Aflac, Big Horn & Jordan.
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post #138 of 269

$20 for a one gallon supply and free shipping

http://www.koiacres.com/Koi-Acres-Products/tricide-neo.html

thought this might help anyone trying to find it!wee

Happy mom to two wonderful children, Summer & Logan; wife of 11 years to my adorable husband, Kevin and now new mom to:  Colby, Kevin, Aflac, Big Horn & Jordan.
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Happy mom to two wonderful children, Summer & Logan; wife of 11 years to my adorable husband, Kevin and now new mom to:  Colby, Kevin, Aflac, Big Horn & Jordan.
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post #139 of 269
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vermontmaple 

thumbsup

Thanks a million for posting this.  I have 4 chickens with bumblefoot and need to treat.  I do have one question.  Does anyone know if you can eat the eggs of a chicken with bumblefoot?


You know to be quite honest I never even thought of not eating the eggs. I only threw them out or cooked them for the chickens. I ate mine and that was last year so hopefully that was ok. But haven't seen anything bad happen.

Good Luck with your treatment! I bought some of the Tricide Neo but haven't used any yet. I have to check out my chickens feet but I thought this is a great alternative to cutting into the foot.

Wife to Tom. Mom to a son and a daughter, 3 cats, 4 dogs. Lost count as to how many chickens I have, close to 50 of various breeds. 4 geese .7 ducks. 4 goats Oliver and Lila, Charlie and Grace.2 turkeys, 4 Bearded Dragons and 2 leopard geckos.   To think my husband was the one who wanted chickens, now I am totally addicted but so very happy.

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Wife to Tom. Mom to a son and a daughter, 3 cats, 4 dogs. Lost count as to how many chickens I have, close to 50 of various breeds. 4 geese .7 ducks. 4 goats Oliver and Lila, Charlie and Grace.2 turkeys, 4 Bearded Dragons and 2 leopard geckos.   To think my husband was the one who wanted chickens, now I am totally addicted but so very happy.

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post #140 of 269

Just to be absolutely clear, Tricide Neo is NOT some super antibiotic of doom. It is  made of three well-known organic compounds that work well in conjunction-- kind of like triple antibiotic ointment. It should be absolutely fine to eat the eggs, etc. There's nothing systemic going on with food soaks.

Lookie here are the Wikipedia for all three ingredients:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tris
A buffering agent-- this is what you accidentally deactivate if you don't use distilled water. It's keeping the PH of the water at the right level for the EDTA to work, and helps the Neomycin as well.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edta
It's a chelating agent, meaning it removes the metals from the bacteria that they need to survive. This is what Epsom salt does for Staph infections, but epsom salt isn't quite as effective.
And finally, good ol' Neomycin, which is actually produced by bacteria to defend itself against other species of bacteria.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neomycin

So you don't need to freak out over it as much as some posters suggest.

In addition, your arsenal should contain Preparation-H, but I just found there are some substantial differences in their formulas. I have been using the Aloe Vera Cream on my chickens, but I think you can use any. The important ingredient is this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phenylephrine
That's
right-- Sudafed!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pramoxine
Pain relief-- not toxic to chickens.

In the regular, instead of using glycerin and white petroleatum, they use mineral oil.  And here was the puzzler for me: only the ointment contains shark liver oil, which definitely has beneficial qualities, but I question the decision to buy and use it, personally. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shark_liver_oil

I
used Ichthammol for a long time, alternating it on days without soaks, and no doubt it helps and works along similar grounds. I think the Prep H is more quick-acting and effective, however.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ichthammol

Finally, I used triple-antibiotic cream, too:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bacitracin
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polymyxin_B
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neomycin

After my soaks, I would put a dab of both the Preparation-H and Triple Antibiotic, and then I would put on Nettie's shoes. I did the soaks right before they would go to bed (they are so calm and tranquil then) and I also knew that no one would be pulling on the shoes or bandages. I think the Trikcide-Neo water getting trapped in the shoes was a great thing, too, creating a damp environment that softened the callus but stopped bacteria growth.
After a few weeks of every other day treatments and shoe-wearing, I was able to just push out the core of the infection, which was mostly dead and black and shriveled. The hole was bigger than the infection by that time, see.

And these were super-advanced cases, for the most part. The oldest girl, the only chicken that I have ever taken in as an adult had a minor bumble between her toes since she arrived-- for two years that I never noticed, and she spread it during the winter when they were cooped up. I see it now in pictures of her from years gone by and laugh to myself.
She gave it the Brabanter, who had no resistance to Staph, and his feet are the ones pictured earlier, and that was after three months of antibiotics (systemic-- Penicillen, Terramycin, and finally, Tylan) and a few Tricide treatments. I first found out about bumblefoot when I put him down after petting him and he fell down! Four months later, it was still petrified and horrible, and then I found this thread. The third, a Marans, only had the beginnings of it, but it would have been bad without treatment.

I never isolated the birds from their flock-- I just kept an eye on the other's feet. But I think the main thing was that I had fixed the bad perch situation. Just a reminder to everyone-- ROUND PERCHES. If your perches are rectangular lumber pieces, this might be where your problem is coming from. Get rid of the cause, and you're half way done. Make sure you don't have scaly feet mites, either, because they make the PERFECT little holes for staph to get into. Again, the older chicken brought it to all of the rest of my chickens, and I finally got rid of it with Ivermectin treatments.

I keep Nettie's shoes on the chickens that were infected at all times because I understand that their skin is still very susceptible to reinfections from the environment after healing, which makes sense.

If you're vigilant and really want for your birds to get better, it can be done. Stick to it, and your birds will thank you. wee

Oh, and remember THIS is what you're fighting:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Staphylococcal_infection

Be aware that your chickens might be showing other signs-- mine were! My Brabanter also had a large carbuncle on his keel-- so look around on their bodies for these.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbuncles
And
I also have a girl with stye in her eye (actually on her Meibomian gland), which is ALSO a staph infection. It might be a permanent cosmic deformity now, though the infection is gone.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stye
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chalazion

And some people might be able to manage the surgery-- good for them. But it is not the only way, and you risk reinfection and laming your chicken if you don't know what you're doing. Being that I've never done minor surgery before, I opted for the 'starve the infection' route. My vet wouldn't do the surgery-- said he was too far advanced, and toes would be lost, no doubt. He gave me Terramycin powder for the flock's water as a consolation, I'm sure. roll
I've definitely brushed up on my biology and chemistry so that I can take care of my chickens. tongue


Edited by Kazzandra - 7/13/10 at 11:47am
INTJ living with 4 Serama, a 16 member rainbow flocks (one each of many breeds), an African Gray, a Green Conure, Cockatiels, Finches, Doves and many non-birds, too!
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INTJ living with 4 Serama, a 16 member rainbow flocks (one each of many breeds), an African Gray, a Green Conure, Cockatiels, Finches, Doves and many non-birds, too!
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