Australorps breed Thread - Page 97

Tiger creek has some nice ones avail chet hupp has some time to time..I got orps at the moment...and welcome aboard..there is a lot of good people trying to work it out here.

Hi from Australia Godsgurl,

                                           welcome to the aussie-loving tribe of our American cousins. It's great that you are concerned with getting good laying birds. Sure they're beautiful and they should have a great temperament, but they're known world-wide for their laying ability. We no longer expect them to compete with modern egg-laying machines but we shouldn't forget that they were the egg-laying machines of their day. The others will know this, but you might be interested in the "Warwick Wonder'. From 4th July to the 15th of December, 1926 this hen created a world record laying 165 eggs in 165 days! She created another record in 1926-7, of 354 eggs in 365 days. Apparently, her progeny were sold to the States! We'd like 'em back as I'd sure like some of that blood in my lines! You're talking to the right people over there, who haven't lost sight of laying qualities. Too many of our show breeders over here seem to have forgotten this and, as we no longer have govt. supervised egg-laying trials as in the old days, it's harder to assess, but they should still lay well. . One old guy told me that the current policy-makers and judges of the Australian Australorp Club should change their name to "The Society for Restoring the Australorp to its Orpington Roots"! Nuff bitchin'. There are still some older breeders who have long given up on the show judges and are trying to maintain the integrity and heritage of the breed and I'll pass on any tips they give me. Every old breeder's got some 'secret formula'

      Sorry for underestimating your Australian knowledge/contacts, other folk here.I can learn a lot from you! Did you happen to see the pic on the Australian forum of a Welsh breeder's aussie champion? He was so proud, and good on him, but what could you say about the bird? Maybe a poor angle but it didn't even look like an aussie to me. It's supposed to be 'the bird of curves' clearly shown in my avatar. How did the standards get so apart? From that pic, you guys are doing great! Just a couple of queries. Apparently, when viewed from above, you shouldn't be able to see the thigh fluff in a good bird. How do your aussies come up on that? Also, over here we sometimes come across problems with drop-tail  in hens. Happen there? Might be a crazy thought, but I was wondering what would happen if you crossed these with some of your roos to see if it improved the tail curve. A bit drastic maybe.

   Cheers  Geoff from Aus

Hi again,

              I said I'd pass on any info. gleaned from some our experienced breeders. I suppose many of your old guys are a bit guarded about their breeding strategies. Some here'd rather give away State secrets! But I've found that as long as you approach them the right way, which varies!, they'll give up some stuff. Many are old, not net-savvy and their 'secrets' and lines will go with them.What I was told today - for comment, not saying it's right. Some is basic and more for beginners like me. Let me know if you don't find any of this stuff interesting or useful.

Breeder 1 - pet hate - "over-fluffy, orpy thighs."

- use hens rather than pullets so you know exactly what you're breeding from

- to change to better configuration, focus more on the hens as their imput is stronger on this

- cull hard

- to produce a strong line, breed uncle to niece and nephew to auntie

- be prepared to bring in new blood to correct faults

- when you're close to what you want, breed roo with individual hens so you can keep track and fine-tune your line

 Cheers  Geoff from Aus

its a secret society here too..kind of whackey..those who are insecure tend to get strange about it, those who are not insecure are pretty cool to deal with..they want whats best for the breed, so they share..not really sure why they fell so far by the wayside here , but many breeds did..people left the farms for the workplace, and let commercial farms feed us..

Howdy All,

I want to be very up front with you about your Australorps.  Most of the folks here on BYC, that raise Australorps, don't know there is a book called the "American Standard of Perfection" and if they did, they probably would'nt want to pay the $70 that it costs to purchase from the American Poultry Association, especially if they just want to know the specifications of just one breed.

So here is the standard from Australia where the Australorps were developed/created and these are the pics of birds that we here in the United States should be pushing for. 

Our backs and tails here in the States are mostly either flat backs or squirrel tails (anything over a 40 degree angle) or both flat-backs and squirrel tails. 

Sure we love our yard-birds, but if you are serious about raising show birds with quality you need to cull out the birds with bad traits and breed the ones with good traits. 

The concept is simple, it is the time and dedication that is frustrating to most . 

That is where you as an Australorp breeder must decide how determined you are to develop "QUALITY" into your flock.

Show Birds or yard birds, it's your call!

Why the Australian Standard for the Australorp?

 Following this standard and paying attention to the pics below, will help you to re-invent your flocks back to the original form that has been so badly misrepresented here in America.

The only main difference between the Australian Standard and the American Standard is the wording (the manner in which we speak) of the same descriptions of the characteristics of the bird.

 One other variation is the number of points or serrations of the comb.  The American Standard requires no less or no more than (5), while the original Australian Standard will accept (4-6) which I believe would be much better for us here in the  United States.  I am open for debate on this subject.

Why would the American Poultry Association change the original Standard, that was developed by the founding fathers who created  this breed?

If anyone has a validated answer, I am very interested in hearing it.

                                                                                          .

Quote:

Originally Posted by groche 

Hi folks,

            sorry to read so much passion mixed with so much frustration. I know nothing of your import regulations, but I have access to Q Aussies/eggs and am happy to assist in any way from this end to help ensure its survival in the States. Personally, I'm more interested in maintaining the purity of the breed than in showing, but,of course, this still requires breeding to the standard. However, I'd hate to see showbench obsession detract from the fact that it was designed as a utility bird and should be a good layer. Someone  a while ago asked how aussies would cope with the heat down south. Australia covers basically the same climatic zones as you folk, but we've got more hot bits. The aussie wouldn't have made it here if it couldn't cope with summer temps. of more than 40 degrees celsius. The climate where I live would be 'Californian'. I'll post some pics of my big boy, Derrick, a gentle, friendly soul, who cost me all of $20. Top SQ might be up to $200.

           

Cheers  Geoff from Aus

Quote:

Originally Posted by groche 

Hi again,

              I said I'd pass on any info. gleaned from some our experienced breeders. I suppose many of your old guys are a bit guarded about their breeding strategies. Some here'd rather give away State secrets! But I've found that as long as you approach them the right way, which varies!, they'll give up some stuff. Many are old, not net-savvy and their 'secrets' and lines will go with them.What I was told today - for comment, not saying it's right. Some is basic and more for beginners like me. Let me know if you don't find any of this stuff interesting or useful.

Breeder 1 - pet hate - "over-fluffy, orpy thighs."

 

- use hens rather than pullets so you know exactly what you're breeding from

- to change to better configuration, focus more on the hens as their imput is stronger on this

- cull hard

- to produce a strong line, breed uncle to niece and nephew to auntie

- be prepared to bring in new blood to correct faults

- when you're close to what you want, breed roo with individual hens so you can keep track and fine-tune your line

 

 Cheers  Geoff from Aus

Thank you Geoff,

you hit it right on the nose, this is exactly what I preach, glad You and I are on the same page! 

  It seems that "Culling" here in the States is a very "MAJOR" emotional ordeal.

Too many folks get attached to the birds that they have raised from cute, fluffy, friendly, little chicks and can't imagine processing them and  putting them in the pot or barbie!

This is where they have to man up or woman up, if they want good breeding stock for the future of quality birds in their flocks.

i beleive the standard should be a reference book here like it is there..it costs too much and there is not a picture of black orpington that you are striving for in it...descriptions are too breif and loosly packed says nothing about true falts that occure such as red webbing is a no no, pony  mane neck or twisted neck feathers.also a fault with examples.....ect...ect...the picture of australorp is from the 1920s or so and has not evolved like other countries..only 1 top breeder has written about his experiences..but no one is detailing how they acheived that , using what birds to improve, ray connor did mention a fault that cropped up in recent years was a sharp V shape underneath birds , he says do not use those for breeding..but i dont think we are that far along with them. as Chet said..try to advance toward their goal..decent stock is painfully hard to find thou..you might have to get creative.

Quote:

Originally Posted by godsgurl377 

Well, I am in michigan and have been a lurker on this site for years, what a wealth of information! However, now that I am finally keeping chickens of my own I took the plunge and joined. My husband and I decided on australorps after doing much research but we didn't want standard hatchery fare. We want nice quality birds but that are still great layers holding true to the australorp breed. I am sure we would have done more differently if we could start over but here's what we have so far... I purchased eggs for hatching (a whole adventure I won't go into!) From someone out in NJ who's stock is from sand hill preservation. From my completely unexperenced eye, the chicks looked good, all the same mostly black with white/yellow on neck/chest/butt, now 5 weeks old and no white on any feathers coming in. I will try to take pics after the storm and see if I can't get them posted somewhere. I also stumbled across a local hatchery specializing in heritage breeds and picked up 8 wing sexed 2 day pullets as we wouldn't have had enough eggs with what we hatched. These new chicks have much more yellow/white down and have white wing tips coming in. When I google australorp chicks many pics come up like them, but I still feel my first stock is better because of the initial coloring. Am I correct in this assumption?
To clarify, I don't plan on showing (though it has crossed my mind), but I want to breed for nice birds and love a challange. My plan is to get a lot of imput from the 'experts' here and hold only the best for breeding next year. I am not afraid to cull either, just want to make sure I keep and cull the right ones. Also, like I said, I am going for great egg production and great looking birds, though I'm sure I can't have the complete best of both! If mine don't lay well enough, I am hoping to get some new chicks from someone who breeds nice australorps who lay well (aveca comes to mind after reading many of his posts). I would then either breed those intothe best of my stock or just start over with those if need be. I am open for lots of instruction and correction along the way and would like my birds to reflect what australorps were origianally bred and loved for. Thanks for reading this Very long post, if you did and I hope to learn a lot from you all in the near future. I will try to post some pics later if I can figure it out. I have to do this all from my phone!

Howdy, you mentioned yellow skin?, keep an eye on that as they mature.  If they maintain yellow skin into adulthood, they are not purebreed Australorps, Jersey Giants most likely.

Good luck and welcome!

Hello from Oregon, I am just curious if you know much about Dunlaps Hatchery in Idaho? They are the second oldest hatchery in the US,started in 1918. They say they have had Australorps from the beginning and have maintained a pure strain. Do you think they have some of the old bloodlines? I have 3 pullets from there right now, but in the future, when my other hens get too old or are culled, I hope to get some good Australorps.

Quote:

Originally Posted by countrybuffs 

Hello from Oregon, I am just curious if you know much about Dunlaps Hatchery in Idaho? They are the second oldest hatchery in the US,started in 1918. They say they have had Australorps from the beginning and have maintained a pure strain. Do you think they have some of the old bloodlines? I have 3 pullets from there right now, but in the future, when my other hens get too old or are culled, I hope to get some good Australorps.

Before buying any birds from anyone, ask them to send pics of males and females they use for breeding pens. If they are confident with their stock and have nothing to hide, they should be happy to send pics.    Take those pics and post them here and we can discuss the pros and cons of these birds.  If they wont take the time out to satisfy a customer, you don't need to be theirs. and more than likely they sell hatchery junk.