Joel Salatin a Snake Oil sales man?

krcote said:

Are you nuts? Efficient farming depends on your circumstances. I live on only 3/4 of an acre in a very suburban area and raised 50 Freedom Rangers in which to feed my family employing his basic ideas. I was able to move the tractor by myself daily to a fresh patch of grass, while protecting the flock inside a tractor made from supplies a already had. How is that not THE most efficient method of farming for me? Zero hype. Super practical. A closed mind is a terrible thing.

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That is a very good summer home brooder for chickens. It is safe and offers the chickens free range capabilities while they are so young. You must admit though that it is not a chicken coop. It is not where your chickens sleep at night (meaning that you have to physically pick up each chicken twice a day) , it is not where your chickens stay in the winter, and it would be much more practical to let these chickens free range on 3/4 acre (once they are grown), rather than to move this "chicken tractor."

The Joe Salatin tractor that I am talking about is quite different from your summer chicken brooder (though it too is a Salatin). His tractor is (at times) miles away (gas is $4.00 a gallon) and is moved every three days, his tractor requires you to "train" the chickens (lol), his tractor has the chickens in the open air, his tractor requires you to take down a moveable fence with battery, and set it all up again every 3 days...

This Sa;atin model works, for a brooder. The Salatin production model is all snake oil...

This is only my opinion. I also believe that Marylin Monroe was a terrible actor, Madonna is a terrible singer, and Scarface is nothing special....
It doesn't matter what people say about Monroe, it doesn't matter how many albums Madonna sells, it doesn't matter how long kids continue to hang Scarface posters on their walls... and it doesn't matter how many people think that Salatins methods are practical... I still have a right to believe that they are all worthless...and you all have a right to continue to be wrong

I know several people that use joels model to raise chickens to eat/sell. I guess some people think that if they have neither the will or knowledge to do something it cant be done. Some of you are crazy as previously stated.

So, 400constantne, you weren't really asking "Is Joel Salatin a Snake Oil Salesman?". Since you obviously have already made up your mind and are not interested in hearing any other opinions, shouldn't you have titled your thread "Joel Salatin is a Snake Oil Salesman"?

Wow--why all the venom?

I've read some of Salatin's books. Not all of his methods would work well for my situation (mostly because of the labor involved); but, as with anything, I use the ideas that will. For me, the moveable pen method works very well for my few ducks and chickens.

Isn't Salatin's point that he's really just a grass farmer? He bought a piece of land that was in poor condition and has been working ever since to be a good steward of that land. His cattle graze a small piece of pasture, then he moves them to the next pasture before they over graze. A few days later, he brings in chickens to feast on the grubs left in the cow pies and as they do, they scatter the manure which fertilizes the pasture. He seems to have a system that is in stark contrast with the "modern" model of farming. It isn't as profitable but, he argues, is sustainable and builds up the grass instead of depleating it.

I first learned of him in the book The Omnivore's Dilemma, by Michael Pollan. I saw him in the film Food Inc., too.

I admire the way he swims against the current. "Snake Oil" is a bit disparaging, isn't it?

Thats exactly what we want to build! How many birds do you put in there? Thanks for posting the picture!

krcote said:

Are you nuts? Efficient farming depends on your circumstances. I live on only 3/4 of an acre in a very suburban area and raised 50 Freedom Rangers in which to feed my family employing his basic ideas. I was able to move the tractor by myself daily to a fresh patch of grass, while protecting the flock inside a tractor made from supplies a already had. How is that not THE most efficient method of farming for me? Zero hype. Super practical. A closed mind is a terrible thing.

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You don't sell many books, or get invited many places to speak if what you're writing or saying doesn't work. It obviously works for him. If you don't like it, or it doesn't work for you, thats different.

I have nothing to say about the subject at hand, however, I DO want to point out that the above statement is absolutely false, which I think everyone will agree if they think about it. Remember Dr. Spock? Or Cesar Milan these days? Getting media coverage and being good enterainment is a FAR CRY from being good at what you do. Milan is a perfect example. He entertains. He dazzles newbies. His dog training is carefully edited and never proved out. He is in hot water with humane groups off and on. He has owners bring cruelty cases against him. You'll find REAL dog trainers who don't have the benefit of Nat Geo backing and who don't stay continually at the "newbie" level have far more talent than someone who "is asked to write" and "asked to speak". And, for the record, I am the author of 3 books, hundreds of articles and a speaker on my subject in 5 countries... and I'm here to still say it can mean nothing.

The OP seems bent out of shape over this guy. It could very well be a case of someone who got "breaks" to get media coverage that doesn't know beans. I don't know. Don't care. A forum is for people to vent their spleen on occassion. So, let 'em and then have your say - its all good!

Going round and round and flaming a person who isn't here to defend himself is just not what BYC is all about.