Livestock guardian dogs

Don't know if anyone has pointed this out yet: Livestock guardians and herding breeds do the job well because they have a strong predatory instinct. Through training and selective breeding, the dogs short circuit the final act of killing their prey. Usually. BUT, in spite of training, there will be an occasional rogue act and they complete the action. Herding is just hunting without killing.

With that being said, this is why there's a trend of using guardian livestock, like donkeys and llamas, and alpacas. They won't eat their charges, but their pretty vicious to intruders.IIncluding strange humans. Here in Florida a few years ago, a couple went horseback riding through a cow field, and were attacked by the donkeys, and ended up in the hospital with pretty serious injuries.

A donkey, llama, or alpaca probably isn't practical in this case, but it does deserve mentioning that any dog large enough to take on a racoon or possum will do the job, but the dog can also decide to have a chicken dinner too.

And then, lastly, the dog can and most likely will sustain injuries from the racoon or possum. Most will be serious enough to require a visit to the veterinarian. And expect a pretty big bill.

So if you're protecting rare birds worth a lot of money, then it's worth it. If not, a $200+ vet bill to protect a $20 bird isn't worth it. There's tons of other ways to protect your stock that will be cheeper in the long run.

And now for the backlash....

HorseSlave said:

........With that being said, this is why there's a trend of using guardian livestock, like donkeys and llamas, and alpacas. They won't eat their charges, but their pretty vicious to intruders........

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Donkeys and llamas, and alpacas can also kill the animals they're meant to protect.
No guard animal is foolproof, you need the right animal - which can be luck of the draw, and with dogs at least you need the right human to train them properly.

aart said:

Donkeys and llamas, and alpacas can also kill the animals they're meant to protect.
No guard animal is foolproof, you need the right animal - which can be luck of the draw, and with dogs at least you need the right human to train them properly.

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a good example of this was the donkey used at my local sheriff's holding farm decided to kick one of the goat kids and killed it on impact. It was a good donkey who has been used for years to protect against coyotes running horses into the fences. After that he became very hostile towards all the horses and goats in with him and had to be removed entirely. It happens unfortunately. Thankfully no owner claimed the goats that came with the kid so they never got flack for it having died that way.

HorseSlave said:

Don't know if anyone has pointed this out yet: Livestock guardians and herding breeds do the job well because they have a strong predatory instinct. Through training and selective breeding, the dogs short circuit the final act of killing their prey. Usually. BUT, in spite of training, there will be an occasional rogue act and they complete the action. Herding is just hunting without killing.

With that being said, this is why there's a trend of using guardian livestock, like donkeys and llamas, and alpacas. They won't eat their charges, but their pretty vicious to intruders.IIncluding strange humans. Here in Florida a few years ago, a couple went horseback riding through a cow field, and were attacked by the donkeys, and ended up in the hospital with pretty serious injuries.

A donkey, llama, or alpaca probably isn't practical in this case, but it does deserve mentioning that any dog large enough to take on a racoon or possum will do the job, but the dog can also decide to have a chicken dinner too.

And then, lastly, the dog can and most likely will sustain injuries from the racoon or possum. Most will be serious enough to require a visit to the veterinarian. And expect a pretty big bill.

So if you're protecting rare birds worth a lot of money, then it's worth it. If not, a $200+ vet bill to protect a $20 bird isn't worth it. There's tons of other ways to protect your stock that will be cheeper in the long run.

And now for the backlash....

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Mmmm...maybe if they have never been around them and then are thrown in there expected to do the job. My LGD will not touch a chicken. In fact, she will not even eat raw chicken that I offer her. WILL NOT TOUCH IT, whether it is raw chicken bone, liver, skin, meat, etc. etc. Cooked chicken is ok. Won't touch raw chicken. Will eat raw beef, pork etc, so it's not an aversion to raw meat. I'm pretty skeptical on a opossum injuring a LGD. Opossums are lucky to walk out of here alive after she gets done shaking and tossing them around. Never once has she received a scratch. I think that's what that thick coat is for. Now, there is an old skunk around this area that has gotten the better of her. Never wounded her, but she has been sprayed on a couple of occasions. She will likely keep her distance from that critter now, but I hope she at least barks at it enough to scare it off.

We handle raccoons and opposums with ease. I personally have taken all sizes of oppossum live by hand wearing only shorts without shoes on. Raccoons are tougher but my male 65 lb hunting dog can take them by himself but he ruins their pelt in the process.

Hi, this is my experience and not at all professional advise. I have a Belgian Malinois who attacked my chickens when they were new. He didn't hurt any of them because he's a Sheppard type dog but scared the hell out of them. The thing with sheep dogs like him is they bite the heals of the sheep so they tend to like to do that with the chickens. But now after a lot of time and time and time....time, he is a great do with them.
He found my 2 chickens today who were attacked by a hawk.
He's really smart, so a dog that is smart and you give time to train around the chickens every day and time is what I think the secret is.
Good luck.
BTW no strays will come around with a Malinois around.

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Mine use the one bite method and have never gotten a scratch on them, they grab the critter and crush and shake it to death and never let go till it is dead, my pit is bred to catch hogs and she ain't got no problem dispatching a 20 pound coon, my cat on the other hand was not so lucky we found her in the pond pretty sure a coon did it.

Mine have had no injuries defending the stock from predators. A local friend's LGDs kill raccoons on a regular basis and have never suffered even a scratch. (I happen to be a veterinarian...most LGDs don't get injured unless it's a larger predator. It's the non-LGDs that take on coons that get hurt)

LGDs are defensive not because of a predatory nature but an increase in MATERNAL instinct. They don't attack just for the fun of it, and most LGDs prefer to not attack but defend with that big rolling bark first, and only if that doesn't deter an attacker do they move in. And yes, they will kill the attacker, but they aren't running around looking for animals to kill. They can patrol and defend that way, but usually that is when you hear them out there barking.

My two. They came up and looked in the sliding glass door.

My non-LGD by breed but hunting dogs (for coons in part) and LGD in function are not harmed either and are easily deployed in a manner where they can actually hunt coon beyond containment area for poultry. It is not just a size issue once dog's experience is taken into account. Dogs interacting with more serious threat for first time, regardless of dog size, are at greatest risk. With our coonhounds, young dogs going into fray with coon shot out of tree are released singly so dog can be more tentative in approach on a weakened foe. With a little experience racked up even a smallish dog can whip an intact adult coon with minimal risk of injury so long as fight is clear of water and tight locations restricting dogs ability to maneuver. Do not pit you true LGD against a healthy coon in water, otherwise be prepared to get a new LGD as replacement owing to being ruined if not drowned.