Ameraucana thread for posting pictures and discussing our birds

[kian]

I am really sorry. I am still trying to get caught up on this thread. I just don't want to sound ignorant when discussing my birds.

 

[kian]

Pips and Peeps: that is very interesting! They did come from the same place. I have no idea how many breeding pairs he has or anything like that. May I ask why they would both be EEs? I don't mean to be a bother, I just want to learn. Thank you for taking the time!

 

[dak]

Pips and Peeps: that is very interesting! They did come from the same place. I have no idea how many breeding pairs he has or anything like that. May I ask why they would both be EEs? I don't mean to be a bother, I just want to learn. Thank you for taking the time!

The yellow skin color that turns a slate leg to a green leg can be carried recessively. I a yellow skinned bird was used in this line at some point, who knows what other genes are there that shouldn't be.

 

[kian]

Ok, that makes good sense. Thank you so much!

 

[pips&peeps]

One does not just get one easter egger and one ameraucana from the same hatch. I would believe that this person has a flock of ee and sells them as ameraucanas.

Ameraucanas do not have yellow skin. Your other white chick probably carries the gene, because it takes two copies to express. White ameraucanas also carry recessive white. This means two copies of the gene are needed to get a white bird.

Dominant white will just cover the color underneath and generally a chick will hatch with yellow down if they are dominant white. A dominant white bird also has more of a chance to leak color as they mature.

 

[NYREDS]

I have been reading through this thread for awhile and find the standard for this breed very confusing. I may be opening up a can of worms with this post, but I would like to hear some other opinions on the matter. This system of classifying Ameraucana offspring as an entirely different breed because they don't meet the standards definition of feather coloring baffles me. I have only encountered this in the chicken world.

If you breed two colorful, spotted Appaloosa horses together and get a solid colored foal with no spots or any other Appaloosa color characteristics the foal is still an Appaloosa and can be registered and shown as such. When the foal is registered with the breed registry it can only acquire limited registration because of its lack of color and/or spots. But the foal would never be considered an entirely different breed based exclusively on the color of it's coat.

So if you breed two Ameraucana's together and produce a chick that hatches with coloring that does not fit into the standard but has slate colored legs and still lays a blue egg, in my opinion, genetically it is still an Ameraucana. They may need to come up with some criteria to split the breed into two categories, like they have with Appaloosa horses. Maybe they should merely classify them as Non-Standard Ameraucanas. I'm sure every once in awhile, even top breeders produce chicks that do not meet the standard and technically would not be considered Ameraucanas. Is it right consider those chicks to be EE's, an entirely different breed?

You are, of course, absolutely correct. It's only a handful of Ameraucana breeders that seem to have difficuulty processing this. In any other breed people working on colour development cross varieties & produce specimens of that breed which may not be a recognized variety. eg: cross a Light Brown Leghorn with a White Leghorn & the offspring will still be Leghorns although they will probably not meet the description for any recognized variety of Leghorn.
Somehow, for some people, this is not true of Ameraucanas. Rather, the offspring of such a cross in Ameraucanas somehow is transformed into a so-called EE. An example that helps to show the weakness of this position involves the Blue Ameraucana. As I'm sure you know, Blues bred blue to blue produce blue, black & splash offspring. According to some people the splash offspring of such a mating are so-called EEs, not Ameraucanas. In any other breed with a blue variety the splash offspring, while not admitted to the Standard, remains a member of that breed. I fail to understand how this would be different with Ameraucanas than it is with any other breed.

 

[pips&peeps]

There is no one in the Club to my knowledge that says a splash ameraucana is an ee. There are exceptions to the rule such as splash and the project colors that I have referred to.

Again:


Quote:

 

[salt and pepper]

You are, of course, absolutely correct. It's only a handful of Ameraucana breeders that seem to have difficuulty processing this. In any other breed people working on colour development cross varieties & produce specimens of that breed which may not be a recognized variety. eg: cross a Light Brown Leghorn with a White Leghorn & the offspring will still be Leghorns although they will probably not meet the description for any recognized variety of Leghorn.
Somehow, for some people, this is not true of Ameraucanas. Rather, the offspring of such a cross in Ameraucanas somehow is transformed into a so-called EE. An example that helps to show the weakness of this position involves the Blue Ameraucana. As I'm sure you know, Blues bred blue to blue produce blue, black & splash offspring. According to some people the splash offspring of such a mating are so-called EEs, not Ameraucanas. In any other breed with a blue variety the splash offspring, while not admitted to the Standard, remains a member of that breed. I fail to understand how this would be different with Ameraucanas than it is with any other breed.

I agree.

 

[kian]

One does not just get one easter egger and one ameraucana from the same hatch.  I would believe that this person has a flock of ee and sells them as ameraucanas.

Ameraucanas do not have yellow skin.  Your other white chick probably carries the gene, because it takes two copies to express.  White ameraucanas also carry recessive white.  This means two copies of the gene are needed to get a white bird. 

Dominant white will just cover the color underneath and generally a chick will hatch with yellow down if they are dominant white.  A dominant white bird also has more of a chance to leak color as they mature.

Thank you so much for explaining this. It is so frustrating because this person makes a distinction on his website and offers "both" breeds, when really they are all technically EEs.

*sigh* The eggs should still be pretty though

 

[Reyvaughn]

I was not going to indulge in this EE vs Ameraucana conversation... Because it really is like beating your head off of a brick wall. It gives you a headache and no matter how much you hit the wall, the brick can not be gotten through to. Just like the brick heads of the EE / Pure but not APA/SOP approved Ameraucana breeders (that are not project colors). Sorry, but if it isn't APA/ABA SOP then it's not an 'Ameraucana'. If it breeds true but is not on the varieties list, it's a mutt. If it is a project, then it's s project (Lavenders, Chocolates, Mottled, Splash) but it breeds true and people are trying to get the variety approved. You will never get a wild colored Wheaten x Silver approved! It will never breed true! BBS does breed true to an extent. You know you will get either BB or S!