Are my Welsummer Pullets actually Roos? Or are they even Welsummers???

Apr 5, 2018
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Mount Pleasant Highlands, California
I purchased a mixed flock of chicks from TSC on April 1, at which point they should have been no less than 4 days old (but possibly older??).

My two "sexed Welsummer Pullets" are developing at vastly different rates and in another thread many thought the more developed Irma might be a roo. But now Ethel is developing in the same way as Irma did in terms of feather features and comb, but at least a week, nearly 1.5 weeks behind.

Okay, so Irma is much older probably and was hanging around the store awhile (though they were similar sizes when I brought them home). Now their colouring seems to be unlike Wellsummer pullets or roos though (both have very strong head v's and eyeliner but dark feathers all over their bodies, tipped in copper/salmon and white!)

Ethel a few days after I got her.
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Irma, same day.
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Irma at left and Ethel on the right; around 3 weeks old (estimated).
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Ethel at left and Irma on the right, contrast edited because of poor lighting. Approximately 3.5 weeks old. Irma started to stretch more upright and her comb and legs grew larger. She went through a cranky teenage phase, which has now passed. Ethel was a cuddly teddy bear, until around 4 weeks (now). She's now behaving just as Irma did last week.
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Pics from today, approximately 4 weeks old. Ethel first:
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Wing closeup:
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And Irma:
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Wing closeup:
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Are they actually Welsummers?? From my inexperienced research, I'm wondering if they might be something different like maybe Speckled Sussex? And, regardless of what breed they are, are they actually pullets or roosters??

I'm so confused!!:idunno
 

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ethel is lacking the salmon chest feathers of a welsummer pullet, but i do believe he is a welsummer cockerel.
irma looks to be a fine cockerel, but i dont know what breed he is. sussex have pink legs so im thinking along the lines of a leghorn maybe?
 
ethel is lacking the salmon chest feathers of a welsummer pullet, but i do believe he is a welsummer cockerel.
irma looks to be a fine cockerel, but i dont know what breed he is. sussex have pink legs so im thinking along the lines of a leghorn maybe?
So you're saying the only two birds I bought that were guaranteed to be pullets (without a return guarantee, of course) are BOTH COCKERELS?!?!

:th
 
So you're saying the only two birds I bought that were guaranteed to be pullets (without a return guarantee, of course) are BOTH COCKERELS?!?!

:th

if ethel is 100% welsummer, he’s a boy, boys have black chest feathers, females have salmon, it’s part of their sex linkage. i dont think irma is a welsummer but he looks to be a boy from that proud comb he holds and his black chest. better luck next time :/
incase you do buy welsummer chicks again, you should be able to sex them too, as they are a sex linked breed, sex can be determined at day old.
the one circled in red is a cockerel:
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the next picture is 5/6 day old cockerel:
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the third is three day old pullet:
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if ethel is 100% welsummer, he’s a boy, boys have black chest feathers, females have salmon, it’s part of their sex linkage. i dont think irma is a welsummer but he looks to be a boy from that proud comb he holds and his black chest. better luck next time :/
incase you do buy welsummer chicks again, you should be able to sex them too, as they are a sex linked breed, sex can be determined at day old.
the one circled in red is a cockerel:
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the next picture is 5/6 day old cockerel:
View attachment 1359215
the third is three day old pullet:
View attachment 1359218
Okay, so looking at Ethel's baby pictures :love what should have been the red flags that "she" was a he? So I can know for next time, because I really wanted some of those gorgeous dark speckled eggs in my basket!

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Both handsome cockerels, I'm sorry to say. :hmm Black chests aren't a good sign if you're hoping for pullets.
I can't pinpoint exactly what breed Irma is, but one thing I do know is that he isn't a Welsummer. :)
Although Welsummers are supposed to be auto-sexing, it seems the whole "eyeliner" thing can be a bit tricky. A local hatchery provided me with the two Welsummer "pullets" I ordered, both decked out with their distinctly striped eyes, and what happens? One turns out to be a cockerel! :rolleyes: I guess you just have to go into it hoping for the best, picking those with the most pronounced eyeliner, and stay aware of the risks. :)

Pictured below are said Welsummers, cockerel and pullet, for reference (among some others ;)):
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~Alex
 
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Okay 5 weeks old, update time!

The chicks have moved outside to the coop and the lighting and space there has allowed for some better pictures as well as to watch their behaviors more closely.

Irma in behind and Ethel up front, with Gladys the cochin pecking a knot in the wood in between them. :lol:

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In my completely inexperienced opinion, I think they are both the same breed (I'm thinking brown leghorn?) and that Irma is a cockerel and Ethel is a pullet. Looking at more pics of Welsummers I don't think my two look anything like them detail wise other than the general partridge patterning. I'm including lots of pics to see your thoughts!

Irma is 100% a cockerel...no question there! He has been excellent at wrangling his crew in the coop, protecting them in a corner while he did an inspection of the new digs, then sprawling out on a patch of sunlight in front of the mirror to admire his own beauty! Haha
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Ethel meanwhile is content to fall in line with the other ladies (at least I think they're all ladies!) Ethel's comb has not developed any more and it's more yellow. She's still very passive and cuddly (as a chick she was constantly looking for all the other chicks and humans to cuddle her!)

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(There's Gladys again too!)

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Her feathers are very dark so in pictures she looks black but in natural light you can see that she's actually brown with a bit of lighter brown coming in on her chest (though the middle strip of feathers are still white and adult feathers haven't come in yet.) She's a strong chick compared to some of my other cochins, red Comets and bantams but nothing about her screams rooster to me.

So? What do you folks think?
 

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