Be very careful with the no crow rooster collar

Discussion in 'New Member Introductions' started by SarMiguel, Sep 1, 2014.

  1. SarMiguel

    SarMiguel New Egg

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    Just writing to let you know that my silkie bantam rooster "Miguel" died wearing a no crow collar. We put the collar on him loosely about a week ago and have been tightening a little more each day. The collar wasn’t having any effect so we kept tightening slightly. Today when I tightened it he seemed fine, was following me around and talking to me as normal. When he crowed it was very soft and I thought “finally, it’s working!”. After he crowed he looked like he was doing silent crows after that. Then his head dropped to the ground and he lay there for a few seconds, got up and panicked and ran around, head fell to the ground again and he panicked again. I tried to pick him up but he was flailing around too much. When I could finally pick him up he went limp. I quickly took off his collar but he remained limp. I tried to do CPR but it didn’t work. He was dead.

    I’m not complaining about the product, I think it's great for saving the lives of so many roosters but just wanted to tell you to please be careful. Maybe it was user error. I don't know. I followed the instructions and made sure the tip of my pinky fitted.

    I am so sad to have lost my special little guy. Please be careful. It was so sudden.

    Sarah
     
  2. VA Raptor

    VA Raptor Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Thank you for being kind enough to give warning.

    I'm so sorry to hear of your loss.
     
  3. Charmed

    Charmed New Egg

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    Yikes. How horrific of a thing to have happen and witness. I'm sorry for your loss and traumatic experience..

    I have three, 4 month old straight run Silkies myself. I got them as day olds.
    Here in Hawaii it is illegal to have roosters within city limits (thank God). And of course I HAD to have the breed that can only be purchased as straight run chicks. LoL. AND cannot discern pullet from rooster until it either lays eggs or crows (and doesn't).

    I thought one showed signs of roo-like behavior when they were younger but now I can't tell. They could all be cocks, hens or ninja turtles for all I know.
    I love all 3 but am still hoping for all girls.

    I have never heard of this "bark collar". I got excited when I saw such specificities to my potential problem. "Silkie, Roo, crowing solution." Only to further read your horror story. :(

    I guess this is a unique situation where a product's potential to cause death is an acceptable risk? Being that it's used as a "possible" means of avoiding CERTAIN death? In the event it becomes necessary, it may still be worth a last-option shot. If the alternative is for him/them to become Panda Express anyways. :/

    It still seems fishy to me though. If this were a dog collar, this incident would make national news I'm sure. Quickly followed by a non-disclosure settlement out of court and a quiet recall.

    I read here that Silkies are of the quieter breeds. Even the roosters. Was that not the case with Miguel? (I'll go read your other posts to fill in the back story.)

    We have wild hens here that squawk just as loud, early and obnoxiously as any rooster I've ever heard. Except these nice hens do it intentionally on my doorstep...

    Maybe they'll be good for finger pointing fodder if any neighbors start complaining about my urban free-range flock (roo or not).

    "Mine are pretty, well mannered, play with the kids, cute and fuzzy. It's THOSE hood rats that are the nuisance."

    Again, sorry for your loss and this traumatic event. But thank you for sharing your experience with us. And letting your experience possibly help others.

    Charmed
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2014
  4. chooks4life

    chooks4life Overrun With Chickens

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    Sorry for your loss.

    If you could still fit the tip of your pinky finger, then it wasn't suffocation, but perhaps something related to him continually straining against the collar, i.e. a blood clot. He may have had a stroke or heart attack.

    That would be likely due in large part to his diet, though, if the only oils and fats and proteins he gets are all cooked, i.e. in pellet form, as that's known to cause cardiovascular disease.

    Most chooks live on that sort of diet, but then again most chooks are culled young or don't live long lives even if not culled, dying from some disease or another, and heart disease is very common; stroke is one thing that can be caused by heart issues. About 80% of chooks die from digestive tract disease, specifically the liver, and a pellet-only or pellet-based diet is one way to cause that. If the liver isn't 100% then neither is the rest of the body, and basically almost no chook has a liver functioning at 100%, least of all on common, cheap commercial diets.

    Sounds like your special little guy was a confirmation of a suspicion I've had for a long while... Crowing isn't conscious for some males, only automatic, and they literally would keep crowing if the crowing was going to kill them. Only some males are able to deliberately cut a crow short or decide against doing it, and some would rather die than stop.

    Best wishes. Sorry it didn't work out for you. I've had males who also could not, or would not stop, but I culled all of those. I've also had hens who could not, or would not, stop making the so-called 'egg song'/alarm call despite being unable to breathe properly while doing it, culled those too. Terrible traits to breed on.
     
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  5. chooks4life

    chooks4life Overrun With Chickens

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    Hello and [​IMG]

    Behavior isn't a reliable gender indicator at any age below puberty, and even after puberty you can get normal roosters who occasionally adopt 'hen behavior' and normal hens who occasionally adopt 'rooster behavior'. It's all just potentials within both genders, there's no infallible dividing line.

    About those loud hens, if they make noise for food and you feed them, they will very quickly learn to make that noise to get more. Cutting them off cold turkey is your only method of breaking that pattern unless you kill them, which might not be okay with your neighbors... ;)

    To the OP: I forgot to mention: if his comb edges and/or whole face, comb, wattles etc went darker, blueish, or white, that's all common in heart failure as well as stroke, but more common in heart failure.

    It's also possible he had some food moving down his throat as he crowed, but the collar itself or swelling caused by his repetitive straining against it, caused the food to go down the wrong pipe. I had a hen asphyxiate once on dry grass, because she insisted on screaming her rage at me whenever I went to feed or water her and her chicks (not a good hen, was already on the cull list) and the symptoms you describe for your boy are the same as she went through as she died of it.
     
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  6. Michael OShay

    Michael OShay Chicken Obsessed

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    Sarah, I'm sorry about the loss of Miguel. It's always sad to lose one of our flock. I've never used a no crow collar before, and I'm sure that I'll never use one in the future, but this will serve as a good warning for those who are contemplating using one.
    Thanks for sharing with us,
    Michael.
     
  7. drumstick diva

    drumstick diva Still crazy after all these years. Premium Member

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    I am so sorry for your loss.

    There have been other losses from those collars but for different reasons. One bird apparently got his foot caught in the collar trying to scratch and died. 2 or 3 others got the collar (too loose) and caught on fencing and strangled.
     
  8. Charmed

    Charmed New Egg

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    LoL thanks. Yes, Silkies are so very hipster-progressive with their gender role neutrality and ambiguity. Yay. Lol.

    Hawaii is definitely THE grey state in the pink and blue vote. Google "Mahu".
    The other helpful insight you so kindly paid forward I also happen to be aware of already. Only from stalking these forums like a jealous X does a Facebook though.

    I've never fed these wild hens. Not even unintentionally. They're afraid of people and I shoo them away whenever I see them. They don't run with my flock during the day. And yet, at night, two of them roost on my porch near my 3 silkies? And in the morning, 5 or 6 come out of the woodworks; squawking like a gang of angry lady liquor store owners.

    Like "uhh? I don't know you. Get out of here." I throw stuff and chase them off but sometimes they just circle back and lurk a stones-throw away. Barely.

    I've never seen them eating our food like some of the doves often do. They're afraid of people. So why roost on my porch just to squawk and flee if God-forbid I use my porch? What's the attraction? Am I that good of Backyard Farmer that all the other chickens wanna join my gang?

    If only they weren't so ugly and loud. They're Old English/jungle bird body types and coloring. Super strong and clearly descendents of British import Hawaiian fighters. I was worried for my flock at first and didn't let them free range because of this.

    Then someone else let them out to mingle and everybody coexisted well. Too well.

    No one would care if I murdered 9 wild chickens but that would be weird. I wouldn't blast a bunch of stray cats. And I hate cats. And snitching on them to animal control wouldnt be very fan-of-Sons-Of-Anarchy of me either. So I digress.

    Charmed
     
  9. chooks4life

    chooks4life Overrun With Chickens

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    Can you get some pics of those hens and try sell them, if they're nobodies' in particular? One person's ugly is another person's beautiful. Someone would love them. ...Probably, anyway. :p

    Best wishes.
     
  10. TwoCrows

    TwoCrows Show me the way old friend... Staff Member

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    Hello there and welcome to BYC! [​IMG]

    Oh I am so sorry for your loss. [​IMG]I agree with Chooks4life in that the bird have had something else going on at the same time. If you used the collar correctly, then it was probably not a case of suffocation.

    I hope your heavy heart can heal soon. [​IMG]
     

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