Cornish roo + Marans hen = ?

Discussion in 'Meat Birds ETC' started by TexasCochinLady, Mar 12, 2011.

  1. TexasCochinLady

    TexasCochinLady Hatching

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    Mar 12, 2011
    Im wanting to raise sum broilers. Im trying to figure out the best way to do this. I have marans, standard cochins, and a few dual purpose hens we have just for eggs. Marans are considerd a dual purpose bird from what ive read. I have heard of the cornish rocks. Crossing a cornish to a white rock. We purchased a few of these last year. We were trying to feed them less protein and raise a pair to produce more. Well, they still got to big, heart attacks, and just have one left. I was wondering if anyone knew what would come out of a cornish roo X with a marans hen? Would it be ready to eat at 8wks like the cornish rock crosses? I also have 1 rhode island red, and 2 buff orpington hens. Would one of those breeds b better to cross to the cornish roo to produce the fast growing meaty birds im looking to produce? I havent got a cornish roo yet. Im waiting to see what kind of cornish roo is best for this cross as well. All comments and info will be greatly appreciated. Thank you.[​IMG]
     
  2. Totalcolour

    Totalcolour Songster

    Ok, genetically the Cornish Rock is a hybrid, so if you use it to cross with another breed, statistically he will pass along, half of his Cornish Game genes, and half of his Rock genes. So, if you bred him to another Rock, half would be pure Rock, and half would be cornish/rock.

    The Marans is a big bird, but I don't know how fast a grower it is. Crossing your Cornish/Rock would produce half Cornish/Marans and half Rock/Marans.

    You may not be able to tell much differenc in coloration, but you should be able to tell which are which by how fast they grow.
     
  3. Quote:Crossbreeding doesn't work that way. The Cornish Rock hybrid has half its chromosomes from one breed and the other half from the other, but when forming sperm or egg, the chromosomes separate randomly. So let's say, for argument's sake (I don't know the real number) that chickens have 40 chromosomes arranged into 20 pairs. Each sperm or egg will have one member of each pair, but WHICH member is completely random. In addition, chromosomes often undergo crossover, where each chromosome exchanges parts with its pair-mate. A simplified explanation is that the pairs look like this: II. When they cross, they look like this: X. At the point of intersection (could be near the top, middle, or bottom...completely random), they break, and reattach onto the other. This is why crosses don't breed true.

    :)

    ~Christopher
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2011
  4. Bossroo

    Bossroo Songster

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    Please refer to your High School Biology book for the real explanation on reproduction !!! [​IMG]
     
  5. eatmorechicken

    eatmorechicken Songster

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    AquaEyes,

    I think you are trying to describe meiosis.
    [​IMG]

    The process of meiosis (blending genes) happens in all organisms, and the end products are gametes (egg and sperm cells). Gametes will have half the chromoses of the original cell. If the original cell contains pure breeeding genes (at least the genes of interest), then meiosis does not affect the deviant gene expresion. The genetic variance increases with cross-breeding and mutations.

    The best way for most people to predict the outcome of crossing is by punnett square, but because of the random ordering and mixing of chromosomes it is near impossible to exactly predict the allele frequency unless the birds are breeding pure or F1 crosses of pure breeds.

    I think what TexasCochinLady is trying to find out is how to make her own hybrid using pure cornish.

    I was wondering if anyone knew what would come out of a cornish roo X with a marans hen? Would it be ready to eat at 8wks like the cornish rock crosses? I also have 1 rhode island red, and 2 buff orpington hens. Would one of those breeds b better to cross to the cornish roo to produce the fast growing meaty birds im looking to produce?

    A homemade cornish cross will not be as big as commercial broilers at 8 weeks. The commercial strains are the product of 50 years in the making. It is a little more involved than crossing a rock to a cornish. The birds used to make the hybrids we buy are not pure cornish or rocks, but are themselves highly specialized strains developed to meet the market standards.



    I havn't crossed standards, but my brother crossed dark cornish bantam hens with a barred rock bantam rooster. All of the offspring were barred and pea combed. They were heavy and were very well fleshed, but not as heavy as the cornish. they did grow as fast as the rocks though and were a little heavier than rocks too.

    I would cross a cornish with the fastest growing and heaviest strain of chicken I could find. Orpingtons are big but slow. Reds are fast, but commercial reds are small.
    Marans could work, but I would get some quality new hampshires, rocks, or delewares. They may not be as big or grow as fast as commercial broilers, but they will have meat on them.

    Also, if your problem with commercial broilers is because of heart attacks and leg problems, then I would restrict feed after about 2-3 weeks of age instead of lowering the protein alone. I can't tell ya exactly how much to feed per bird per bird, so maybe someone else could chime in.​
     
  6. Quote:A homemade cornish cross will not be as big as commercial broilers at 8 weeks. The commercial strains are the product of 50 years in the making. It is a little more involved than crossing a rock to a cornish. The birds used to make the hybrids we buy are not pure cornish or rocks, but are themselves highly specialized strains developed to meet the market standards.




    I havn't crossed standards, but my brother crossed dark cornish bantam hens with a barred rock bantam rooster. All of the offspring were barred and pea combed. They were heavy and were very well fleshed, but not as heavy as the cornish. they did grow as fast as the rocks though and were a little heavier than rocks too.

    I would cross a cornish with the fastest growing and heaviest strain of chicken I could find. Orpingtons are big but slow. Reds are fast, but commercial reds are small.
    Marans could work, but I would get some quality new hampshires, rocks, or delewares. They may not be as big or grow as fast as commercial broilers, but they will have meat on them.

    Also, if your problem with commercial broilers is because of heart attacks and leg problems, then I would restrict feed after about 2-3 weeks of age instead of lowering the protein alone. I can't tell ya exactly how much to feed per bird per bird, so maybe someone else could chime in.

    Thank you for a more detailed explanation. Yes, that perfectly explains what I was getting at (with a couple caveats: 1) meiosis occurs in all SEXUALLY REPRODUCING organisms, and 2) a Punnet Square is useful for predicting percentages of a few known traits with known patterns of inheritance, but cumbersome beyond that, such as predicting how "Rock" or "Cornish" the offspring of a "Rock/Cornish will appear). However, on another thread (in Peafowl -- "Combining Colors") I've been accused of giving headaches with my detailed (and long) posts, so I tried to keep it short and sweet. I was referring back to the previous comment that using a Cornish-Rock hybrid with a Marans will result in half Cornish-Marans and half Rock-Marans. It's the post I quoted in my reply.

    I always enjoy seeing some science, so good job on finding the information to post.

    :)

    ~Christopher
     
  7. Quote:?
     
  8. lotzahenz

    lotzahenz Songster

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    If you do use a Marans, the Wheatens seem to grow faster that the BCM's for me. I prefer the Wheatens for their fleshiness though, of the strains I have. AND, all chickens make good soup, so start crossing and butchering and see what works best for you. My RIR crossed with BCM's are good meaty birds that lay decently too. They will never grow as fast as the market cornish crosses, at least not for several years. Good luck OP, and remember fried chicken is supposed to be smaller than the giant cornish cross birds, it just tastes better. [​IMG]
     
  9. walls0stone3

    walls0stone3 In the Brooder

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    so what makes the Conish Cross grow so fast? and can i just get Cornish roos and white rock hens... or is it more detaild that that?

    i do know how to cross cattle, so I'm not all in the dark on this. We used to cross black angus with Semmitall for a good calf that recived a ton of milk and grew like made for finnish
     
  10. syble

    syble Songster

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    michigan
    the cornish X which at one point might have been cornish x rock are such a creation, it would take years to reproduce. the final product you buy(chick) is actually a cross between 2 sepereately line bred birds. the Cornish x are terminal. their parents come from 2 distinctly seperate lines. a male and female line, when crossed properly create those giants.
     

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