Could a white silkie hen and blue cochin rooster produce this?

Discussion in 'What Breed Or Gender is This?' started by Courtburr, Nov 16, 2018.

  1. Courtburr

    Courtburr In the Brooder

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    I had posted about this black mix and a barred rock that I got at 2 weeks old. As the black one has matured a bit more and I've done hours and hours of research, I'm down to thinking this is a silkie/cochin mix. The farm the egg came from says her dad has white silkies (hens and roosters) and a blue cochin rooster. While they say they're kept separate, I'm not ruling anything out.

    All that being said, from a genetics standpoint, could a white silkie hen and blue cochin rooster even produce a black offspring like this? I've read somewhere that there are two white silkie genes and only one will ensure all white offspring. I'm not sure on the blue cochin genes though and if that could bring about black with the non-white white (not sure what else to call it) silkie gene.

    I'm adding a few different age pics to hopefully help with some of its characteristics....3, 5 and 7 weeks. It's about 7.5 weeks now.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Gray Farms

    Gray Farms Crowing

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    Looks like a Cochin/Silkie cross to me.
     
  3. Courtburr

    Courtburr In the Brooder

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    How about the color? Is it possible to have come from a white silkie hen and a blue cochin rooster?

    Or is there meaning in the explicit order?
    cochin/silkie = cochin hen and silkie rooster
    vs
    silkie/cochin = silkie hen and cochin rooster
     
  4. Sneebsey

    Sneebsey Songster

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    Agree with @Gray Farms.

    There are indeed two genes for white; Recessive White and Dominant White. Recessive white dilutes all eumelanin (black) and pheomelanin (gold) pigment, but requires two copies of the gene in order to express; a Recessive White bird may therefore be of any e-series. Dominant White is less effective, only diluting eumelanin, and is incompletely dominant, meaning that a single copy of the gene results in a reduced effect. A single-factor bird will generally show pigment holes; Paint birds are single-factor Dominant White on an extended black e-series. Red Pyle are usually pure for Dom White on wildtype e-series.

    Blue is also incompletely dominant. A single copy will result in Blue, whilst two copies will result in Splash. With that in mind, a Blue cockerel, when bred to a bird that is not Splash, will produce a percentage of Black offspring.

    As we cannot see under the white of the Silkie, which I imagine is Recessive White, we cannot deduce her e-series or any other modifying genes she may have. I have a White Silkie mix cockerel (in my Avatar) who is wildtype on his e-loci and blue, however due to Recessive White, the only way to discover that was to look to his offspring.
     
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  5. Gray Farms

    Gray Farms Crowing

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    Sneebsey hit the nail on the head. Basically your blue cochin carries the genes to produce black "if not bred to splash". And your white silkie carries the recessive white genes that can only be seen in her offspring.
     
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  6. Brahma Chicken5000

    Brahma Chicken5000 Araucana Addict

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    If the Silkie hen carries recessive white then the chicks will be blue and black.
     
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  7. Courtburr

    Courtburr In the Brooder

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    So a Blue cockerel could give a recessive gene that could produce black. That recessive black when paired with a recessive white from a white silkie, it could in fact produce a black offspring.

    It makes sense given the understanding of how the blue expression works. I think the mystery may be solved for me!
     
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  8. Sneebsey

    Sneebsey Songster

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    Blue is Incomplete Dominant. A Blue bird has one gene for Blue and one gene for Not Blue. Therefore, when paired with a bird who is not Splash (Blue/Blue), they will produce Blue/Not and Not/Not offspring. The Black offspring is Not/Not, so rather than being caused by a recessive gene, it is actually the absence of the Blue gene allowing the eumelanin to express.

    As Recessive white is just that; recessive, a Recessive White bird, when paired with a bird without Recessive White, will produce offspring which carry the gene hidden, but do not express it. They will not be white (unless the parent is hiding Dom White).

    Thus your black chick.
     
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  9. Gray Farms

    Gray Farms Crowing

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    The more I lean and begin to fully understand genetics.....the more my head hurts. lol
     
  10. Cellomama2

    Cellomama2 Songster

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    I love all the science behind the colors. Don't know all the ins an outs of it but love it.
     
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