egg bound? wtd?

Discussion in 'Chicken Behaviors and Egglaying' started by Double Kindness, Aug 9, 2014.

  1. Double Kindness

    Double Kindness Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Jeanette isn't acting her normal self, and hasn't layed an egg in about 10 days. Today we caught her and her vent looks like this. [​IMG]
     
  2. soggybottommini

    soggybottommini Out Of The Brooder

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    Is that poop? I cant tell from the picture, it looks like she may be egg bound. To see if she is put your finger a little ways in her vent not to far u may break the egg. Sounds nasty but if she is egg bound u need to know. When u put your finger in u will fill the egg, im sure she is egg bound I had a hen last week do the same thing, I put vegetable oil in a syringe and squirted it in her vent to lubricate it and the egg should come out with in a day or so u can repeat it the next day u can try and put her in the bathroom with the hot water running the steam helps the hen pass the egg once egg bound. Not sure if this helps but it has for me.
     
  3. iwiw60

    iwiw60 Overrun With Chickens

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  4. Double Kindness

    Double Kindness Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Thanks, idk which it is. She is not acting herself and not laying either.

    Going to catch her again now.
     
  5. dretd

    dretd Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Hi Double Kindness, I am very sorry to hear Jeanette is not well. It could be a lot of things and is hard to diagnose without seeing her and potentially doing some tests, but maybe getting more information from you could help figure it out. If you feel she is in danger, you should consider taking her to an avian vet for proper diagnosis.

    Its really hard to see the vent from the picture you posted. It looks like it is a normal color but that there may be some pasty droppings stuck around it a bit. Is that the case? What have her droppings been looking like?

    Here is a photo of a vent prolapse from my 5 year old EE Eva:
    [​IMG]

    You can see her pink insides are on the outside--a tube of the vent had squeezed through the opening and some of her manure (that white blob on the right) has stuck to it.

    Eva was not egg bound, but had an intestinal infection that caused her to strain--she has had this happen 3 times. When I gently palpated the area between her public bones, there was no hard egg (what you would expect if she were egg bound) She was treated with some warm stiz baths, the antibiotic TMP-Sulfa and honey right on the prolapse to shrink the tissue.

    Here she is in her bath:
    [​IMG]

    You just half-fill a small tub with bath-temp water and then slowly lower them in. Use one hand to hold them in and then the other can gently swish warm water around the vent and remove any crusty poop from the area. This will help you clean it just in case there is poop there and if you think she has an egg stuck, this warm water bath will help her muscles to relax and may help her pass it. About 5 minutes seems about right once or twice a day.

    Here is what the vent looked like after 4 days of treatment. It is almost back to normal--you would see almost a frowny-face when looking straight on from the rear--she is on her side.
    [​IMG]

    I wanted to show you these pictures so that you could see what a prolapse looks like and maybe tell for yourself if that is the problem..


    If you could give more details about her that would be a great place to start!

    -Is she squatting/straining and acting like she is trying to poop or lay an egg but nothing is coming out?
    -Is she eating normally, or less than usual?
    -Is she sitting puffed up or acting normally?
    -Is there any evidence of a broken egg in the nest box (moist straw or whatever you are using in the nest box), if you lift up the bedding there do you see dried egg? She could be laying weak-shelled or shell-less eggs that break and are eaten immediately.
    -I know you are feeding a diet that you mix yourself. Could you be very specific about what you are feeding her?
    -Are you giving her free access to oyster shells (a calcium source)?
    -Does she have free access to grit (small stones?)
    -Are you giving her any supplements (like vitamins) or probiotics (like yogurt or buttermilk)?
    -About the weeds you are giving the girls--have you identified them to make sure there are not any poisonous ones in the mix (after my poisonous plants class I want back home to my parents house and found no less than 23 poisonous plants in the horse pasture including hemlock and deadly night shade)?

    The reason the diet details are so important is that it can be hard to get the right balance of nutrients when you are making your own feed. Feed companies have on staff nutritionists that formulate the feeds and make sure each batch measures up to standards. There is a tendency for the protein to be too low (16-20% is good) and the calcium levels too low in home made feed. Calcium is really important for the muscles to work properly and for the shell to form. The hen will draw calcium from her bones to compensate but after a while this will not be sufficient and she could have some serious problems including egg binding or even broken bones. Chickens also need grit to chew their feed since they don't have teeth.

    I would love to help you out more, more info is always better! I am out this evening so I may not be able to answer right away--so sorry. I hope someone else can also add in their advice for you!

    eta PS: you may want to call up a poultry nutritionist and see if they have recommendations for mixing your own feed, or investigate a commercial brand that avoids the gluten you don't want. There is a feed store in Ft Collins that has a nutritionist and makes their own feed. You could contact them and tell them what your concerns are (like wanting it gluten free) and see if they are any feeds that would work for you http://www.ranch-way.com/products/poultry-feed
     
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2014
  6. Double Kindness

    Double Kindness Chillin' With My Peeps

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    I feed them grass, dandelions, mostly grass and dandeliins and salad greens from my patch, some peppermint and lavander and wormwood. She has free source calcium, but hasn't been interested in it. They get muillet seed, split peas, hemp seeds, flax seeds, boss, mealworms. She has grit/rocks. They love corn and pea shoots and I'm sprouting mung beans for them, thier boss and seeds are soaked overnight and I give them free choice fermented or soaked, and still offer layer pellets but they get ignored. Dried mealworms. They get probiotics in their water. Jeanette usually has a voracious appetite, but not lately. And she is seeming depressed, not being her bossy chicken everything is mine self.

    We caught her up again, took her inside, gave her 4 epson salt baths, changing the water frequently. Feeling for egg, no egg.

    She quite enjoyed her spa treatments. She had been sneezing and shaking her head last week, and we had started everyone on antibiotics and then corid. She got another dose of anti biotics, nails trimmed, enjoyed the low heat fan on her, vaseline with sulfur on her legs, vet rx orally. She had a big poop towards the end of the treatment, she had poops stuck to her butt. We obviously washed that away. No protrusions. She seems to have quite a few new feathers coming in. She seems back to herself today. Bossy, piggy... just she wasn't for a bit and it got me very worried with no egg laying as she used to lay 5-6 eggs out of 7 days, 10 days nothing. And just acting off, not interested in food. There are lots of big earthworms and are easily found in the run, as Phyllis seems to excel at that. Jeanette wasn't dustbathing. Just moving from place to place on occasion and laying down and going to sleep all day and afternoon. Taking very little interest in anything, even mealworms and everyone here goes gaga for mealworms. I give them a wild bird seed blend that I buy in bulk that has 18% crude protein, they often get kitchen scraps, tomatoes are a favorite as are apples, strawberries, cherries, blueberries. And I sprout them lots of stuff and they like organic non gmo fresh corn on the cob. The apples come from the neighbors yard. The grass and dandelions come from my yard and neighbors when I walk around the block with one of the dogs. The neighbors like I pull weeds for my chickens, but I tend to only pull dandelions and grass, cuz I recognize them as safe.

    Yesterday they got a lot of marigold petals, and I look at poops carefully throughout the day.

    It could have been b/c Matilda died and we added Nell & Lenny to replace her, and new feathers coming in, but her nickname is piggy for a reason. Maybe I should put up nesting box curtains?

    The straw in the nesting boxes is clean and dry. I'm cleaning out the run and coop again today (weekly thing) and adding more stumps and soil for dustbathing, just from the dirt patch in front of the run, as the run is actually built using an unused dog run with a brick and pavestone patio under it, but a lot of soil from the garden made it's way in for dustbathing, but as chickens hate piles...
     
  7. Double Kindness

    Double Kindness Chillin' With My Peeps

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    [​IMG] Jeanette drying off after a long epson salt soak with frequently changed warm water.
     
  8. dretd

    dretd Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Good Morning Double Kindness!

    It looks like you are doing a good job on nutrition and using caution with the weeds, so good for you!

    What type of antibiotics did you put your flock on? I assume this was because Matilda was ill so you added that in to treat the flock just in case?

    If you feel like your flock's poops are normal, you may want to consider weaning them off the Corid. Its is great when you have coccidia--it is a thiamin (B-1) mimic so it blocks the uptake of that vitamin in coccidia which starves them--but on a long term basis may reduce the B-1 available for your chickens so it is great to use for a limited time when there is a problem then discontinue it once the coccidia have been reduced by the chicken's immune systems.

    How is Jeanette? She does look like she enjoyed her spa treatment. I was surprised with Eva and how much she enjoyed her baths. She is normally very hard to catch and rather flighty, but she also was very content with her warm baths and they helped her feel much better.
     
  9. Double Kindness

    Double Kindness Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Jeanette is back and full of piss n vinegar, that's mine, that's mine oink oink nom nom nom. Dustbathing. Antibiotics is oxytetracycline. I stopped corid a bit ago after treating 5 days. Then nutridrench. Then wazine for 1 day, now nutridrench again, getting durvet tomorrow to give them 3 dsys, toss eggs for 14 days... right? Am I doing this right?

    Everyone is getting caught up and gets a footbath every evening, followed by vaseline and sulfur on legs and combs/wattles. Thinking I might dust everyone with sevin one last time for a bit anyways tomorrow b/c it has been so wet/rainy.

    It seems like I can't seem to post pictd on byc for some reason, after I moved all my files onto micro sd card, moved to tablet. Nada uploading on byc, but can on Facebook. Hmmph.
     
  10. dretd

    dretd Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Hi Double Kindness.

    Sounds like you've been busy treating your flock!

    I am glad to hear that Jeanette is feeling better.

    I guess I am not sure I can give you my thoughts on your treatment plan/egg withdrawal--Durvet is a brand and has many products available for Livestock so I am at a loss, sorry. Are you treating the flock for a specific illness from Matilda, or are you treating Jeanette since she was off? It seems like the Oxytet was working since Jeanette is feeling better, so is the egg withdrawal for that or for the Duravet you are getting?

    I will look forward to seeing more photos when BYC cooperates!
     

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