I can see the light at the end of the tunnel. I've finally came up with a waterer and feeder for inside the coop, that I really like. My problem was that I don't have alot of floor space, so I wanted to be able to use as little space as possible. Also my coop isn't the easiest thing to get into, so I need to have fairly easy access to both of them for refills. I think I met both of my major requirements. Here they are ... Waterer: It took me a while to firgure out how to make this nipplie waterer stable enough that they couldn't knock it over. The holes that you see holding the metal bracket are actually two holes in one. The first is the one you can see which goes straight through the board, and there is another you can't see that is inside the first and goes down to hold the hook very securely. The top half is held by a string which wraps around it and then is tied off using those two screw on the side like a boat cleat. I absolutely love this water setup because I don't have to worry about shaving or anything in their water, and leaks are very minimal. Oh yea, and that's the bottle conversion kit from TSC. I think it was like $4, and totally worth it. Though I don't suggest using it with a 2 liter bottle because it seems to leak a bit with that much water. Feeder: This feeder has worked out great. The stand pipe goes up about 10 inches. It's raised off the floor of the coop on the end with a piece of wood, and attached to the 2x4 of the coop by string, using the same cleat idea as the waterer. It's right in the front of the coop, so access is extremely easy. Let me know what you think Now all I have left to do is put up the hardware cloth around the bottom of my coop, which I think the DH and I are going to do this afternoon. And I'm considering putting a small 60 watt light bulb in the coop to help the chicks transition smoothly, but I haven't decided fully on that yet. They're going out next week, and I'm starting to get nervous. Haha!