Frizzles

Discussion in 'General breed discussions & FAQ' started by TerrasCritters, Oct 25, 2007.

  1. TerrasCritters

    TerrasCritters In a new coop

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    Oct 24, 2007
    Hey everyone,
    I have asked this before other places but never hear.
    Ok so I have my Blue Silkie roo (blue skin, who may be a mix, according to someone who saw him said he looks big) and and Black Frizzle hen (yellow skin)
    The two together I every so often get a brown chick with lighter and darker shades of brown striping and markings.
    Once one grew up to be dark blue in color frizzle. The next two kept the brown, they are speckled in ways, and are frizzled. And then my next 2 hatches from them I got one of each, again frizzles. They two have kept some of the brown markings.
    I have seen, black, blue, red, white frizzles but never this what I call "Chocolate Speckled" frizzle.
    Anyone ever seen or heard of this? Any ideas of what I can breed them to to keep getting this color? I recently gave one to a friend we are not sure yet if it is a hen or roo, and I have another thats younger, so I had 4 and I would like to keep other colors so I decided to give her one so I had room for another somewhere else LOL

    So I dont have a recent picture of my 2 older girls but you can see there older picture on my webpage. Here...
    http://www.freewebs.com/terrascritters/xcritterportraitsx.htm
    Comment My Guest Book!!
    XOXO
     
  2. Blisschick

    Blisschick not rusty

    Feb 20, 2007
    Shepherd, Texas
    Your frizzles are definitely chocolate, but the markings are called "pencilling", not speckling. Chocolate is a dilute form of black, and is an incomplete dominant, meaning it only takes one copy of the gene to make a black bird brown. That your birds have this is actually very interesting, since blue is the same kind of gene. My THEORY is that the blue gene is dominant over the brown gene, so that is why you don't see it expressed in either one of your birds, but in their offspring. If your frizzle had it, she would be brown.

    (Just to be sure though, I've put the question to someone who I know has dealt with the chocolate gene, so I'm just waiting to hear back from him.)
     
  3. Blisschick

    Blisschick not rusty

    Feb 20, 2007
    Shepherd, Texas
    Okay, I'll try to translate in a way we can both understand...[​IMG]

    Firstly, he said that the actual chocolate gene is not what is making your birds brown. If it were the the true chocolate gene, you birds wouldn't have the black barring, since chocolate replaces black. He said that if it were true chocolate, they'd be brown with brown barring. (I've questioned him further on this, since it appears to me that the top photo shows that.)

    Secondly, he's pretty sure that your birds are split at the E allele, meaning that since black (E) and blue (EBl) are dominant, they are probably masking another color, like partridge (eb) or some other gene that is more dominant over the partridge gene, and it's only the combining of the single recessive gene from each of your birds that is bringing out the unusual color. He feels that judging from the pattern alone, they probably have the partridge gene. My thought is whatever it is has combined with the pattern gene (Pg) that is causing the barring. Not to confuse you, but there is another kind of gene that would cause barring, but without back crossing, it's kind of hard to say which it is.

    At any rate, I'd love to get some eggs from you! Please let me know when you have some available!
     
  4. TerrasCritters

    TerrasCritters In a new coop

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    Oct 24, 2007
    Thank you so very much for your help I plan on getting more into this and trying to understand. I did take some new pictures today of the girls and the younger girl.
    I have them loaded I need to resize them and place them somewhere for you to see.
    I brought them inside tonight for pictures. My neice fell in love with them, they are soo soft!!

    Anyway I am not sure if they are laying yet I am sure they are but I dont know whos eggs are whos yet.
    I am trying to think if I can set them up in a seperate pen. But who/what would be best to pair them with? I have a Black Silkie Rooster, Buff Silkie Roosters, White Cochin Rooster, or there father.... LOL

    From there parents (black frizzle and blue silkie) I have got, the colors they are, in 2 shades, one with black barring? and one with brown? Ihave got black frizzles, black frizzles with white tips on primary wing feathers, Blue frizzles, (right now I have a hen from them her curls are WAY curly, I know its not what a judge would like but I love it! shes sooo fluffy!) black cochins, blue cochins, and one that hatched brown but it went to a very dark blue cochin.
    What I have kept and still have from the pair is 3 chocolate frizzles and a blue frizzle hens (I am not sure for the youngest one yet) I also gave a friend of mine one of the chocolate chicks the other day.

    Anyway I will let you know about the pictures, thanks so much for helping me out!
     
  5. Blisschick

    Blisschick not rusty

    Feb 20, 2007
    Shepherd, Texas
    I would be interested in getting eggs from the parents, since that's where you're getting the results from. But...if you were to mate any males back to the mother, or females with the father, you might find out pretty quick if you will get chocolates any sooner, since the gene pairing will be will be more likely to happen, rather than the random match ups your getting with the original pair. This is what breeders typically do when they're trying to work with a trait.
     
  6. KKluckers

    KKluckers Time Out

    Sep 4, 2007
    Okay Im going to butt in........could you breed the choc. to a partridge? Looking at the feathers the hen does look like I partridge frizzle? I have some of the chicks that are the sisters to the choc. they are black. I also have one of the choc. So if I breed to a partridge would that help the trait?
     
  7. Blisschick

    Blisschick not rusty

    Feb 20, 2007
    Shepherd, Texas
    I would think so. If they're both partridge, the chances of you getting more partridge with a better pattern are very good, although not knowing exactly what's causing the brown color at this point may not necessarily result in brown birds.
     
  8. KKluckers

    KKluckers Time Out

    Sep 4, 2007
    I guess just try and see what I get. Thankyou!
     
  9. TerrasCritters

    TerrasCritters In a new coop

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    Oct 24, 2007
    Christina, Charity, (I dont know if you still call her this) the big black frizzle hen is also from Topaz and Victoria.

    Thanks again I will try to pair her up with someone else, like my black silkie roo, but she isnt liking him very much LOL
     
  10. TerrasCritters

    TerrasCritters In a new coop

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    Oct 24, 2007
    Hen Number One
    [​IMG]
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    All Three or the 2 older girls (one is only like 2-3 months old? I cant remember)
    [​IMG]
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    I have more of the other 2 individually, been real busy around here.
    What would be recomended to breed these hens with to try to keep the coloring?
     

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