Got A Couple Question's About Mandarins&Woodducks please. ((:

Discussion in 'Ornamental Fowl (Swans, etc.)' started by lcw1995, May 17, 2011.

  1. lcw1995

    lcw1995 Chillin' With My Peeps

    Nov 27, 2010
    Marysville Ohio
    I have some Wood Duck eggs in the incubator.Mother abandoned the nest.

    Questions:
    1.I plan on raising these myself.Getting them really tame so they like me.Well will it hurt them to be housed in a raised pen with about 8 bantam chickens??It will be good sized pen with plenty of roosts and a little black tub for a pond.Iv'e seen pictures.

    2.Then when they start laying eggs, can I let the Duck Female hatch some and let the Bantam Hen hatch some.??

    3.Also if the Bantam Chicken Hen raises them(they will be free range during the day and shut in at night), will the babies learn to go into the pen every night when their adults if they do it when there ducklings?

    4.When the hen is done raising them, they will still be free ranging, will the ducks stay around? Theres a little creek about 20 feet away from the pen were they will be housed....I don't want to clip their wings... I want them to be able to fly away from predators if need be.. Is it OK if they continue to free range. I mean, they would have been housed there all their life and thats where they will get fed and waterered at.. They should stick around right?

    5.Do I need a permit to sell them if I ever wanted to? Do I need a permit to raise them for that matter?

    Ok im sure ill have more questions but until then.. could I get some answers to these please?? Im asking the same questions about the Mandarins and Wood Ducks.

    Thanks,
    Lcw1995
     
  2. KansasKid

    KansasKid Chillin' With My Peeps

    Feb 7, 2010
    South East Kansas
    I don't know about the raising them with the chickens thing, thats got to be answered by someone else, I know you can let the bantam hatch 'em but will probably need to be removed and put in an brooder because they can slip through the tiniest holes and escape. as far as free ranging them, some people do it but they have their wings clipped. And they will be in the creek 24/7 and eventually probably fly away if they are from wild parents. As far as selling, thats going to be a big illegal on that if you didn't get the 3-186 form. To sell/dispose of migratory waterfowl you have to have a federal migratory bird waterfowl sell and disposal permit thats $70 or $75 and to have migratory birds legally you should buy them from a person with a permit that provides you with the proper 3-186 form stating that you bought them legally.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2011
  3. Boggy Bottom Bantams

    Boggy Bottom Bantams Overrun With Chickens

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    KK is correct on all that. The mandarins do not need a permit. The wood ducks and all migratory north american species do. You have to have the 3-186 form to legally own them to start with, to sell you need the USDI waterfowl permit them mentioned.

    Bantam hatching is great, leaving them with the bantams to raise. That aint gone happen. They die eventually. They will need to be brooder raised. Chickens and any game bird shouldnt be kept together for disease reasons too.
    Wood duck and mandarin are the flightiest of all migratory waterfowl. Though you can keep them in cages, they will eventually beat themselves to death in them trying to get away from you. Very very few ever tame down to "pet" likeness. They are 100% nothing like domestic ducks. You can not free range them un pinioned. 1 it's illegal, 2 they'll just fly away. As for them laying in a cage, they wont do that. These guys need a nice large pen, with heavy cover, ponds and nesting boxes raised off the ground before they will even consider nesting. They are very wary and like to be secluded when breeding and laying. So if those aspects arent met, they'll just pass their life away wanting out.

    a decent 10x 10 minimum 10x 20 preferred pen on the ground with a pond, heavy cover and a few raised wood duck boxes is the ideal pen for them. They will be much happier, and usually produce for you.

    I know these probably werent the answers you wanted, but they are the truth about the species.
     
  4. Dr. Todd

    Dr. Todd Chillin' With My Peeps

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    I hate to be 'that girl' but just for clarity, are these eggs from a WILD wood duck or a CAPTIVE wood duck?

    If they're from a wild wood duck you're breaking U.S. federal law and should a) throw the eggs away [​IMG] or b) bring them to a licensed wildlife professional. Wild birds abandon nests all the time, that's just part of life. As sad as it is you can't take wild bird eggs, regardless of the status of the nest.

    If they're from captive ducks you'll need paperwork that shows that someone legally keeping wood ducks gave you the eggs. Without it you won't be able to get your own permit and you're likely to have game wardens knocking on your door. [​IMG]

    DT
     
  5. Koipondduck

    Koipondduck Chillin' With My Peeps

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    I do not know when you posted these questions but these are the same questoins I have been dealing with for the past few weeks.
    They do say wood duck will breed with mandarine hens and other hens and inbreed will have infirtile eggs.

    let me read about other answers about licensing to raise them and other questions you asked. However, federal law does not require you to have permits to have migratory water fowl if they are reared domestically but local and state laws are different. I wish I can speak to you in person about these issues.
     
  6. Koipondduck

    Koipondduck Chillin' With My Peeps

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    HI, I have been mulling over many issues about keeping or even think about wood ducks.
    Here is the website that expleain FDA's rule about keeping migratory birds.
    http://www.fws.gov/forms/3-200-9.pdf

    Accoring to this site, a person must have 3.-186 form ( proof of purchase showing that someone got these birds that are reared domestically and not just caught in the wild ). However, if you do not plan to sell incubated eggs and babies, then to rear them domestically in a beautiful place, do you stil need to have permit taken that you purchased it from a licensed person? I was told by region -3 officer that hobbists can keep them but I may be wrong. Here is what FDA web site states on migratory waterfowl. However, someone must meet local and state laws about keeping water fowls. It varies from state to sate. Here in Ohio an office told me that even for mallards people need a permit but Medina Tractor supply stated that they sell 1000's mallards babies every year and they do not issue permits when they sell them. They also said that is unheard of.


    Law:
    A Federal Migratory Bird Waterfowl Sale and Disposal permit will authorize you to sell, donate, or otherwise dispose of to another person, properly marked, captive-reared migratory waterfowl and their eggs. A permit is not required to sell or dispose of properly marked, captive-reared mallards. You should review Title 50 Parts 10, 13, and 21.25 of the Code of Federal Regulations (CFR). [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]You are responsible for reviewing and understanding these regulations before you request and accept a permit. [/FONT][/FONT]These regulations can be found on our website at: http://www.fws.gov/permits/ltr/ltr.html. Below is a review of several sections pertinent to a Federal Migratory Bird Waterfowl Sale and Disposal permit.
    [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]1. Do I need a permit to possess captive-reared migratory waterfowl? [/FONT][/FONT]
    No. Any person may, without a permit, lawfully acquire properly marked, captive-reared migratory waterfowl of any species, alive or dead, or their eggs, and possess and transport such birds or eggs and any progeny or eggs solely for his own use, subject to the following conditions:
    (a) Such birds, alive or dead, or their eggs may be lawfully acquired from holders of valid Waterfowl Sale and Disposal permits.
    (b) All progeny of such birds or eggs hatched, reared, and retained in captivity must be physically marked as defined in 21.13(b). (Also see question 3 below.)
    (c) No birds or eggs or progeny may be disposed of by any means, alive or dead, to any other person unless you have a valid Waterfowl Sale and Disposal permit.
    (d) Lawfully possessed and properly marked waterfowl may be killed, in any number, at any time or place, by any means except shooting. Such birds may be killed by shooting only in accordance with all applicable hunting regulations.
    (e) When you acquire any waterfowl, alive or dead, from a Waterfowl Sale and Disposal permittee, the permittee must give you the original of the completed Form 3-186, Notice of Waterfowl Transfer or Sale, providing all information required by the form and method or methods by which individual birds are marked


    So what do hobbists supposed to do if they obtain these wood duck ligally to rear them if they purchased it from a licensed person?
     
  7. CelticOaksFarm

    CelticOaksFarm Family owned, family run

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    When you buy wood ducks or other migratory ducks the seller gives you the 3-186 form. That is yours to retain as proof the birds were not taken from the wild. Most states will want to see this form as you apply for your required state permit to keep the migratory waterfowl.

    Mandarins are not migratory waterfowl, and do not require the 3-186, some states do require you to have a permit to keep them, though.
     
  8. Koipondduck

    Koipondduck Chillin' With My Peeps

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    In state of Ohio's migratory law, in the game bird section, mandarines are not listed.
    Also, I got a male wood duck and the gentleman by mistake has given me a female mandarine.

    Instead of giving me a 3.-186, he wrote down his license number and what he sold on a piece of paper.
    If push come to sub, I can produce that to the state since the mand is not very organized. Also, I may get rid of the wood duck on
    monday since i do not want to deal with this in my back yard at all. There are other nice ducks such as blue wind teal or green wing teal
    that are colorful. Hobby does not need to turn into nightmare since I have no intention of breeding or selling them.
     
  9. Koipondduck

    Koipondduck Chillin' With My Peeps

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    [​IMG]I received their application and it says, the definition of " game birds" which include many things but they did not specifically stated anything about wood duck or mallards but gave a term call duck. They did specify though game bird include "morning dove, ring neck, pheasants, quil, ruffed grouse, shapr-tail grouse, pintailed -gouse, wild turkey, Hungarian partridge, Chukar Partridge, Woodcocks, black-breasted piover, Golden plover, Wilson's snipe or jackstripe , yellowlegs, rail coots, gallinules, duck, geese , brand and crows. Now someone may just elaborate duck as various ducks...


    Not worth my time and effort since I tend to spend tons of money buying Mazula food, game bird food, cracked corn, give them expensive frsh salads and meal worms where as I see in the city of Cleveland, ( which I live about 22 minutes out side of the city with 3.46 acre land people are raising birds in postage size lot with no lush greeneries or a pond where birds go to sleep peacefully

    [​IMG]


    Not worth my time and effort since I tend to spend tons of money buying Mazula food, game bird food, cracked corn, give them expensive frsh salads and meal worms where as I see in the city of Cleveland, ( which I live about 22 minutes out side of the city with 3.46 acre land people are raising birds in postage size lot with no lush greeneries or a pond where birds go to sleep peacefully


    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    .
     
  10. Koipondduck

    Koipondduck Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Yes, I am aware of this 3-186 if you read my other posts.
     

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