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Holderreads

Discussion in 'Ducks' started by AnconaDuck, Nov 16, 2009.

  1. AnconaDuck

    AnconaDuck Out Of The Brooder

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    I, and a few other people, are noticing a few interesting things with birds ordered from Holderreads. I know he works specificially with rare breeds, and must inbreed/linebreed alot to achieve where he is today. But, within certain breeds, we are noticing health issues.

    For instance-

    Welsh Harlequin- Many ducks have issues with their nervous system. No balance, cannot stand up, etc. There are 4 or 5 people that have had this issue in day olds on uo.

    S. Appleyard- Water bellies at 1+ yrs old. Someone I know had to cull ALL of their birds. We have had to cull 1 or 2

    Anyone else noticed anything? What should we do about it, other than incroporate outcrosses into our stock?
     
  2. Wifezilla

    Wifezilla Positively Ducky

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    I got my Welsh Harlequins as adults. Original owner had issues with the feet and legs but we narrowed this down to a feed issue and not necessarily a genetic issue. Since I am breeding my holderread's drakes to some metzer hens I am not too concerned about the next generation.
     
  3. rainplace

    rainplace Interstellar Duck Academy

    Quote:I would call Dave directly. I am positive he would like to know this information. We specifically talked about about inbreeding one time I was down there this past summer. We talked about the maximum times you should inbreed/linebreed before you start seeing defects. He talked about the experiments he had to done through the years. He was able to breed successfully for more generations than one would think you could, but in the end it was all just an experiment and he told me that he personally would never inbreed/linebreed past the third generation. At least that's how I remember the conversation. At that point I hadn't learned to take notes when I speak with him.... he is a wealth of information.

    I have nine ducks from Dave and they are all healthy as can be, though they are different breeds than the ones you mentioned.

    This is now the third time I've seen something like this come up since I've been on the boards (the first two times were birds not being of type). In all cases we've said the same thing. Call Dave. If they did call, they didn't come back here and tell us how it went. I would hope that when talking about health that people would want to speak to the breeder. Millie usually answers and screens the phone calls.

    Holderread Waterfowl Farm
    PHONE: 1-541-929-5338; Closed Sundays, Christmas & Thanksgiving

    IMPORTANT: if you phone us, please keep in mind that this is a working farm. We apologize for not being able to engage in long conversations, especially during the hatching season when we work 16-to 20-hour days, and are on a very tight schedule. When we are working in the hatchery, we often cannot answer the phone, but we do check the answering machine frequently. From March through June, the best time to reach us is Wednesday through Saturday, 11:00 am to 4:00 pm (Pacific Time).
     
  4. CityChicker

    CityChicker Chillin' With My Peeps

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    I am not sure what is to be gained from this thread because there is likely no solid answer to your question. I have purchased a lot of ducks from Holderread's. I am not in any way unwilling to give them a balanced assessment. Overall, they have been good quality. Of course, the more ducks you have, the more you are going to see variations in quality. I have not seen any signs of excessive inbreeding though.

    On the issue of neurological problems, I am sure that people here remember last spring that a *lot* of people here were posting about losing waterfowl to fairly non-descript neurological problems. There didn't seem to be any pattern with respect to the breeder the birds came from or the breed.

    I got several Welsh Harlequins from Holderread's last Spring and they were exceptionally beautiful (Wifezilla has posted several pictures of them to which people on this board have raved). There were a few minor foot problems that seemed to definitely be feed related. The only other person that had any issue at all already had some issues within her flock. Cetawin also got several WH from them this year and I think hers have been beautiful as well (unless that has changed and I am not aware).

    Anyway, overall, they were gorgeous. The type was good. The color was good, etc...
     
  5. MissPrissy

    MissPrissy Overrun With Chickens Premium Member

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    I echo the advise to contact Dave Holderread directly and discuss the issues you are seeing. All of these issues can be genetic and they also can be a nutritional development as well.


    I got my silver appleyards from there they have been wonderful. No issues whatsoever at any time.
     
  6. call ducks

    call ducks silver appleyard addict

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    what er water bilees ? i have SA's so would like to know thanks
     
  7. Wifezilla

    Wifezilla Positively Ducky

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    The quality difference between my Holderread's ducks and my Metzer's duck is obvious. Don't get me wrong...all are healthy, but body type, feathering, etc... are MUCH better on the Holderread's ducks. CityChicker raised the Holderreads ducks in a big group and despite that, once they got in to my smaller flock setting they got almost as tame as the ducks I raised from a few days old. (Tweak eats from my hand and I can even stroke the front of his neck without him running away now...LOL)

    Now the advantage to Metzer was the ability to only get a few ducks and to get them sexed.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2009
  8. AnconaDuck

    AnconaDuck Out Of The Brooder

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    Thanks for the input!!

    I agree 100% with what everyone is saying- Dave's birds are 110% better in type and color, pattern, etc. than other hatcheries. They are always so healthy and just overall, the best show quality birds we have ever found.

    I will give him a call. The issue that we are concerned about is that there are people across the US, feeding different feeds, and in a different climate, etc. that are noticing the sames issues in the same breeds. This is why we are hesitant to blame it on feed. We talked with an avian specialist, and she also suggested more genetic than nutrition. I dont want to knock the Holderreads, they have been SO excellent everytime we talk duck with them. They are truly extrodinary people! We are just wondering if this is something that anyone else has seen. I am sure they would want to know for their own reference.

    I hope this did not come across as "blaming" the Holderreads for anything. That is NOT the case at all!! I RESPECT their work MORE than anyone can understand. Their work with rare breeds is exceptional! It was more a question many people have contacted me with, and I thought some other opinons would be helpful.

    Thanks!
     
  9. bird

    bird Chillin' With My Peeps

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    The Ancona Duck wrote "Welsh Harlequin- Many ducks have issues with their nervous system. No balance, cannot stand up, etc. There are 4 or 5 people that have had this issue in day olds on uo." Is it possible they to be damaged during the shipping? [​IMG] I got WH as a day old from Holderreads and they were and they are fine all the time, but I am in ....Oregon .[​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  10. Wifezilla

    Wifezilla Positively Ducky

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    Your girls look just like my Lexus [​IMG] Such pretty babies
     

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