How do you sex a white pharaoh?

Discussion in 'Turkeys' started by Heather J, Nov 23, 2008.

  1. Heather J

    Heather J Chillin' With My Peeps

    955
    1
    141
    May 29, 2008
    I have four coturnix, three are brown, and though they don't have all of their belly feathers yet (they're only two weeks old), the ones that are coming in on the edges look white, not reddish, so I'm thinking i got all girls there. That leaves me with a white one that has a couple of black dots on it's head and back--that's got to be a white pharaoh, right? So how do I know if it's a girl or boy? I'm thinking if my brown ones all turn out girls I'll see if I can trade the white for a boy, or just straight out buy me a boy to breed them with.

    And is it still way too early to tell about the gender on a bobwhite? They're the same age. I know I'll have to separate the breeds in another couple of weeks because the coturnix are growing so fast.

    And while I'm on the subject, sort of, are pharaohs jumbo sized? I heard they were. All my coturnix are the same size and I was wondering if I have regular or jumbos...

    thanks
     
  2. therealsilkiechick

    therealsilkiechick ShowGirl Queen

    Jul 18, 2007
    Northwestern, pa
    it sounds to me like u have 3 choc tibetons and a pied texas a & m. but browns could be pharaoh's if they r wild patterned. they r way to young to sex for both breeds i think but not 100% on that with the bobs been many years since i've hatched them but if i remember right yes on them also.

    i can't remember if pharaohs come in jumbo or not i'd have to ask dh in the am. however choc tibetons definately do cause we had both. we did not see size difference till they hit maturity and kept growing and they laid eggs 3 times as big as our other girls. their eggs were the size of the small silkie eggs at times.
     
  3. CrimsonRose

    CrimsonRose Chillin' With My Peeps

    212
    8
    111
    Nov 7, 2008
    Southern Ohio
    As far as I know their is three type of quail Button, coturnix, and bob white... Which do you have? Bob Whites are totally different than coturnix but it sounds like you have coturnix...

    The coturnix are also known by many names such as pharaoh... They do have different classification based on color... a white coturnix (sometimes with blackspots) is known as a Texas A&M They are a Jumbo breed... (they are only a couple of ounces more than the normal so not too much difference in size)

    The white ones are almost impossible to Sex... Some say by about week four you can check their vent area but I have no clue what to look for they all look the same to me... LOL

    Although once you get to raising them you can sometimes tell by behavior and most of all in coturnix quail the female is slightly larger than the males plus she will have a nice plump breast the male have a trimmer breast (so it's easier to mate... bigger breast makes it harder to climb on top the female) This is just my experience and I can typically tell what they are by about week 2... But every now and then you get a plump male... LOL

    As for behavior all my male tend to be more active pecking at things, along with being more vocal and such... plus my females tend to sleep on the ground while the male sleep standing... Again these are just my observations and not scientific facts... But I've only been wrong about one little roo (he was big and fat and really tame compared to my other boys)

    If all this fails you can always wait until about 6 to 8 weeks where they will either start to crow or lay an egg... [​IMG] (sorry but this is the most accurate method for me anyways)
     
  4. monarc23

    monarc23 Coturnix Obsessed

    8,672
    67
    301
    Jul 18, 2008
    Indiana, Pennsylvania
    there is no pied in coturnix...not yet atleast [​IMG]


    sexing at 4 weeks is almost impossible on a & ms unles you're a pro at vent sexing. Which i am not so i really cant help, at breeding age (as long as they are breeding) you can sex them easily.


    Also, the A& MS can have brown spots on their head and even their backs this isnt a pied pattern. Theres only tuxedo which is a mix between an A&M and a tibe (they're just called tibetan aka british range not chocolate tibe). Sorry i get particular with the colors, but theres too many peeps calling them things they aren't [​IMG]

    Pharoahs mean normal wild size and normal wild color
    Jumbos are significantly larger than Pharoahs--there is a biiiig size difference as long as you have a well bred one. I only have ONE exceptionably large jumbo and she's HUGE! Jumbos can get to an lb in weight, where as pharoahs stay around onlya few ozs.

    Jumbos come in all colors, Pharoah is only in wild color, Tibetan (british range) is a color, but if you breed them to jumbos you'll eventually get a jumbo tibetan but i've never seen a jumbo tibetan, but I hope to breed mine to jumbo. A purewhite (or with spots) coturnix depending on it's size is either jumbo or english white the only real difference being size. Tuxedo i've only ever seen in normal sized, however since they are bred to A & Ms to be produced over time through selective breeding youcould produce a jumbo tuxedo and so on! [​IMG]

    So far all I have in jumbo is Golden Jumbo, Jumbo Brown (which is just a wild colored coturnix supersized) and A & Ms which are jumbos but only my one A & M quail is large enough to be considered a correct sized jumbo. I need to get her weighed she may actually hit an lb in weight !:)Many breeders dont selectively breed they just let their birds breed freely and this is where colors get confused and where sizes don't stay correct. Which is why theres confusion.

    if your birds at 6 weeks are the size of an american robin...they are normal wild sized
    if your birds at 8 weeks are the size of a LARGE pigeon...they are jumbo sized
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2008
  5. therealsilkiechick

    therealsilkiechick ShowGirl Queen

    Jul 18, 2007
    Northwestern, pa
    i've raised and bred quails for years off and on and i beg to differ with that i know my colors and coturnix. [​IMG] i'd like to know where u get ur info. i've raised tuxedo and that is the cross u said but what i refer to as pied is a coloration that is a & m cross pharoh it is not the same thing and yes the full name is chocolate tibetan for the other.

    there is many breeds of quail far many more than 3 and yes the op has coturnix. the different names r the different colors she has. and yes a & m's come in both regular and jumbo sizes i had to ask DH. we have had jumbos but i couldn't remember wich all colors they came in. closer to maturity yes alot of times their behavior u can sex them before they hit maturity sometimes u can't though but yes whites r the hardest to tell. once they hit maturity u can vent sex any of the colorations and males will excreat white foam and females will not with coturnix.
     
  6. monarc23

    monarc23 Coturnix Obsessed

    8,672
    67
    301
    Jul 18, 2008
    Indiana, Pennsylvania
    Quote:I get my information from the actual breeders who've been breeding for decades. Coturnix Corner for one (www.coturnixcorner.com). For another through reading and researching online.

    You can call a & ms with brown spots Pied all you want but it's not a true pattern. [​IMG] it's a mismark. It's just like how i have normal brown coturnix with white on their shoulders, it doesnt make them pied it's just a mismark. When there are offically pieds you betcha i'll be interested in breeding them! [​IMG] esp in black---which there are black coturnix but i've never seen one.

    edited to add, Tibetans are actually known as British Range but i use both names since some known them as tibetans.

    We can agree to disagree. [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2008
  7. therealsilkiechick

    therealsilkiechick ShowGirl Queen

    Jul 18, 2007
    Northwestern, pa
    did u post the link wrong? i can't get it to work and would like to check it out never heard of that site before. tried to copy and paste that didn't work either.
     
  8. monarc23

    monarc23 Coturnix Obsessed

    8,672
    67
    301
    Jul 18, 2008
    Indiana, Pennsylvania
    Quote:you have to click on the tiny x'ed out box and it will redirect youto their new forum. I dont have their new addy mesmorized so I always just type www.coturnixcorner.com then click the x'ed out box and it redirects me.
     
  9. farmereggjoe14

    farmereggjoe14 New Egg

    1
    0
    6
    Nov 24, 2008
    IF THEY ARE ABOUT 3 WEEKS OLD THEN THE MALES IN BOTH BREEDS WILL STAAND UP ABOUT 5 INCHES AND LET OUT A LOUD SOUND. THE MALES ARE THE ONLY ONES THAT HOLLER
     
  10. monarc23

    monarc23 Coturnix Obsessed

    8,672
    67
    301
    Jul 18, 2008
    Indiana, Pennsylvania
    Quote:crowing at three weeks in coturnix would be pretty rare...4-5 weeks is more understandable but some even wait longer to crow. Relying on crows at 3 weeks isnt a good idea. Butif it works for you great. Mine didnt crow at 3 weeks, didnt crow at 6 weeks, and still havent crowed and they're going on several months old. Depends on time of year and conditions they are kept in to wether or not they will mature young or not.
     

BackYard Chickens is proudly sponsored by