If I breed silver laced roo to a blue can I get blue laced?

Discussion in 'General breed discussions & FAQ' started by muslw4, Nov 1, 2013.

  1. muslw4

    muslw4 Chillin' With My Peeps

    123
    1
    101
    May 7, 2011
    Northern Illinois
    My friend has some blue laced wyandottes that are stunning. We want to get more of these but not sure what breeding goes into them. If we bred a silver laced male to a blue female then back to....not sure maybe siblings? could we get blue laced? I read a while back that breeding blue laced red hens to silver laced male would get 50% blue laced female. How would you get a blue laced roo?
     
  2. Egghead_Jr

    Egghead_Jr Overrun With Chickens

    6,034
    837
    336
    Oct 16, 2010
    NEK, VT
    I don't believe the wyandotte blues have been accepted to the standard yet. If they were it'd make sense it would call for lacing as you've got golden and silver laced variety. Blue Plymouth Rocks are in SOP and call for lacing that's all but been lost in the States. More of an edging now and that's on the better quality birds.

    You'd want a superior quality laced Rooster over the blue Wyandotte hens then sire him over the blue pullets the second year. It will take a lot of chicks on the ground with this matting but you'll find a few that have the good lacing you want (make sure it's complete lacing too). You could use the same rooster again or find a few quality Silver Laced hens and have the best Blue laced rooster over them and few best laced blue sisters. Eventually you want to get diverse blood in the flock so if not third year definitely fourth you'd use new Silver Laced blood to deepen the gene pool.

    If you put the brothers and sisters of first mating to mate I believe you'll have a harder time putting enough chicks on the ground to find a fully laced blue offspring so I'd use the same Silver Laced sire second and likely third year for quality of lacing he'd impose on the flock. On third year the lacing should be set so any Silver with Blue laced matings will result in silver blue lace, silver laced, black and blue laced. Blue laced over blue laced results in same but with a splash also.

    I've played with the "chicken calculator" for possibly days trying to figure different ways to get true lacing in the Blue Plymouths... So take my suggestions for what they are- calculating chicken play.
     
  3. muslw4

    muslw4 Chillin' With My Peeps

    123
    1
    101
    May 7, 2011
    Northern Illinois
    Thank you! I've played with the chicken calculator but don't fully understand it yet. I figure that is a project to work on for winter. I'm not worried about showing, I just like breeding for pets, eggs, backyard flocks. Plus I'm addicted to hatching eggs and it gives me a goal to work towards.

    I didn't realize plymoth rock came in blues or blue laceing. Too many great chicken breeds to choose from.
    Thanks agin for the advice! It sounds like a plan!
     
  4. Egghead_Jr

    Egghead_Jr Overrun With Chickens

    6,034
    837
    336
    Oct 16, 2010
    NEK, VT
    If you look around at photos you'll see here in the U.S. we've all but bred out the lacing on the Blues. This grainy photo from 1919 still shows a stunning bird.

    You'll have an easier time at it with Wyandotte than Rock breeders as long as you use top quality Silver Laced in your project.

    Good Luck.


    [​IMG]
     
  5. Makomd

    Makomd Chillin' With My Peeps

    750
    26
    128
    Jul 24, 2011
    ES of MD , USA
    If you are looking for Blue Silver Laced Wyandotte (or Violet laced Wyandotte as they are called in Europe, it is a fairly easy to breed). Here's a picture to make sure this is what you are looking for. http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.feathersite.com/Poultry/CGP/Wyand/GBVioletLacedWyP.JPEG&imgrefurl=http://www.feathersite.com/Poultry/CGP/Wyand/BRKWyand.html&h=300&w=328&sz=36&tbnid=BOPkgP3x53r76M:&tbnh=90&tbnw=98&zoom=1&usg=__RSNW6PQKiEipxme_3mekZGOXMy4=&docid=3tTUujf7tQ2JmM&sa=X&ei=0id0UqP2HoPLsATt3IGgBA&ved=0CCwQ9QEwAA

    Disregard if this is not what you are looking for.

    Breeding a solid colored bird with a laced bird leads to a lots and lots of hatching as said by egghead jr.

    The easiest route I have found is:

    If you have a Silver laced male and a BLRW splash female you will get two outcomes. Males will be blue brassy silver laced (I would not use) and females will be blue silver laced, but will still have Mahogany gene which will bleed into the colors and still need to be worked out.

    Use this female bred to a Silver Laced Male as before and 25% of the offspring will pure Blue Silver Laced Wyandottes. I would breed for a splash male and breed over a regular black silver laced female, if I was more interested in breeding Blue Silver Laced.

    I currently have a rooster that is a blue silver laced, but he has the mahogany and brassiness, will have to do a few more hatches and culls but can still get the blue silver laced in the next hatch.

    Cross 1
    [​IMG] * [​IMG]
    ebeb CoCo PgPg MlMl SS ww IdId RR ebeb CoCo PgPg MlMl MhMh BlBl ww Id- RR
    zwart getekend zilver gezoomd [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    black patterned silver laced [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ] vuilwit getekend rood gezoomd [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    splash patterned red laced [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]


    50% Hanen blauw getekend geel gezoomd [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    50% Hennen blauw getekend roodgeschouderd/creme gezoomd [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]


    50% Cockerels blue patterned yellow/golden laced [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    50% Pullets blue patterned redshouldered/cream laced [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]

    Cross 2
    [​IMG] * [​IMG]
    ebeb CoCo PgPg MlMl SS ww IdId RR ebeb CoCo PgPg MlMl Mhmh+ Blbl+ S- ww Id- RR
    zwart getekend zilver gezoomd [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    black patterned silver laced [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ] blauw getekend roodgeschouderd/creme gezoomd [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    blue patterned redshouldered/cream laced [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]


    12.5% Hennen blauw getekend roodgeschouderd/creme gezoomd [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    12.5% Hanen blauw getekend roodgeschouderd/creme gezoomd [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    12.5% Hennen blauw getekend zilver gezoomd [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    12.5% Hanen blauw getekend zilver gezoomd [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    12.5% Hennen zwart getekend roodgeschouderd/creme gezoomd [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    12.5% Hanen zwart getekend roodgeschouderd/creme gezoomd [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    12.5% Hennen zwart getekend zilver gezoomd [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    12.5% Hanen zwart getekend zilver gezoomd [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]


    12.5% Pullets blue patterned redshouldered/cream laced [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    12.5% Cockerels blue patterned redshouldered/cream laced [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    12.5% Pullets blue patterned silver laced [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    12.5% Cockerels blue patterned silver laced [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    12.5% Pullets black patterned redshouldered/cream laced [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    12.5% Cockerels black patterned redshouldered/cream laced [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    12.5% Pullets black patterned silver laced [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
    12.5% Cockerels black patterned silver laced [ Yellowskin Lightshank? Rosecomb ]
     
  6. muslw4

    muslw4 Chillin' With My Peeps

    123
    1
    101
    May 7, 2011
    Northern Illinois
    Yes, Makomd, that looks similar to my friend's birds. She has hens she got from a lady that got them from somewhere else she can't remember where. They were supposed to be BLRW which 3 turned out to be but then 3 turned out a blue with charcoal lacing but then one was like a blue with silver lacing. I need to get pictures of them. They were all just beautiful. I had read on another post about breeding BLRW hen to silver roos but then getting male offspring that were pale yellow with lacing that didn't breed true. I was wondering how one would get a blue laced roo. I have 3 blrw hens and can get some blue hens. Just looking for some nice silver roos now. I may try both methods and see what happens. I usually have no problem selling extra hens and extra roos get processed for the freezer.

    I do like the sound of Violet laced....of course blue-silver laced sounds nice too!
     
  7. Makomd

    Makomd Chillin' With My Peeps

    750
    26
    128
    Jul 24, 2011
    ES of MD , USA
    If the roo is yellowish or silver with gold (brassiness) he likely just carries a gold and a silver gene. Which means you will have half the chicks will come out brassy but the other half should be silver, so it shouldn't be too hard.

    I think their are a few others breeding for the Violet laced on the BYC, I love the look, so I am working on it as well and plan to use it the Violet laced in a few other projects as well.
     
  8. donrae

    donrae Hopelessly Addicted Premium Member

    31,451
    3,546
    538
    Jun 18, 2010
    Southern Oregon
    never mind.....nothing to see here......
     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2013
  9. tadkerson

    tadkerson Chillin' With My Peeps

    1,984
    124
    204
    Jul 19, 2008
    Missouri
    I agree with Egghead. If you use a blue laced red in the breeding regimen, then you will have to deal with autosomal red and the gold allele. Silver is the way to go- a silver male will produce silver females. If the blue hens you use carry gold- the gold does not affect the female outcome in the first cross. If the blue hens carry autosomal red, then it may be expressed in the first back cross offspring. In both males and females the autosomal red will show on their backs. The first generation of laced birds will show some false spangling which is the expression of the incorrect combination of genes that produce lacing. Lacing is a polygenic trait. In your first back cross, 1 in 8 chicks should be purebred for the genes they need to show acceptable lacing- so you will have to hatch a bunch of chicks ( as Egghead stated). You will also get some birds with false spangling on the breast and some with false spangling on other areas of the body. Some other varieties also- over half of the birds will be columbian restricted and show the previously mentioned secondary patterns. You may also get some birds that look like they are birchen- these are false birchen due to hybridization at certain gene loci. Do not sell them as birchen or breed for the birchen variety using the birds.

    Tim
     
  10. nicalandia

    nicalandia Overrun With Chickens

    6,337
    325
    288
    Jul 16, 2009
    Quote:no, you will get black and blue colored birds... you see All blue or all Black Birds have Extended Black(E) which is Dominant over eb(laced birds background) so your birds will be E/eb and will moslikey be all black with some color leaking
     

BackYard Chickens is proudly sponsored by