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If she's not eggbound... then what?

Discussion in 'Emergencies / Diseases / Injuries and Cures' started by AmyRey, Oct 24, 2015.

  1. AmyRey

    AmyRey Chillin' With My Peeps

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    I've done all I know to do, so help me out here.

    I've got an old girl (4-5 years old maybe) white leghorn. When she was laying, she never had any issues. I really only remember maybe one or two double yolkers. My flock had always free ranged during the day 100% until a few months ago when I enclosed a fenced in area and moved them to a new larger, much better coop. They still had plenty of grass, sunshine, bugs, etc and I would let them out each night and let them wander for a few hours before bedtime. I also have always provided them with laying pellets, though not exclusively. They have mostly foraged for probably 90% of their intake.

    A couple of months ago, I noticed that she looked fatter on the back end. Like I said, she's old so she hasn't been a regular layer for a while now so not getting any eggs from her (she's my only white egg girl) for a while didn't really spark any concern. She was acting normal, eating normal, pooping normal, etc. Off and on though, she looks like she's in discomfort and for the last few weeks, she's gotten worse and worse.

    Virtually every weekend, I perform the egg-unbinding routine... very warm water, massage, olive oil and digital exam but nothing ever happens. I'll dry her off and put her back out with the others a day or two later. She'll look like she's doing maybe a little better (though never an egg) and then by the weekend, she's bad enough again that we do the whole egg-unbinding routine all over again.

    I have examined her digitally (much more thoroughly than both of us were comfortable with) and I do not feel an egg or anything that resembles an egg. In fact, I can only seem to examine one "tract" I don't know if this is her digestive tract or her reproductive tract. But everything is very firm and super distended. If there's an egg in there, it's the size of a grapefruit now (which is obviously impossible.) I hope.

    This week, she's gotten noticeably worse. She's having a very hard time walking and can no longer jump up on the roost or even up the chicken stairs that lead into the coop. She's still eating, still drinking and (I think) still able to eliminate. She doesn't appear to be in distress yet, but is definitely in an extreme amount of discomfort.

    Being egg bound is my guess - all signs point me to that... no eggs for months; swollen, heavy rear; trouble walking; pulsing vent; droopy tail, penguin-y gait (when she could still walk) but if that's the case, she's been egg bound for a couple of months now and that doesn't seem possible. If she's egg bound, shouldn't she be dead by now? [​IMG]

    A little while ago we just finished soaking for a couple of hours, fed her a TUMS, gave her lots of water (she ate a bowl of layer pellets) and examined her again - hate to be gross here but I examined as far in as I physically could. Her vent is not prolapsed and looks completely normal, aside from the giant bulge underneath.

    Any other ideas? Tumor? [​IMG]
     
  2. XxMingirlxX

    XxMingirlxX Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Do you have a photo?
     
  3. Wol1

    Wol1 Chillin' With My Peeps

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    It could be egg peritonitis. An egg breaks inside, gets infected, the reproductive tract gets swollen, more eggs pile up behind the first. I've had two golden comets with this. It happened over a few weeks. I also did the egg unbind stuff, and didn't find anything obvious. When I would do that, lots of fluid would come out, but no egg. That relieved the pressure, I guess. The swollen oviduct also presses on the digestive tract, so she was only able to get small amounts of food through. She was passing stuff that looked like curdled egg and lots of liquid. Later, she started passing bright, egg yolk yellow stuff. The vet said that was a sign of liver failure. If your girl was only sporadically laying eggs, then it could take a few months. A tumor also sounds like a possibility. I would suggest that you put her somewhere separate, maybe with a friend to keep her company so that you can get a clear idea of what she's eating and pooping.
    A very long thread on egg peritonitis is here, and includes our saga. https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/...-implant-and-or-spay-egg-yolk-peritonitis/120
     
  4. AmyRey

    AmyRey Chillin' With My Peeps

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    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    She's still slightly wet from this morning's soaking and her back end sticks out past her vent now, so she's pooping on her on butt, hence why she's so icky.

    Again, she's still eating, still drinking and still pooping. But she looks very tired, probably from being handled so much this morning and falls asleep while standing up.

    I've got her isolated in the coop and she can walk around a little in it, but not much. And it looks like every few seconds, she sort of strains (like she is about to poop) but then nothing happens. She does still poop though, and it looks normal... not watery.
     
  5. AmyRey

    AmyRey Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Thank you, Wol for the suggestion. I've been reading all afternoon about e.y.p. and that definitely sounds closer to what I'm dealing with than egg boundedness(?).

    I see people have had luck treating e.y.p. with Duramycin-10 so I hit up our Tractor Supply. Of course, as is usually my luck, they didn't have any, but they did have Durvet 72-200. So after way too much math for me on a Saturday, I've given her an injection of 0.25mg. The PDF dosing guide linked in another thread suggests (I think) about three times that for her weight, but it also notes "q3-5d" which I think might be 3x/day for 5 days... Which would make the math about right. I've got a call into a nurse cousin to find out for sure. ETA: multiple reputable sources believe "q3-5d" means just one dose, given every three to five days.

    Also am gonna give her a smidge of baby aspirin for pain/fever/swelling and some Pedialyte.

    And it looks like draining some of the 'fluid' off with a syringe might be appropriate also, but I'll have to do some more research on that first.

    In the meantime, she's resting (un)comfortably in the coop with a buddy, our most docile hen. I've noticed that her weakness and lethargy was beginning to get her picked on by some of the others. Chickens are jerks.

    Will report back later. Thank you again. :)

    I'm sorry about your girl. *hugs*
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2015
  6. Eggcessive

    Eggcessive Chicken Obsessed Premium Member

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  7. casportpony

    casportpony Team Tube Feeding Captain & Poop Inspector General Premium Member

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    Has her comb always been that small?

    -Kathy
     
  8. microchick

    microchick Overrun With Chickens

    I'm curious to hear your nurse friend's opinion of that dosage because I'd be calling doc for a clarification order. Cause the way I am reading that is 'q' means 'every' '3-5d' could mean every 3 to 5 days. Yep I'm a retired nurse and I showed it to my husband, also a retired medical professional and he agreed that it's vague at best and he would never get a pharmacist to fill an RX that he wrote that way.
     
    1 person likes this.
  9. casportpony

    casportpony Team Tube Feeding Captain & Poop Inspector General Premium Member

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    I think you're correct... 3 times a day would be written as TID, I think.

    -Kathy
     
    1 person likes this.
  10. AmyRey

    AmyRey Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Her comb is flopped over to her right side. It's always been floppy, but it is a little floppier than usual. Color is still fairly good.

    I talked to the nurse cousin. It seems q3-5d means once every 3-5 days. I'm sure glad I asked. She also agreed on the increased dosage, but I haven't given her the extra yet.

    She had the aspirin and I tried to drain some of the fluid from her abdomen. I got nothing from the main part, but it felt almost like another layer of fluid surrounding the really firm part. I did get some clear, slightly yellow liquid from several spots around her belly and those have continued to weep since then. The drainage has no noticeable smell.

    I let everyone out to roam a bit before dark and once she got back in with the crowd, she perked up amazingly. She was standing up straighter, not having to balance herself with her wings, walked a good bit and even climbed up a nearby stair. But when I went back out half an hour or so later, I couldn't find her at first, but eventually did... All alone, slumped over on her side. I really thought she was dead. :(

    But I picked her up and she woke up. I don't know if she just exhausted herself in those few minutes or if she's still getting worse. :/

    I'm going out in a minute to give her the extra Duramycin. I sure hope she makes it through the night. :/
     

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