medications and additives for healthy flock

Discussion in 'Peafowl' started by Silver pied, Mar 27, 2016.

  1. Silver pied

    Silver pied Out Of The Brooder

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    many responders have advised keeping flocks healthy by using additive
    what medications, vitamins, additives etc would you recommend for healthy flocks to keep them healthy and what are good sources for them.
     
  2. ChickenCanoe

    ChickenCanoe True BYC Addict

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    IMHO, no medications unless condition warrants.. Feeding a good quality, fresh complete feed is the best approach.
    The only thing I would include is a good probiotic. I give Gro2Max in chicks first water and then periodically their whole lives. I'm sure it is good for all fowls.
    http://www.gro2max.com/

    There's a person with lots of peafowl experience here called Casportpony.
    She does a lot of medicating though.

    IMO, if they need medicating, they aren't robust enough to keep around.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2016
  3. MeepBeep

    MeepBeep Chillin' With My Peeps

    As said you really don't need supplements if you provide a good balanced diet to start with... Also a properly maintained and cleaned living and ranging area is very important... Improper ventilation in the coop is a main cause of illness in chickens/peafowl, keep the fresh air flowing, feed a good balanced diet and keep the coop and ranging area clean and for the most part chickens/peafowl will be healthy...
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2016
  4. Trefoil

    Trefoil Chillin' With My Peeps

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    The problem lies in not knowing what is a balanced diet for each individual pea. or chicken for that matter. Add to that-how sure can you be about any commercially produced diet. I'm not big on medicating my birds, but that's because I haven't had to be, Give me a sick pea and my outlook will change. I add vionate semi weekly and especially during the summer make herbs available to them. I feed all my birds fermented feed in addition to pellets or crumbles. They mostly eat the fermented until its gone. My young birds get ACV in their water and because I have ducks I add brewers yeast to the fermented just before feeding. I worry a lot less about the diet my free range birds get because they aren't limited to what I give them.
    To someone new to peas I would recommend gamebird as the staple food. In addition to that I would add ACV to their water, and give a good vit/mineral mix a couple of times a week. Grit and oyster shell always available. And, when you have veggies or seafood for dinner, give them the leftovers. Nuts and grapes are also good treats. As you gain experience what you feed may change. If your bird are getting sick, there is something wrong, either feed or housing. I don't mean one bird once, I mean if there seems to be something always going wrong.
     
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  5. Silver pied

    Silver pied Out Of The Brooder

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    I need some clarification.
    What is vionate.
    What is your formula for fermented grains.
    In other posts there are references to acv
    I think I have determined that means apple cider vinegar. Is that correct.
     
  6. Trefoil

    Trefoil Chillin' With My Peeps

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    vionate
    Suggested Use
    Bird
    Serving
    Small Birds

    (parakeets, finches, canaries, etc.) 1/8 teaspoon per bird
    Medium Birds
    (Cockatiels, small Parrots, Lovebirds, Mynahs, etc.) 1/8 - 1/4 teaspoon per bird
    Large Birds
    (large Parrots, Cockatoos, Macaws, etc.) 1/4 - 1/2 teaspoon per bird
    Extra Large Birds
    (Pheasants, Geese, Swans, Ostriches, Peacocks, Emus, etc) 1/2 - 1 teaspoon per bird
    Mix with food daily

    Ingredients: Degermed Corn Meal, Calcium Carbonate, Salt, Ferrous Carbonate, Magnesium Oxide, Niacin, Calcium Pantothenate, Calcium, BHT (Butylated Hydroxytoluene (Preservative)) DI-Atocopheryl Acetate, Vitamin A Palmitate, Thiamine Mononitrate, Manganous Oxide, Cupric Sulfate, Calcium Iodate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Cobalt Carbonate, Folic Acid, D-Activated Animal Sterol (Vitamin D3), and Cyanocobalamin (B12).

    Vitamin/Mineral Content
    per kg
    Vitamin A 220,000 i.u. Vitamin D3 22,000 i.u.
    Vitamin B1 39.6 mg Vitamin B2 79.2 mg
    Vitamin B6 9.98 mg Vitamin B12 0.15 mg
    Calcium Pantothenate 110 mg Niacin 275 mg
    Folic Acid 2.2 mg Choline Chloride 5,720 mg
    Ascorcic Acid 2,494.8 mg Vitamin E 119 i.u.
    Calcium 9.5%
    94,802.4 mg
    min Calcium 11.4%
    113,732 mg
    max
    Phosphorous 4.79%
    47,828 mg Iodine 0.0022%
    22 mg
    Salt 0.5%
    4,994 mg
    min Salt 1.5%
    14,982 mg
    max
    Iron 0.055%
    550 mg Cobalt 0.00055%
    5.5 mg
    Copper 0.0055
    55 mg Magnesium 00.0424%
    423.6 mg
    Manganese 0.0076%
    75.68 mg

    My formula for fermented feed varies somewhat, but basically, I ferment chicken scratch, sunflower seeds, and whatever veggies I have on hand,peas, zuchani (?), squash, pumpkin or whatever. After draining and before feeding I add brewers yeast, vionate, and a cup or 2 of calf manna..
    ACV is apple cider vinegar.
    I buy vionate where ever its cheapest, last time it was amazon.
     
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  7. ChickenCanoe

    ChickenCanoe True BYC Addict

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    https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/645057/fermented-feeds-anyone-using-them

    The suggestion to stick with a game bird feed is a good one.

    ACV is apple cider vinegar but not just any one will help. It doesn't need to be organic but it must be raw. Pasteurized ACV has had the beneficial enzymes destroyed by heat.
    Braggs Organic ACV is the easiest raw to find but if you have apple orchards nearby, they may sell a raw product as well.
     
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  8. Garden Peas

    Garden Peas Chillin' With My Peeps

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    I'm glad to see that folks are mentioning game bird feed now -- in my experience (which I got the hard way), chicken feed is not adequate to maintain peafowl in optimum body condition and health.

    Unfortunately, there does not seem to have been a lot of research done on peafowl nutritional requirements. I seem to recall that some of the early recommendations were based off turkey needs. I think there was some research on trying to simulate a "natural" diet (perhaps what would have been found in the wild) -- I think there was an article by Morishita (the same person who co-authored Birdrain's new book) -- it used to be available on the UPA forum, and may have been in a way-back issue of Peafowl Today, or it could be that I am conflating two articles in my aging brain. [​IMG] At any rate, there is little definitive or authoritative published literature as far as I can tell.

    Starting from what we do know, we can look at some general parameters.

    1. Peafowl are not chickens. Technically, they are not poultry, they are pheasants. (However, the US Government, undaunted by biology, classifies them as "poultry" for FDA purposes.)
    2. Peafowl evolved in India and SE Asia, where the diet would not have included corn, alfalfa and other western ingredients. They do seem able to thrive on diets which include those. (Chickens, which were domesticated from jungle fowl, also are believed to have originated in those regions.)
    3. Free-ranging peafowl do eat a lot of insects and even lizards. Chickens also eat a lot of bugs, idk about lizards.
    4. Peafowl have somewhat different nutritional requirements than chickens. Feathers are composed largely of protein, and replacing feathers on peafowl is one example of a time when peafowl can be observed to need higher protein in order to grow healthy, vibrant plumage. Chickens do benefit from extra protein during molt as well.
    5. During certain growth phases, peafowl which consume very high levels of protein have been observed to experience higher rates of structural deformities (e.g. twisted tibia), perhaps as a result of growing too fast. This is similarly observed in turkeys and in large dogs versus small dogs, and even horses. In general, this phenomenon appears to be related to growth rate, adult body size AND age to maturity.

    The phrase "chicken feed" includes quite a variety of feeds -- a trip to Tractor Supply will quickly demonstrate a range of protein contents, calcium and other supplement content (laying feeds usually are supplemented with higher calcium), and kinds of ingredients. Chick starter, chick grower and layer all have different protein levels. Be aware that even the same "name" for a feed by the same manufacturer may not be the same across the US, as there are local/regional mills, and source ingredients may vary by availability and pricing in a particular region. There are also smaller mills and private label feeds which provide other options for some owners.

    Notice that higher protein feeds, usually marketed as gamebird feeds (sold for turkeys, pheasants, quail, etc.) also are labeled as "show bird" feeds, with a recommendation to use them for showbirds including chickens. The extra protein makes for better plumage and body weight. More protein and more supplements often mean higher cost, as do some kinds of ingredients and/or protein sources.

    There are a number of theories about how best to feed peafowl, and even more ideas about how to feed chickens -- a little searching on BYC will turn up a plethora of opinions. If there is any consensus, it seems to be the need for higher protein during certain life/growth stages.

    The single most important thing any pea owner can do is to learn to carefully look at the birds and discern when they are thriving, when they are ailing, when they are in good body weight and plumage and when they are not. If you can look at a bird and tell its plumage is off, its weight is down, or it is too plump, whether it has sufficient energy or is subdued and showing subtle signs of illness, then everything else follows.

    Also be aware that nutrition can be profoundly affected by bird health and regular preventative health care. Peafowl seem to be more susceptible to some parasitic organisms than other domesticated fowl. Raising peas with chickens and turkeys can expose them to more of those parasites. A pea with a high intestinal worm count will never reach the same level of robust health as one without, because the intestinal worms interfere with the pea's ability to take up nutrients and damage (in some cases, permanently damage) the pea's intestinal system and other internal organs. The best feed in the world will not result in a robust, healthy bird if the bird is suffering from parasites such as worms, coccidia and blackhead. This is why many pea owners choose to worm preventatively on a regular basis; it is the reason that some commercial chick starters are "medicated" for coccidia (which is a leading cause of peachick death), and one of the reasons why learning to carefully observe the birds is key to keeping them healthy.
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2016
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  9. casportpony

    casportpony Team Tube Feeding Captain & Poop Inspector General Premium Member Project Manager

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    Peafowl can be susceptible to coccidiosis, worms, blackhead, enteritis, E. coli. Do you have a vet that you will be able to take a sick pea to? If not, would be best to have the medications needed to treat those five.
    • Corid, Amprol, AmproMed, etc. (amprolium for coccidiosis)
    • Safeguard (fenbendazole) for worms
    • Metronidazole (Fish-Zole, AquaZole, Meditrich, Flagyl, etc) for blackhead (histomoniasis) or enterits from clostridia.
    • Baytril for E. Coli and many other very nasty bacterial infections.

    With those four drugs you will be able to treat most things that peafowl are susceptible to, *if* you catch it soon enough. All can be purchased without a prescription.

    Probably also a good idea to have a tube and syringe for tube feeding on hand.

    Many pea people are caught off guard when their peas look ill. Peafowl hide their illnesses very well, so quite often they are very close to death by the time one notices them looking ill. Best way to stay ahead of this is to watch them very closely and learn how a healthy pea behaves. Also a good idea to get a baseline weight on them and to make note of their body condition at the time.

    Not trying to scare you, just want you to be prepared in case one gets sick.

    -Kathy
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2016
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  10. casportpony

    casportpony Team Tube Feeding Captain & Poop Inspector General Premium Member Project Manager

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    You all remember this one?

     

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