The Helmuts I got at auction last week are a pair and I think I'm happy about it. I took them to my feed store and the owners raise pigeons on their ranch among other things. They have mostly RIRs. I walked in with them and people oohed and awwwwed and one lady ran over to see how much I wanted for them. The son had told me this weekend to bring them in and he'd sex them for me. I got a pair. He gave me nesting material and said he wants a pair. He was really impressed with them and said I need to let his dad see them. Guess they are a nice pair and in great health. Guess dad loves his pigeons and especially the black and white ones. The son said his dad used to raise Nuns that he just loved when he was younger. Anyway the place was packed and everyone wanted to know what I was charging for pairs. I have NO IDEA! But I do want more of them, because I just fell in love with them. I was hoping they were a pair just because I do want more. OK so now I have to learn about pigeons all over again. What is it about me and birds? I need breeding advice! I haven't owned pigeons in uuuuuhhmmm 40 years.