New to raising chickens and have an issue

[Katz5617]

I'm sorry I haven't gotten back to this post. My brother passed away yesterday and I have been at the hospital most of the past two days. I haven't had much time to check in on Lady. My husband has been trying to care for her. To answer a couple of questions - the ladies are between 21-22 weeks. Their first worming was with Wazine and now I keep DE out in the run and it is sprinkled in the coop. They're not due for another worming with the wazine for another week - but the guy at Tractor Supply told me if I keep DE out regularly that it is a natural pest control and will work as a wormer as well - I need to double check that - but I wormed the entire flock of five with wazine about three weeks ago. The medicated feed is not the medicated chick starter. A friend that works in a co-op told me to try it - it has erthymycin or something like that - it lists all kinds of things that it is supposed to help with. I started that the day she got wobbly. She seems completely alert. She is not having any breathing difficulties and as soon as the others became aware she was weak they began pecking on her and I moved her to a kennel. The kennel is large enough that she can walk around in it if she chooses and I put a nice layering of straw on the bottom. Instead of walking around she has chosen to "sit". This morning has really been the first morning I have been home and not at the hospital so I coaxed her out with some treats. I she is still giving to the left side - She stretched her right leg and fluttered her right wing - but did not stretch her left leg or wing. She seems more steady on her feet but I can tell she is still giving to the left side. Her eyes are bright and alert - I can't see any blood or feather loss or feel anything - but just the way she stretched the right side and not the left makes me wonder if she injured herself maybe off the perch or if one of the larger girls hurt her. She is the smallest in the flock. Up until now no other has tried to be dominant, but in the last week the BO has pretty much asserted herself as the one in charge and she is the first I noticed to pick on Lady. I left her out on the fenced in patio for about 30 minutes to walk around and she followed me in the house for a little while. I have now put her back outside and put her in the kennel and closed the door so she is confined again. If she is injured - should I keep her somewhat immobile for a while to see if it heals - Like I said I see no obvious injuries but she won't even stretch that side. I did give her a dose of vitamins as well - put I give them all a commercial food that has a good protein content - they have grit, oyster shell and while they have pecked every shred of grass that was in the run - I give them turnips from the garden and every other day I toss them a handful of treats - typically meal worms and cracked corn and seeds. None of them have loose stool and I don't see bugs on any of them. The other four are much larger than Lady with the Buff being larger than all of them - or at least with her feathers she appears to be much bigger. I guess my next question - seems she doesn't seem to be getting worse - I'll keep up with the vitamins and medicated feed - but should I let her out to stroll around the patio and flower bed or keep her inside the kennel. Is it best to keep her more sedentary or would movement be helpful. Thanks all.

 

[KayTee]

I'm so sorry for your loss Katz. Chickens always seem to choose the worst moments to get sick! Mine always do it the day before I have to go away for work for a few days and leave my husband looking after them.
Personally I would give her the opportunity to walk around a bit, as long as she is separated from the other girls. It will stop her getting bored and give her a bit of exercise. If she's in too much pain she just won't move very much - she'll decide how much she wants to do.
It sounds like you could be right - it could be an injury from a bigger hen picking on her. If she improves and you put her back with the flock you will have to monitor things closely to see if that's the case.
Let us know how things go.

 

[Katz5617]

I took Lady out in the front yard with me and she will still follow me - but she is still giving tremendously to that left side. Someone had mentioned curling toes - to begin with her toes were not curling - but now on her left leg she is curling the toes under. What is the significance of her curling her toes under. Even with the toes curled under she will get up to follow me and when I sit down come and climb in my lap - did I say she is a big pet - she is a big pet and spoiled rotten. I've done everything everyone has recommended - but after someone mentioned Mareks disease that has me worried because it seems like there is nothing you can do for it. How would a chicken get this when they are not around any other fowl or animals - I have a dog - but he can't get in the fence and after the initial novelty of him running at them when they were biddies behind the fence - now he doesn't even go near their coop and run and we don't have any other animals. It says it is contagious - but no one around me within a several block radius has any chicks. She doesn't seem lethargic. She is eating and drinking and pooping. If I walk around she will toddle along behind me even though she is listing. But right now - what would be the significance of the curling of the toes on that one foot.

 

[BayBay Peepers]

I'm very sorry to hear of your loss

My guess with the toes curling is it could be the starting signs of mareks. From what I understand the virus can live for a long time outside of a host so there's a chance they could have picked it up from wherever you got them from. It doesn't necessarily mean that, but it's a possibility. You're right in saying mareks is contagious so keep an eye on your flock.

As for worming I would recommend something a little stronger like valbazen or safeguard liquid wormer for goats. They each cover a wider variety of worms.

This may sounds strange, but have you tried lightly massaging the leg? Or maybe even rigging something up where she could relax and stretch it a bit. I had a very ill hen that had trouble standing. (not the same as yours she was just so sick her muscle was deteriorating) I took a towel and cut two strips long enough for me to slip her feet through. I put it over a large box so her feet wouldn't really touch the bottom and would let her just kind of hang out a minute in her "sling" while I tried to feed her.

I've also had a duck that sprained his leg at one point. It took a good week or so until he started walking better. His balance was thrown off and he just kind of layed sideways. Maybe if it's just a sprain she's just going to need more time until it mends.

I hope your Lady starts to feel better soon.

 

[Katz5617]

I have her away from the other chicks and now being fearful she could have something contagious I will continue to isolate her. I guess my next question would be if it is Mareks - what are the chances the other four may contract it. Is it too late to have them vaccinated - is it a vaccination you can purchase at a co-op and inject them yourself or do I need to contact a vet. I know what I read said that if that's what she has I need to destroy her, but I want to give it a little time to see if she is just injured or has something else. I want to give her every opportunity. Until the funeral I really don't have the time to try and get her to a vet - but she doesn't seem to be in any kind of distress where she is hurting or suffering unduly. I guess that sounds silly since she is obviously giving to her left side and her toes are now curling, but I mean she still attempts to walk and she will come to me and follow me like she always does and sits in my lap. I've had these chicks since they were around two to three weeks old and now they are between 21-22 weeks. In that time span we haven't introduced any new chicks and I always use the same shoes when I go to their pen - could the host virus last that long without signs or symptoms? Honestly the chickens are a pleasure to watch and have, but I never knew there could be so many things that could go wrong. My grandmothers had chickens and honestly - they hatched and went about their business - back in those days no one thought anything about vaccinations or vitamins or any other type special care. In fact I didn't even know I should have my chicks vaccinated. Is there some place that you order medications to have on hand or for what you need. What they have at Tractor Supply is limited and any real country type co-ops are a ways from us since we live in the city. In fact I'm sure the vets in the area are somewhat familiar with a chicken's needs and can help, but I can honestly say I have never seen our vet treat anything but a dog or a cat. I know they are not equipped for large animals and there is only one vet for that but nearly an hour away. I would suppose a large animal vet may see more farm animals and that may be who I need to see with Lady. I am just overwhelmed with questions - I had a chicken that went from a happy healthy bird in the course of a day to this situation. I've tried to read and do everything right but obviously I seem to be lacking the skills to successfully raise these chicks. Precious, Molly, Lollipop and Penny still look fat and sassy, with shiny feathers and the picture of health, but so did Lady. After raising them from babies to this point, if something happens I don't think I will try this again. It's too hard to loose something. I've become attached to them more as pets than as farm animals.

 

[Outpost JWB]

I took Lady out in the front yard with me and she will still follow me - but she is still giving tremendously to that left side. Someone had mentioned curling toes - to begin with her toes were not curling - but now on her left leg she is curling the toes under. What is the significance of her curling her toes under. Even with the toes curled under she will get up to follow me and when I sit down come and climb in my lap - did I say she is a big pet - she is a big pet and spoiled rotten. I've done everything everyone has recommended - but after someone mentioned Mareks disease that has me worried because it seems like there is nothing you can do for it. How would a chicken get this when they are not around any other fowl or animals - I have a dog - but he can't get in the fence and after the initial novelty of him running at them when they were biddies behind the fence - now he doesn't even go near their coop and run and we don't have any other animals. It says it is contagious - but no one around me within a several block radius has any chicks. She doesn't seem lethargic. She is eating and drinking and pooping. If I walk around she will toddle along behind me even though she is listing. But right now - what would be the significance of the curling of the toes on that one foot.

Katz5617, First I want to add my condolences from the loss of your brother. You have a lot going on. So sorry

About your hen, I read up on the posts. I THINK that one of my SS hens had mareks last year. I say THINK because she was never diagnosed by a vet. She was fine one day. Then next day I go out to feed them and she was walking wobbly, off balance and she had a dropped wing. The other chickens were trampling over top of her. I grabbed her up and put her in a dog crate in our garage. I gave her vitamin B in her water, fed her yogurt, layer feed, and a can of peaches over the next few days. She seemed to perk up. Her poo was normal, the wing was still a bit dropped, but the wobbles seemed much less. I kept checking her eye color for change which it never did. But something of significance is that she seemed like she could not focus her eyes on anything. She would look, but could not seem to focus on food, me, anything. So sometime after about a week, I let her out to free range in the yard. She was much bigger than all the other hens. Watching her that day in the yard, I was so hopeful, but she was falling over now and then, so I put her back in the crate. She died the next day.

If she is not lethargic, or have any of the other Marek's symptoms, I would almost assume she was somehow injured in the coop. Maybe she just needs time to heal. I am hoping for you and your hen. Also I would like to add that Marek's can be spread a number of ways. You can visit a farm with Marek's and not know it & bring it back to your farm on your clothes, shoes, etc. And wild birds can be carriers. Hope this helps.

 

[jgoldy2]

I'm sorry I haven't gotten back to this post. My brother passed away yesterday and I have been at the hospital most of the past two days. I haven't had much time to check in on Lady. My husband has been trying to care for her. To answer a couple of questions - the ladies are between 21-22 weeks. Their first worming was with Wazine and now I keep DE out in the run and it is sprinkled in the coop. They're not due for another worming with the wazine for another week - but the guy at Tractor Supply told me if I keep DE out regularly that it is a natural pest control and will work as a wormer as well - I need to double check that - but I wormed the entire flock of five with wazine about three weeks ago. The medicated feed is not the medicated chick starter. A friend that works in a co-op told me to try it - it has erthymycin or something like that - it lists all kinds of things that it is supposed to help with. I started that the day she got wobbly. She seems completely alert. She is not having any breathing difficulties and as soon as the others became aware she was weak they began pecking on her and I moved her to a kennel. The kennel is large enough that she can walk around in it if she chooses and I put a nice layering of straw on the bottom. Instead of walking around she has chosen to "sit". This morning has really been the first morning I have been home and not at the hospital so I coaxed her out with some treats. I she is still giving to the left side - She stretched her right leg and fluttered her right wing - but did not stretch her left leg or wing. She seems more steady on her feet but I can tell she is still giving to the left side. Her eyes are bright and alert - I can't see any blood or feather loss or feel anything - but just the way she stretched the right side and not the left makes me wonder if she injured herself maybe off the perch or if one of the larger girls hurt her. She is the smallest in the flock. Up until now no other has tried to be dominant, but in the last week the BO has pretty much asserted herself as the one in charge and she is the first I noticed to pick on Lady. I left her out on the fenced in patio for about 30 minutes to walk around and she followed me in the house for a little while. I have now put her back outside and put her in the kennel and closed the door so she is confined again. If she is injured - should I keep her somewhat immobile for a while to see if it heals - Like I said I see no obvious injuries but she won't even stretch that side. I did give her a dose of vitamins as well - put I give them all a commercial food that has a good protein content - they have grit, oyster shell and while they have pecked every shred of grass that was in the run - I give them turnips from the garden and every other day I toss them a handful of treats - typically meal worms and cracked corn and seeds. None of them have loose stool and I don't see bugs on any of them. The other four are much larger than Lady with the Buff being larger than all of them - or at least with her feathers she appears to be much bigger. I guess my next question - seems she doesn't seem to be getting worse - I'll keep up with the vitamins and medicated feed - but should I let her out to stroll around the patio and flower bed or keep her inside the kennel. Is it best to keep her more sedentary or would movement be helpful. Thanks all.

So sorry to hear that, It sounds like you are doing all you can. The only other thing that I can think of is a sling, but that is all, enless she isn't eating, but I dont think that she isnt eating

 

[Eggcessive]

I took Lady out in the front yard with me and she will still follow me - but she is still giving tremendously to that left side. Someone had mentioned curling toes - to begin with her toes were not curling - but now on her left leg she is curling the toes under. What is the significance of her curling her toes under. Even with the toes curled under she will get up to follow me and when I sit down come and climb in my lap - did I say she is a big pet - she is a big pet and spoiled rotten. I've done everything everyone has recommended - but after someone mentioned Mareks disease that has me worried because it seems like there is nothing you can do for it. How would a chicken get this when they are not around any other fowl or animals - I have a dog - but he can't get in the fence and after the initial novelty of him running at them when they were biddies behind the fence - now he doesn't even go near their coop and run and we don't have any other animals. It says it is contagious - but no one around me within a several block radius has any chicks. She doesn't seem lethargic. She is eating and drinking and pooping. If I walk around she will toddle along behind me even though she is listing. But right now - what would be the significance of the curling of the toes on that one foot.

I'm so sorry to hear about the loss of your brother, and I'm sure it is very hard to try to take care of a sick chicken right now. Curled toes can be a sign of vitamin deficiency, or neurological problems such as with Mareks, but I think an injury to the leg could also affect the nerve. Mareks is something that can't really be diagnosed without a necropsy done by the state vet, unless your vet could draw blood and send it off to Texas A&M, or another center, for PCR testing. Here are 3 very good links to read when you have time on Mareks, and the first has a list of diseases that can be similar in symptoms:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/a/the-great-big-giant-mareks-disease-faq
http://extension.unh.edu/resources/files/Resource000791_Rep813.pdf
http://partnersah.vet.cornell.edu/avian-atlas/#/disease/Marek's_Disease

 

[Katz5617]

Lady is a long way from okay, but when we got home from the funeral this afternoon, I noticed she had eaten most of the food I had placed in the kennel for her and she had drank plenty of water. I have added vitamins to the water. This morning before I left I scrambled her an egg and chopped it up to go along with her medicated food. She had eaten all of the egg and most of the crumble. She's still really wobbly and when I first put her in the grass to walk she curled her toes under. She sat that for a while sort of falling over and after a few minutes of scratching in the grass - she raised herself up and began to walk - at first it was really awkward then she began going and while I could tell from time to time she was about to teeter - she would hold herself up and keep going - she managed to walk fifty or sixty feet. After she walked and scratched in the yard a bit, I put her back in the kennel with fresh straw, fresh water and new food. She seems to be a little improved. I'm going to keep working with her.

 

[KayTee]

It sounds like you're doing everything you can for her, and if she isn't getting any worse then that's a good thing. The fact that she is trying to walk around, (albeit with a wobble and a list), and the fact that she is eating and drinking well are all good signs.
If it is just an injury or a vitamin deficiency then it should sort itself out with time (and it seems like both you and she are quite happy to be spending some 'house chicken' time together

)

However, even if it is something more serious like Marek's, it isn't necessarily the end of the world. It affects birds in so many different ways - some succumb quite quickly, and others manage to fight it and go on to live perfectly happy lives.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/a/the-great-big-giant-mareks-disease-faq is Nambroth's page about the disease, and she really knows what she is talking about. She lost one gorgeous rooster (Trousers) to the disease, but has managed to nurse another one (Bubbles) through it, and give him a very decent quality of life.

And as others on this thread have already said, if it is Marek's, then you have nothing to blame yourself for - it is present in the environment and can be transmitted by wild birds. If it is brought on to your property by wild birds then there is nothing you can do to stop it.

Lady is very lucky to have someone who cares so much about her (even with so much else going on in your life), and I hope that she continues to improve.

Please keep us updated on her progress.