1. grumpypoet

    grumpypoet New Egg

    6
    3
    6
    Apr 18, 2017
    so i have lived in my current town for 12 yrs and have owned chickens for 9 yrs. last fall i received a letter stating i am in violation of keeping poultry. amending the livestock and kennel regulation ordinance of jan 30,1973.

    no person , firm or corporation shall keep any fowl or any other livestock or maintain any kennel at any place with in the borough. excepting if you live on 1 acre of land.

    remove all chicken (fowls) immediately to prevent any further action.

    ------------------------------------

    i have not done any thing in the time since my letter but in later months another person received a letter a bit different then mine.
    she lives a block from me. she has 2 chickens been three years.

    she is going to attend the town meeting to try to get them to let us keep the chickens 2-6 birds. no free range no roaster.

    she tells me there are a total of 10 homes with chickens. i know there were two 12 yrs ago.

    i now know of her and one other home personally 1/2 block from me in another direction.


    i have an 8x12 in closed pen with a nice size coop attached all enclosed. i had up to 8 chickens but now have 4. 1 is 9 the others are 7yrs old.


    please wish us luck. i just want to let my birds finish out their lives with me. if no more i am fine with that but i dont want to have to get rid of them. :( in 9 yrs i have never had any issues with anyone about them.
     
    3 people like this.
  2. digitheadman

    digitheadman New Egg

    2
    0
    3
    Apr 27, 2017
    Hey Grumpy Poet, (please excuse my horrid spelling they don't have spell checker on this site)

    I feel your pain, I am about to go through what I am about to empart to you. Done this once here before in the town court, since then I have had to return for other code issues and the Judge is pretty nice to me.

    But as you are a newbie at this you need to understand that,

    You are a Citizen of the United States of America right?

    You have the RIGHT to Life Liberty and the PURSUITE OF HAPPINESS!

    Keep it simple, if your hens are not causing any Damage as in polution, Noise ect ect then you are not violating anyone else right to their happyness correct? That is the first part, if they are causing problems then give it up

    Question is do you rent or own your property that you reside in or do you have a mortgage?

    When you sign on the dotted line for the mortgage then there is most likely a clause that you agree to abide by the codes and ordinance of the town/ city you live in. (your ****ed) If your rent, I wouldn't know how to proceed

    However IF you own your property outright then, your rights apply. Be fearless of anyone who tells you different. They will LIE to you to get you to get into line with the rest of the "sheeple" and DO AS YOU ARE TOLD!!!

    So here is what you need to get your head wrapped around.

    1 Constitutional Law states you have the right to Life Liberty and the pursute of happyness.

    2 Look at the 9th amendment

    Ninth Amendment

    The Ninth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution reads:
    The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to denyor disparage others retained by the people.
    The Ninth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution is somewhat of an enigma. It provides that thenaming of certain rights in the Constitution does not take away from the people rights that are notnamed. Yet neither the language nor the history of the Ninth Amendment offers any hints as to thenature of the rights it was designed to protect.
    So when you go to court ask the Judge if you are on the record, (he'll/ she'll say yes)
    to the record, politely TELL the judge you would like to make a statement
    1) I am your full name
    2) and that you reserve all rights provided by your creator and protected by law under the Constitution of the United States of America and that ou retain the right under the Ninth Amendant to raise your chickens for food. Then ask (this is important if he/she has understood what you just said.
    3) Then ask what kind of action is before the court. There can only be one of 2 answers, Civil or Criminal.
    Criminal= Criminal inditment by a grand Jury
    Civil = A damage by you to another party. Broken contract, or other damage defind as anything more than a bent blade of grass or brusied soil.
    Move the court (the judge) to provide you with the documents of athourity granting them Jurisdiction over this private citizen and this private property.
    Things wil change at that point but be brave, look at the Judge no differently than anyone else, speak with confidence be polite. The Judge most likely tell you that he/she has jurisdiction,
    At that point Object to hearsay, the judge is nothng more than a public servant (remember that)
    The Judge is bound by the same rules of the court and can get in big trouble for lieing, you just have to catch them at it.
    Hearsay is not admissible in a court of law even from the bench, stand your ground and state that for you to accept the judges Jurisdiction he is obligated to PROVE it. Tell them that you are challenging jurisdiction and without the documents you cannot reconise the courts jurisdiction you need to see his documents, or you will have to demand for a dismissal.
    Most likely the Judge won't have any documents of Athority. :)
    And also won't dismiss the case
    Then being as nice as you can be, let the Judge know that you reserve the right under the 9th Amendant to grow your own food as you see fit, (a god given right protected under the constitution) is he aware of that?
    Then say I must warn that any violation of my rights can be considered a Felony under Title 18 Sec 242
    Go see>>>> http://famguardian.org/taxfreedom/Forms/Emancipation/col.pdf
    Print out some copies fill them out and say for the record " may the record show that I am giving notice to the Court and the Town" As you hand them that notice that any further action by the court will be considered a violation of your rights under the color of law and you will proceed with a criminal action up to an including a citizens arrest of any person making that attempt.

    A good line if you want to be cocky is "you've heard you see it you own it"
    Keep in mind that Judges hate being challenged, some Judges are approachable and you can have as nice a conversation with them as anyone else. Keep in mind what you say or agree to.
    Remember you didn't kill anyone, steal anything nor are you lieing, you have nothing to worry about, nothing to fear. You are in the right, you just have to wangle your way to make the Judge see that as nicely as you can, if they get big and bad (as some will do) know that you as the Citizen are bigger and badder than any public servant who is bound by their oath of office to be truthful at all times and to Protect your rights.
    Stick to your rights, keep it simple talk softly because I just gave you a really big stick to protect yourself with.
    Let me know what happens, I'll do the same as I go to court (again) this Monday

    Chip
     
  3. digitheadman

    digitheadman New Egg

    2
    0
    3
    Apr 27, 2017
    Hey Grumpy Poet, (please excuse my horrid spelling they don't have spell checker on this site)

    I feel your pain, I am about to go through what I am about to empart to you. Done this once here before in the town court, since then I have had to return for other code issues and the Judge is pretty nice to me.

    But as you are a newbie at this you need to understand that,

    You are a Citizen of the United States of America right?

    You have the RIGHT to Life Liberty and the PURSUITE OF HAPPINESS!

    Keep it simple, if your hens are not causing any Damage as in polution, Noise ect ect then you are not violating anyone else right to their happyness correct? That is the first part, if they are causing problems then give it up

    Question is do you rent or own your property that you reside in or do you have a mortgage?

    When you sign on the dotted line for the mortgage then there is most likely a clause that you agree to abide by the codes and ordinance of the town/ city you live in. (your ****ed) If your rent, I wouldn't know how to proceed

    However IF you own your property outright then, your rights apply. Be fearless of anyone who tells you different. They will LIE to you to get you to get into line with the rest of the "sheeple" and DO AS YOU ARE TOLD!!!

    So here is what you need to get your head wrapped around.

    1 Constitutional Law states you have the right to Life Liberty and the pursute of happyness.

    2 Look at the 9th amendment

    Ninth Amendment

    The Ninth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution reads:
    The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to denyor disparage others retained by the people.
    The Ninth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution is somewhat of an enigma. It provides that thenaming of certain rights in the Constitution does not take away from the people rights that are notnamed. Yet neither the language nor the history of the Ninth Amendment offers any hints as to thenature of the rights it was designed to protect.
    So when you go to court ask the Judge if you are on the record, (he'll/ she'll say yes)
    to the record, politely TELL the judge you would like to state
    1) I am your full name
    2) and that you reserve all rights provided by your creator and protected by law under the Constitution of the United States of America and that you retain the right under the Ninth Amendant to raise your chickens. Then ask (this is important if he/she has understood what you just said.
    3) Then ask what kind of action is before the court. There can only be one of 2 answers, Civil or Criminal.
    Criminal= Criminal inditment by a grand Jury
    Civil = A damage by you to another party. Broken contract, or other damage defind as anything more than a bent blade of grass or brusied soil.
    Move the court (the judge) to provide you with the documents of athourity granting them Jurisdiction over this private citizen and this private property.
    Things wil change at that point but be brave, look at the Judge no differently than anyone else, speak with confidence be polite. The Judge most likely tell you that he/she has jurisdiction,
    At that point Object to hearsay, the judge is nothng more than a public servant (remember that)
    The Judge is bound by the same rules of the court and can get in big trouble for lieing, you just have to catch them at it.
    Hearsay is not admissible in a court of law even from the bench, stand your ground and state that for you to accept the judges Jurisdiction he is obligated to PROVE it. Tell them that you are challenging jurisdiction and without the documents you cannot reconise the courts jurisdiction you need to see his documents, or you will have to demand for a dismissal.
    Most likely the Judge won't have any documents of Athority. :)
    And also won't dismiss the case
    Then being as nice as you can be, let the Judge know that you reserve the right under the 9th Amendant to grow your own food as you see fit, (a god given right protected under the constitution) is he aware of that?
    Then say I must warn that any violation of my rights can be considered a Felony under Title 18 Sec 242
    Go google Title 18 Sec 242, it will bring you to alot that you can use to demand the court support your rights, or face concequences
    Print out some copies fill them out and say for the record " may the record show that I am giving notice to the Court and the Town" As you hand them that notice that any further action by the court will be considered a violation of your rights under the color of law and you will proceed with a criminal action up to an including a citizens arrest of any person making that attempt.

    A good line if you want to be cocky is "you've heard you see it you own it"
    Keep in mind that Judges hate being challenged, some Judges are approachable and you can have as nice a conversation with them as anyone else. Keep in mind what you say or agree to.
    Remember you didn't kill anyone, steal anything nor are you lieing, you have nothing to worry about, nothing to fear. You are in the right, you just have to wangle your way to make the Judge see that as nicely as you can, if they get big and bad (as some will do) know that you as the Citizen are bigger and badder than any public servant who is bound by their oath of office to be truthful at all times and to Protect your rights.
    Stick to your rights, keep it simple talk softly because I just gave you a really big stick to protect yourself with.
    Let me know what happens, I'll do the same as I go to court (again) this Monday

    Chip
     
  4. grumpypoet

    grumpypoet New Egg

    6
    3
    6
    Apr 18, 2017
    hi thanks for you post.


    though i was not in the lead of this. we went before the town council and they are allowing chickens with some rules.

    2-6 in a coop/ pen setting.
    no free range ( mine are not)
    no roasters ( i dont have them)
    100 ft from a home must be in rear of yard
    8 ft from property line

    and a one time permit bought.

    so it looks like they are staying
     

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