Partridge X Laced

Discussion in 'General breed discussions & FAQ' started by jhamblin, Dec 11, 2011.

  1. jhamblin

    jhamblin Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Is Lacing dominant over partridge?
     
  2. big medicine

    big medicine custom Brahmas

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  3. tadkerson

    tadkerson Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Quote:Genetics 101

    The answer is NO.

    If you cross two birds with different secondary color patterns ( feather patterns)- you will get a bird that is an intermediate between the two patterns; a mixture of the two patterns on the female birds.

    For example Partridge X single laced = females that have incomplete penciling mixed with incomplete single lacing (a black tip on the feather). The males will show some poor lacing ( spangle like) on the breast. It will be a mess.


    Secondary color patterns are caused by more than one gene. The bird will be a mixture of the different genes from the two birds. See below

    Partridge as in penciled requires that a bird be homozygous for two genes: brown and pattern Brown works the best to make penciling but the bird could carry birchen or wild type and get penciling.

    Single lacing is caused by four genes- the bird must be homozygous for melanotic, pattern, columbian and brown. Brown works the best but you can get double lacing on other E locus genes. Brown can be replaced by birchen, wild type or wheaten.

    Double lacing is caused by three genes- the bird must be homozygous melanotic, pattern and the brown gene. Just like the other patterns the brown allele can be replaced by a suitable E locus allele.


    Dominance and recessive refers to the genes or alleles located at the same locus ( position on a chromosome). Alleles are located at the same locus. For example. The allele for color (C) is dominant to the allele for white (c). The white allele (c) is called recessive white. If a bird carries two recessive white alleles (c/c)there is no allele for color and the bird will be white. I used the word allele because color and white are located at the same locus ( position on a chromosome). In this case the dominant color allele is controlling the recessive white allele.

    Most birds that have color carry at least one dominant C or color gene. The reason I say most birds is because there are other genes that control color in a bird. When one gene controls a completely different gene, the controlling gene is epistatic to the controlled gene. Notice I am saying genes here because the genes are located at different loci ( more than one place on a chromosome or two different chromosomes).

    Lets say a bird carries two color genes (C/C) and two extended black genes (E/E)- this would normally cause a bird to be black. But there is a gene called lavender that can cause the bird to be a gray color ( self blue). When a bird carries two of the lavender genes, this will change the genetically black bird to a gray color. The lavender gene is epistatic to the extended black gene. The lavender gene is controlling the extended black gene.

    You can switch this around and say the extended black gene is hypostatic to the lavender gene.

    So epistatic is like dominant and hypostatic is like recessive- recessive and dominant deals with alleles while hypostatic and epistatic deals with different genes.

    Tim
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2011
  4. Ducks and Banny hens

    Ducks and Banny hens Chillin' With My Peeps

    Nov 22, 2011
    On a little Farm.
    Quote:American Partridge also carries Mh/Mh.
     
  5. jhamblin

    jhamblin Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Quote:American Partridge also carries Mh/Mh.

    What is Mh/Mh?
     
  6. tadkerson

    tadkerson Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Quote:American Partridge also carries Mh/Mh.

    What is Mh/Mh?

    The letters Mh represent a gene called Mahogany- it darkens the red color in a bird that carries the gold allele. The gold allele makes a bird a red color or some variation in red. For example a rhode island red is a dark red because of the mahogany gene interacting with the gold gene. If the rhode island red did not contain mahogany, it would be a lighter red color. There are other genes involved in expressing the color in a rhode island red but going into all the details will muddy the waters.

    If a bird does not carry the gold allele it will carry the silver allele. The basic difference between a silver laced wyandotte and a gold laced wyandotte is the silver carries the silver allele and the gold carries the gold allele.

    Mh is not needed in birds to make a pattern- it would only be carried by a bird to make the bird a darker red color.

    Tim
     
  7. tadkerson

    tadkerson Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Quote:American Partridge also carries Mh/Mh.

    What study did you get this information from? What anecdotal experience do you have in working with a partridge phenotype that would support your statement?

    Just wondering how you came up with this.


    Tim
     
  8. Ducks and Banny hens

    Ducks and Banny hens Chillin' With My Peeps

    Nov 22, 2011
    On a little Farm.
    Quote:Yeah, I knew that, and I suppose doesn't make any differences in this thread what the groundcolor is. Also about Groundcolor (for the sake of interest),
    Gold+Mahogany=Red
    Gold+Mahogany+Melanotic=Dark Brown
    Silver+Mahogany=Salmon (Gold Salmon for Duckwings and Browns, and Salmon for Wheatens)
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2011

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