Possibly Rare disease and treating with Ridzol medication.

Discussion in 'Emergencies / Diseases / Injuries and Cures' started by DeRock89, Mar 23, 2018.

  1. DeRock89

    DeRock89 In the Brooder

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    I wanted to share this with the community for the sake of the information being available to others if they encounter it and for the sake of discussion.

    I made a previous thread about getting to the bottom of why I had abruptly lost three hens. You guys can check that out for a backstory.

    In short, I had a necropsy done on the three hens and the results came back as their deaths being a result of two different pathogens. The first one was Coccidiosis which the doctor recommended treatment with Corid which I’ve been doing for the survivors. With the second pathogen, the doctor called me and said in his 30 years of experience, he had never seen it before and only knew that it was some form of Protozoa parasite. He said he was going to send it to a pathologist and get back to me

    He emailed me two days later with the attached lab results and said to treat the parasite with “Ridzol” and gave very little information other then that. I’m going to attach photos of the test results and maybe one of you guys can desiphher exactly what the identity of the pathogen is so I and others can learn about it. I am a paramedic so I understand a lot of general medical terminology but lab results from a pathologist illude me. I know that understanding the type and strain is important. I can probably figure it out if I spend awhile filling in the gaps with google, but I figured it was good to share the lab results with you guys for education purposes regardless.

    From all I’ve been able to find, I haven’t found another documented situation on the internet where chickens specially were treated with Ridzol, so I felt this information could be particularly valuable. Ridzol is intended to treat “Canker” in pigeons and is a medication that has an affinity for treating protozoan organisms. That is all I know so far from my own research. I ordered the Ridzol from a site called “Global Pigeon Supplies”.

    I really want to know exactly what the organism was in my situation and understand the manifestation of signs and symptoms as much as possible.

    Here are the test results:

    https://i.imgur.com/T0b3GcH.png

    https://i.imgur.com/YJ4RaKW.png
     
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  2. jonalisa

    jonalisa Codswallop!

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    Thanks for posting. I also suggest contacting your state veterinarian and sharing these reports and asking if they have seen it before.
     
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  3. jonalisa

    jonalisa Codswallop!

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  4. penny1960

    penny1960 Going back to La La Land

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    coccidiosis is not rare
     
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  5. DeRock89

    DeRock89 In the Brooder

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    Yes it’s not, but there was a secondary infection, the protozoan parasite, and the ridzol is to treat it. I say rare Becuase the doctor stated that he had never seen it before when viewed under a microscope and rare because it seems like it’s very uncommon for chickens to be treated with Ridzol.
     
  6. Eggcessive

    Eggcessive Enabler

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    Ridzol appears to be metronidazole which treats trichmoniasis or canker in chickens. Canker can be found in some flocks, and is usually found in the beak, throat, trachea of birds as yellow plaques. It might be more clear to us to know what they mean, if you copy and paste the necropsy report.
     
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  7. DeRock89

    DeRock89 In the Brooder

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    The report starts by stating, “petechial hemorrhages in jejunum with mucoid enteritis-negative for cocci oocysts on scraping, but positive for massive numbers of apparent protozoal organisms; approximately 5 microns long, thin and cigar shaped ; 1/3 = hemorrhagic typhlitis, positive for coccidial oocysts; Tentative Diagnosis: parasitic enteritis (coccidiosis plus protozoal); testing for other causes of death is pending; SUGGESTED TREATMENT: Amprolium (Corid or Amprol)”

    It states the preliminary diagnosis is “Coccidiosis-E.tenella
    Coccidiosis-E.necatrix
    Enteritis:Necrotic
    MS PCR positive”

    The next part that details an abnormality that I recognize is the tissue tests to the small intestine which state “Autolytic changes are present. Tips of villi are necrotic in some sections and large numbers of bacteria - large rods are present - lesions consistent with necrotic enteritis. Many sections have multiple focal crypts with coccidia - necatrix. These meronts with merozoites are likely the protozoa seen in the gut scraping. I think the oocysts develop in cecum.” So it appears that the Coccidiosis strain present here is the Coccidiosis E. necatox.

    I think I’m beginning to understand everything. The pathogen he was unable to identify was related to the finding of signs of “necrotic enteritis”. From what I can understand it was the result of a secondary opportunistic infection of Clostridium Perfriagens. This bacteria is what I believe the protozoan was. It’s always present in the intestines in chickens. It’s part of the natural intentional flora and is normally benign but the Coccidiosis Bactria created conditions for the other bacteria to overproduce and release toxins that led to other tissues to break down and then led to sepsis(blood poisoning from infection)

    From what I gather so far, I think the Ridzol was an “off-label” treatment for the opportunitistic infection that resulted from an infection of Coccidiosis. I guess that normally, other medications would typically be directed to use. Maybe the particular strain was more vulnerable to Ridzol then others.

    I’m basing this on how I know that different antibiotics can be used to treat the same bacterial infection but chosen based on if the bacteria is gram positive or gram negative so maybe it’s kind of he same situation.

    Side note, the condition resulting from the secondary infection was necrotic enteritis and it looks like probiotics have been shown as promising for treatment and prevention.
     
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  8. paramount

    paramount Songster

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    Well, canker (Trichomoniasis) in pigeons is caused by an increase in naturally occurring protozoan in the bird's system. Ridzol (usually Ridzol 10 or Ridzol 20 is what is obtained for pigeons) is really Ronidazole, which was originally developed for swine. It is specifically an antiprotozoal agent and the most effective of its kind. I'm not aware of any other application for it.

    Clostridium perfringens is a bacterium, but is considered a "good indicator" for the presence of high numbers of protozoa.

    I would say the suggestion to use Ridzol is SPECIFICALLY AIMED at the protozoa, not at Clostridium perfringens itself.

    He does not appear to identify the protozoa by species. This would lead me to think that he is not personally aware of their actual identity.

    That being said, I can tell you that historically, Ronidazole (Ridzol) WAS used to try treat histomoniasis in turkeys. Histomoniasis is protozoan.
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2018
  9. Eggcessive

    Eggcessive Enabler

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    Did you notice the positive PCR test for MS? That usually stands for mycoplasma synoviae or MS, which is a respiratory disease that causes infection and swelling in the leg and foot joints.

    Clostridium perfringens is a rod-shaped bacteria, and a common cause of necrotic enteritis. Necrotic enteritis frequently follows coccidiosis infection. The protozoan was probably an opportunistic illness in the already compromised immune system, due to coccidiosis and the NE.

    Thank you for posting the necropsy results. It is always interesting to read the findings of the poultry vet, and helps us all learn.
     
  10. paramount

    paramount Songster

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    I agree. In pigeons, we also see canker as a sign of some greater compromised immunity issue. Usually that is related to coccid outbreaks and/or respiratory issues, by the way. You can kind of see a pattern here.

    It may be that the vet's intention is to throw the Ridzol at the protozoa in the hope of improving immunity enough to help combat the other issues.
     
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