Questions Regarding Recessive White

Discussion in 'General breed discussions & FAQ' started by rodriguezpoultry, Feb 16, 2011.

  1. rodriguezpoultry

    rodriguezpoultry Langshan Lover

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    So it seems all of my Langshans are recessive white. Excellent! Just what I wanted!

    Now the fun begins:
    I have chicks that are split for the white. They are the result of either blue x white or black x white. In the future, by my logic, I should be able to breed these chicks back to each other and receive a 33% chance of blue, 33% black and 33% white. Right? (Well, if I breed the black x white to blue x white that come out blue.)

    Would it help increase the odds of getting whites if I bred to another white bird? Or would it be the same and wind up with the F2 black chicks from the pairing receiving a copy of the recessive white again?

    Is there a reason not to use the black/blue chicks from the F1 cross (blue/black x white) in other breedings to increase vigor, production and width of body? Would it sacrifice feather sheen? I have a F1 cockerel in the brooder that is showing his green sheen even at this age. He is 3 weeks old! I am simply in awe at how well his feathers are doing.

    Thanks for any info!

    Edited because I can't spell when I'm woken up thinking of breeding opportunities...
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2011
  2. Sonoran Silkies

    Sonoran Silkies Flock Mistress

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    Chance of a white from two birds that each carry one copy of recessive white is 25%. An additional 25% will inherit the gene from the father, but not the mother; 25% more will inherit it from the mother, but not the father; and the fnal 25% will not inherit the gene at all.

    Breed to a white instead of a bird split to white and half of the offspring will be white: the white will pass the gene to all offspring, the non-white to about half the offspring; that half will have two copies of the gene and be white.

    Disregarding white:
    If the parents are both blue, the offspring have a 25% chance of being black and a 25% chance of being splash; the other 50% will be blue (25% inheriting the gene from the father + 25% inheriting from the mother)

    If the parents are both black or both splash, all chicks will be the colour of their parents.

    If the parents are black and splash, all offspring will be blue.

    If the parents are blue and black, half the offspring will be blue and the other half black.

    If the offspring are blue and splash, half the offspring will be blue and the other half splash.

    Recessve white should not affect the green sheen or feather quality of the birds that inherit only one copy.
     
  3. rodriguezpoultry

    rodriguezpoultry Langshan Lover

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    Quote:So breeding a white parent or half-sibling would give me better odds of getting whites. Would this cause the feather quality to go downhill on a black or blue chick resulting in the F2 generation? If a white sport pops up later on down the road from my black line, I am not worried, but I do not want to sacrifice the green sheen and good feather quality in order to completely remake the white line of birds.



    Recessve white should not affect the green sheen or feather quality of the birds that inherit only one copy.

    How many "copies" does a bird have to have in order for feather quality to deteriorate? I was under the assumption that a bird would need two copies in order to be a white bird?

    Why would there not be a 50% chance of getting black and 50% chance of getting white when breeding the F1 birds together?​
     
  4. RAREROO

    RAREROO Overrun With Chickens

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    Quote:So breeding a white parent or half-sibling would give me better odds of getting whites. Would this cause the feather quality to go downhill on a black or blue chick resulting in the F2 generation? If a white sport pops up later on down the road from my black line, I am not worried, but I do not want to sacrifice the green sheen and good feather quality in order to completely remake the white line of birds.



    Recessve white should not affect the green sheen or feather quality of the birds that inherit only one copy.

    How many "copies" does a bird have to have in order for feather quality to deteriorate? I was under the assumption that a bird would need two copies in order to be a white bird?

    Why would there not be a 50% chance of getting black and 50% chance of getting white when breeding the F1 birds together?​

    Do you know how to work a Punnet Square rodriquezpoultry ? That would be the easiest way to calculate for people wanting to learn about genetics but cant do it in their head.

    But Recessive White works just like Lavender or Mottling or any other Recessive gene. It has to have two copies to show it.

    Rec. White X Black = All solid Blacks ( Split for Rec White/ Carrying one copy)

    Rec. White X Splits = Half Whites, Half Splits

    Split X Split = 25% Whites, 50% Splits, 25% pure Blacks without the Rec White gene.

    Black X Split = Half Splits and Half Blacks without the gene.

    White X White = ALL Whites.

    Then when you add in the additional Andalusian Blue Genes, you still get genetically the same percentages of Blue Black or Splash as you always would based on the partents, but the ones that come out white are going to be masking one of the BBS phases underneath the white and you wont be able to know which unless you breed and see.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2011
  5. rodriguezpoultry

    rodriguezpoultry Langshan Lover

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    Quote:Yes, I've worked Punnet Squares before. The only issue I'm having is with the split x split. I "think" I understand what is being said though. I will have birds that are self-black, birds that are black split (which will show black) to white and white birds when I breed the split x split. I had forgotten that snippet of information.

    Thank you for your help!
     
  6. RAREROO

    RAREROO Overrun With Chickens

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    Quote:Thats correct.
     
  7. GypsyChic

    GypsyChic Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Dont mean to hijack your thread, but it's a WHITE question that I have and cant seem to find any answers. SS is Silver, correct? What do you get when crossing silver with white? I'm starting a new project and would love to know more. Thanks in advance for any help/info any of you may have.

    <--- [​IMG] for crashing thread
     
  8. RAREROO

    RAREROO Overrun With Chickens

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    Quote:Sexlinked Silver is the other gene that can color a bird white. Recessive White, Dominant White, and Sexlinked Silver are the genes responsible white coloring in birds, and it is possible for 2 or all 3 of them to be present in one bird. I have an explaination of the differences of the three and what they do saved on my home computer that I will post later if you like.

    Sexlinked Silver though is usually just mainly in pattern genes though like Silver Columbian, Silver Laced, Silver Duckwing ect....... So it would depend on which pattern gene you are working with but most importantly whether the White you are crossing with is Dominant or Recessive and what is being masked under it.
    So more information would be needed to answer your question. The breed and pattern of the Silver based bird and the breed of the White bird would be needed but really an acurrate answer couldnt be given if the color being masked under the White isnt known.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2011
  9. RAREROO

    RAREROO Overrun With Chickens

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  10. GypsyChic

    GypsyChic Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Thanks Clint, I appreciate the info. I had it partly right, so you helped tremendously with the other 1/2 of genetics [​IMG]
     

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