Rippled Muscovy

[learycow]

Anybody have any rippled or looney muscovy?

Looking to get a few. Also interested in any info on the genetics of these guys

 

[Abrown19]

These are from my chocolate hen after second molt

 

[Miss Lydia]

Thank you! I can't wait to mix these ripples with my barreds in the spring
And these muscovy were raised with some of my call ducks (they make excellent foster mothers) so that's why there are some calls in the pic. They all hang out together

That's sweet and because the Calls will always be tiny those Scovy moms will be waiting a long time for their babies to grow up.

I look forward to seeing new babies in the spring too.

 

[dotporter]

Ok, so, this isn't a valid answer, but I was wondering if you have any photos of an actual looney? You seem to be pretty good with color. I tried in the past to get some and they never looked like what is described.



That's what I got at first, which was different from the regular white stripes, but not what looney sounds like when described


Then later on with some blue all I got was alternating dark blue and light blue.

I don't have any anymore (got rid of the ripple), but, do you happen to have any photos of what the heck looney is SUPPOSED to look like??

 

[learycow]

I'm glad you are chiming in!
The reason I am asking is this. I was under the impression that barred muscovy come in all colors, and are a color plus white striped on each feather. As ducklings, they are yellow with a colored tail (the color indicates what color the duck will be when feathered). As juveniles, all or most of the body is barred in pattern. But when they molt into adult feathers, they lose almost all of the barring and end up solid colored with barred feathers not showing at all, or showing on the back, belly and chest areas. But more shows up and disappears with each molt. Like this

Blue barred, both ducks

 

[learycow]

And from my understanding, ripple only comes in 3 colors, blue, chocolate, and dark (like a mix between a dark blue and dark chocolate color). These are colored when they hatch and can be very hard to distinguish from regular colors as they look so similar with only the heads being a different shade than a black or blue or chocolate muscovy duckling.
When they feather the rippling is the color of the bird but in 1 or 2 different shades (no white) in a barred or rippled pattern on each feather. The duck (if not pied) will be entirely covered with this pattern and it will NOT go away with each molt but always shows. Like this

Both are dark ripples, one pied and one bibbed. But the feathers that are not white are all rippled

 

[learycow]

But I have discussed it with someone online who seems VERY educated about these patterns, and according to him I am wrong. Which is ok as I just want to get these patterns figured out!
Here's what he explained to me:
If the lines are straight, like you drew on the feather with a marker, then its BARRED
If the lines are wavy, like you drew with a pencil, then its RIPPLED
If they have a more cuckoo pattern that's checkered, then it's LOONEY

Looney is supposed to be a combination of barred AND rippled. so according to him, the duck here on the LEFT is a LOONEY And the RIGHT is a BARRED
So maybe it has nothing to do with the color and white, but rather the pattern on the feathers and how it's "drawn"?



If this is correct, then I have a TON of looneys, 2 barred, and no real ripples

 

[dotporter]

Well, that can't be correct, no offense to anyone. You see the black and white duck in the picture I put in earlier? That's a barred mixed to ripple. The white bars aren't straight lines. In fact, many of my current barred ducks don't have straight lines (a leftover of my experiments I guess?)


See, he has little white circles on each feather, not bars. But he's still barred.
From my own breeding, the ripple is a pattern of alternating colors which persists throughout the life of the duck where as the barred are a pattern of white and a color which molts out.
It's the genetics, not how wavy the lines are. Like my stupid blue bar/ripple mix. She molted out to a regular blue meaning she was technically barred even though she had alternating colors.

I no longer have any ripple. I just had too many colors and had to remove something. I'd read that you could get loon pattern from crossing barred to ripple, but I never managed what I thought was loon pattern, and the pattern always molted out anyways. Bars molt out. Ripple doesn't. I think maybe I never got true loon pattern because the birds only had one ripple gene rather than two, but I didn't bother to keep them for enough generations to find out.

In any case, if you have ducks with alternating color bands which persist into adulthood, that's ripple even if the ripples are ruler straight. And if it's a black duck with a white pattern which molts out, that is barred even if the white is little zig zags and circles. I'd just love to see a picture to find out what a looney is Supposed to look like. They sound pretty, and I wonder if the pattern persists to adulthood like ripple.

 

[learycow]

Ok. Well he seemed very informed and educated as he quoted a lot from someone's genetic book ( I'll have to look it up as it's a book I want to read anyways). So he was telling me that what you and I call barred is not right, that we have loonys. And true barred are more rare, and ripples are even more rare. That it had nothing to do with color really but more pattern and if it molts out or not.

I appreciate your input. It made me rethink what I have learned and advertise my birds as which is why I wanted to start a good discussion about it

 

[dotporter]

Ok. Well he seemed very informed and educated as he quoted a lot from someone's genetic book ( I'll have to look it up as it's a book I want to read anyways). So he was telling me that what you and I call barred is not right, that we have loonys. And true barred are more rare, and ripples are even more rare. That it had nothing to do with color really but more pattern and if it molts out or not.

I appreciate your input. It made me rethink what I have learned and advertise my birds as which is why I wanted to start a good discussion about it

Well, he is right in that even if it's two colors like my dark blue/light blue barred, if it molts out, it's still barred. Loony is named for it's resemblance to the loon. It's Supposed to be white circles on black. I Got white circles, LITERALLY, but not loon-like circles.

But, unfortunately, I have to say that barred is a gene, not a color or a pattern, as is ripple. If it has the ripple gene, then it's a ripple. If it has the barred gene, it's a barred. The most obvious indicator is that bars molt out (not always to the same degree, I still have some hens who are two and still have a great deal of barring on the back and chest). Ripple persists throughout the life of the bird with little or no change. And, loony is either a form of barred or is a mix of ripple with barred, but I honestly don't know since I never got any.

I wish I DID have loony. I think a loon patterned duck which doesn't molt out the pattern would be just amazing. If you find any, you HAVE to post pictures!!! I've always wanted to see one.