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The Black Color Gene

Discussion in 'General breed discussions & FAQ' started by uros4you39, Sep 17, 2010.

  1. uros4you39

    uros4you39 Out Of The Brooder

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    I have heard about there being more than one color black. Does anybody know anything about this, such as what the different black colors are and what birds have them. I heard if you breed two black colors together than that is how you get the purple barred sheen instead of the green sheen. I also heard that if you breed black birds together that have just a little bit of red in the hackle around the head then the offspring should come out with the good green sheen does anybody know if this is true.
     
  2. blackdotte

    blackdotte Chillin' With My Peeps

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    There is no 'Black' gene. Black is created by a number of combinations of genes.
    It is easier,by the addition of melanisers, to make a black bird on Extended Black, than on Birchen, Duckwing or Brown, nearly impossible on Wheaten. There are many known Melanisers, including Melanotic,charcoal,hackle black, matt black as well as a number of undocumented ones.
    The 'What you have heard' are all old wives tails. Gloss colours depend on the structure & condition of the feathers.
     
  3. Henk69

    Henk69 Chillin' With My Peeps

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    You shouldn't be encouraged to breed with rusty blacks.
     
  4. hinkjc

    hinkjc Overrun With Chickens Premium Member

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    I found the best green sheen produced on breeding good clean blacks together that have good sheen to begin with. Anything with red or rust color is an immediate cull in a black breeding program.
     
  5. uros4you39

    uros4you39 Out Of The Brooder

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    when I show my australorps they usually do good, but lately they haven't been because they have purple in them can anyone tell me how to breed that out of them. The judges also told me it was genetics. and why did somebody tell me that the purple sheen comes from breeding two different types of black together?
     
  6. Henk69

    Henk69 Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Wenn you breed 2 different types of black together, chances are that their melanizers misalign, causing rustiness = groundcolor leakage.
     
  7. uros4you39

    uros4you39 Out Of The Brooder

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    when I am breeding them how do I know if I am breeding different types of black color together or not.
     
  8. lildinkem

    lildinkem Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Great topic. I was curious myself.
    I have some I was wondering why they have more green then others
    I raise them all the same so it has to be genetic
    Forgot to say this bird is 1/4 Buff (Red)
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2010
  9. Buns

    Buns Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Quote:Questions, please. [​IMG]

    Each breed of bird who comes in black coloration has it's own unique combination of genes used to create that black color? For instance, genetically the "black" of a black rosecomb bantam is totally different than the "black" genetics of a black australorp? Or do some breeds share the same gene combination to create black? If so, where may I find this information?

    If a bird has one or more of the genes for black, will that bird always exhibit black feathers to some extent? Or can it be totally hidden?

    Does the pattern of black seen on a bird tell you what genetic combination caused it or is the pattern the result of something that restricts the expression of black to just those feathers?

    Where would I find a good source of chicken genetics information such as a website or book?

    Thank you very much for any help you might offer.
     
  10. Henk69

    Henk69 Chillin' With My Peeps

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    They are multiple ways of creating an all black chicken.

    First you need a suitable e-locus allele as a base
    In order of suitability: E > E^R > e^b > e+ > e^Wh
    Second you need to add extra melanizer genes to make all feathers black.
    For E you need less melanizers than for e^b etc...
    These melanizers can be dominant or recessive (most often); a few are documented (melanotic Ml, charcoal cha), a lot probably not.

    Different breeds may have different melanizers (or e-alleles) so a cross could destroy the full blackness.

    Sidenote:
    We are talking about the genes that extend the level of expression (e=extension) of black pigment = eumelanin.
    The genes that actually make the eumelanin from its precursors are a different topic.
    A defective gene among the latter could cause the complete absence of black on a bird.
     

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