What color would the offspring be from White Ameraucana x Black or Blue Birchen Marans?

Oct 13, 2019
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Longmont, CO
The title basically asks the question haha. If I cross a white Ameraucana Cockerel with Blue and Black Birchen Marans, what colors would the offspring be. I’ve tried searching and I’m still wrapping my head around the genetics behind white chickens.
What about a Lavender Ameraucana x Blue or Black Birchen Marans. And last a Wheaton Ameraucana x BBM? I’m trying to decide who to keep from my current hatch. I want to breed Olive Eggers (just for fun). I already have a bunch of Easter Eggers so I am inclined to keep an Aneraucana Cockerel (if ther is one) because then I can cross him with my EEs and the Marans.
Here’s what’s in my bator, wwyd?:
- 13 F1 Black Olive Eggers
- 1 Wheaton Ameraucana
- Lavender Ameraucana
- 3 White Ameraucanas
- 5 Blue and Black Birchen Marans
- 2 Wheaton Marans
- 3 F2-4 Olive Eggers

Who knows what I’ll end up actually hatching out. Curious who others would keep. I’m going to grow as many as I can out but I need to part with about half as day olds if they all hatched by some miracle.
 

sylviethecochin

Free Ranging
Jun 14, 2017
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Central PA
Basic chicken genetics: black and gold are a chicken's basic colours. Those colours can be modified or rearranged, but any colour on a chicken is a variant of black or gold.

E-locus genes are the pattern genes. They tell where the colours are going to be (like a paint-by-number). E-locus genes are always represented by an e-letter designation. E^R is birchen, e is duckwing, E is extended black. Those genes are usually listed first when a genetic description (genotype) is given.

Almost all other colour genes modify the black (eumelanin) or the gold (pheomelanin). Blue, for instance, dilutes black. So does Lavender. Dominant white colours all the black white instead. di is Dilute, and it makes gold paler. Recessive white is weird because is removes pigment from the entire chicken, covering any underlying pattern and colour. Barring is weirder because it removes pigment from the entire chicken but only in stripes.

Recessive white birds carry two copies of recessive white, and they are purely, entirely white. Sometimes, their chick down shows the original pattern (if you see white silkie chicks in TSC, they're striped. That's because they're recessive white, and the underlying pattern has striped down. White Leghorn chicks, however, are yellow. That's because they're really all black, but the black has been whited out.)

Ameraucanas are recessive white, in most cases. Usually, (in almost all recessive white breeds) the underlying pattern is duckwing or partridge.

e-locus genes:
E = extended black. It is the most dominant of colour patterns and trumps all.
E^R = birchen.
e = duckwing
(There are more. I'm lazy).
All of these genes are alternatives of each other. The e-locus is a place on the chicken's chromosome. It can be filled by any one of these genes. Since a chicken has two of each chromosome (one from each parent) it has two e-locuses (loci?) So it can be E/E or E/e or E/E^R but not E/E^R/e.

Bl = blue, or, more precisely, the presence of a blue dilution gene. Its alternative is the dilution gene's not being present, denoted by bl. So bl/bl (no dilution whatsoever black) is a possibility, as is Bl/Bl (super-dilution splash) and Bl/bl (blue).

Lav = black, or rather, that the lav dilution gene is not present. Lav/Lav = black, Lav/lav = black carrying a recessive lavender gene, lav/lav = lavender. Note that the chicken can be ONLY black or lavender (in this geneset anyway)

S = silver, s = gold. Like Lavender, this is an either/or.

c = recessive white. C = a lack of recessive white.

So:
White Ameraucana x Blue or Black Birchen Marans

Recessive white = e+/e+, bl/bl, c/c (probably)
Birchen (Black/gold) = E^R/E^R, bl/bl, C/C
Birchen (blue/gold) = E^R/E^R, Bl/bl, C/C

E^R/e,(They are black/gold birchen with shoulder leakage)
Bl/bl OR Bl/Bl (blue or black. All black hens will have black offspring, the blue hens will pass the blue gene to 50% of their offspring.)
C/c (They're split to recessive white, but do not look white themselves.)


Lavender Ameraucana x Blue or Black Birchen Marans

Lavender = E/E, lav/lav, bl/bl, C/C
Birchen (blue/gold) = E^R/E^R, Lav/Lav, Bl/bl, C/C
Birchen (Black/gold) = E^R/E^R, Lav/Lav, bl/bl, C/C

Chicks are E/E^R (black w/possible leakage on shoulders and throat)
Lav/lav (split to lavender, but black)
Bl/bl OR bl/bl (blue or black. Half of the offspring of the blues will be blue, all other chicks will be black.)
C/C (Not recessive white.)

I don't really want to mess with wheatens, so I'll refer you to this site. Have fun.
A tip on sexing: Ameraucanas are usually slow-feathering. Due to the sexlinked nature of this gene, boys carry two copies and girls carry one. That means that the boys develop feathers more slowly than the girls do. Marans are the opposite.

I'd play with the Ameraucanas, personally. But I've never had a Marans, so enh.
 
Oct 13, 2019
728
2,088
201
Longmont, CO
Basic chicken genetics: black and gold are a chicken's basic colours. Those colours can be modified or rearranged, but any colour on a chicken is a variant of black or gold.

E-locus genes are the pattern genes. They tell where the colours are going to be (like a paint-by-number). E-locus genes are always represented by an e-letter designation. E^R is birchen, e is duckwing, E is extended black. Those genes are usually listed first when a genetic description (genotype) is given.

Almost all other colour genes modify the black (eumelanin) or the gold (pheomelanin). Blue, for instance, dilutes black. So does Lavender. Dominant white colours all the black white instead. di is Dilute, and it makes gold paler. Recessive white is weird because is removes pigment from the entire chicken, covering any underlying pattern and colour. Barring is weirder because it removes pigment from the entire chicken but only in stripes.

Recessive white birds carry two copies of recessive white, and they are purely, entirely white. Sometimes, their chick down shows the original pattern (if you see white silkie chicks in TSC, they're striped. That's because they're recessive white, and the underlying pattern has striped down. White Leghorn chicks, however, are yellow. That's because they're really all black, but the black has been whited out.)

Ameraucanas are recessive white, in most cases. Usually, (in almost all recessive white breeds) the underlying pattern is duckwing or partridge.

e-locus genes:
E = extended black. It is the most dominant of colour patterns and trumps all.
E^R = birchen.
e = duckwing
(There are more. I'm lazy).
All of these genes are alternatives of each other. The e-locus is a place on the chicken's chromosome. It can be filled by any one of these genes. Since a chicken has two of each chromosome (one from each parent) it has two e-locuses (loci?) So it can be E/E or E/e or E/E^R but not E/E^R/e.

Bl = blue, or, more precisely, the presence of a blue dilution gene. Its alternative is the dilution gene's not being present, denoted by bl. So bl/bl (no dilution whatsoever black) is a possibility, as is Bl/Bl (super-dilution splash) and Bl/bl (blue).

Lav = black, or rather, that the lav dilution gene is not present. Lav/Lav = black, Lav/lav = black carrying a recessive lavender gene, lav/lav = lavender. Note that the chicken can be ONLY black or lavender (in this geneset anyway)

S = silver, s = gold. Like Lavender, this is an either/or.

c = recessive white. C = a lack of recessive white.

So:
White Ameraucana x Blue or Black Birchen Marans

Recessive white = e+/e+, bl/bl, c/c (probably)
Birchen (Black/gold) = E^R/E^R, bl/bl, C/C
Birchen (blue/gold) = E^R/E^R, Bl/bl, C/C

E^R/e,(They are black/gold birchen with shoulder leakage)
Bl/bl OR Bl/Bl (blue or black. All black hens will have black offspring, the blue hens will pass the blue gene to 50% of their offspring.)
C/c (They're split to recessive white, but do not look white themselves.)


Lavender Ameraucana x Blue or Black Birchen Marans

Lavender = E/E, lav/lav, bl/bl, C/C
Birchen (blue/gold) = E^R/E^R, Lav/Lav, Bl/bl, C/C
Birchen (Black/gold) = E^R/E^R, Lav/Lav, bl/bl, C/C

Chicks are E/E^R (black w/possible leakage on shoulders and throat)
Lav/lav (split to lavender, but black)
Bl/bl OR bl/bl (blue or black. Half of the offspring of the blues will be blue, all other chicks will be black.)
C/C (Not recessive white.)

I don't really want to mess with wheatens, so I'll refer you to this site. Have fun.
A tip on sexing: Ameraucanas are usually slow-feathering. Due to the sexlinked nature of this gene, boys carry two copies and girls carry one. That means that the boys develop feathers more slowly than the girls do. Marans are the opposite.

I'd play with the Ameraucanas, personally. But I've never had a Marans, so enh.
Holy smokes. I am so grateful for this wealth of knowledge. Thanks so much for sharing this with me. Currently trying to absorb it all haha. Oh, and very handy tip about the feather sexing. Thanks again.
 

Chooks man

Free Ranging
Nov 12, 2015
4,928
8,689
516
Australia NSW
Basic chicken genetics: black and gold are a chicken's basic colours. Those colours can be modified or rearranged, but any colour on a chicken is a variant of black or gold.

E-locus genes are the pattern genes. They tell where the colours are going to be (like a paint-by-number). E-locus genes are always represented by an e-letter designation. E^R is birchen, e is duckwing, E is extended black. Those genes are usually listed first when a genetic description (genotype) is given.

Almost all other colour genes modify the black (eumelanin) or the gold (pheomelanin). Blue, for instance, dilutes black. So does Lavender. Dominant white colours all the black white instead. di is Dilute, and it makes gold paler. Recessive white is weird because is removes pigment from the entire chicken, covering any underlying pattern and colour. Barring is weirder because it removes pigment from the entire chicken but only in stripes.

Recessive white birds carry two copies of recessive white, and they are purely, entirely white. Sometimes, their chick down shows the original pattern (if you see white silkie chicks in TSC, they're striped. That's because they're recessive white, and the underlying pattern has striped down. White Leghorn chicks, however, are yellow. That's because they're really all black, but the black has been whited out.)

Ameraucanas are recessive white, in most cases. Usually, (in almost all recessive white breeds) the underlying pattern is duckwing or partridge.

e-locus genes:
E = extended black. It is the most dominant of colour patterns and trumps all.
E^R = birchen.
e = duckwing
(There are more. I'm lazy).
All of these genes are alternatives of each other. The e-locus is a place on the chicken's chromosome. It can be filled by any one of these genes. Since a chicken has two of each chromosome (one from each parent) it has two e-locuses (loci?) So it can be E/E or E/e or E/E^R but not E/E^R/e.

Bl = blue, or, more precisely, the presence of a blue dilution gene. Its alternative is the dilution gene's not being present, denoted by bl. So bl/bl (no dilution whatsoever black) is a possibility, as is Bl/Bl (super-dilution splash) and Bl/bl (blue).

Lav = black, or rather, that the lav dilution gene is not present. Lav/Lav = black, Lav/lav = black carrying a recessive lavender gene, lav/lav = lavender. Note that the chicken can be ONLY black or lavender (in this geneset anyway)

S = silver, s = gold. Like Lavender, this is an either/or.

c = recessive white. C = a lack of recessive white.

So:
White Ameraucana x Blue or Black Birchen Marans

Recessive white = e+/e+, bl/bl, c/c (probably)
Birchen (Black/gold) = E^R/E^R, bl/bl, C/C
Birchen (blue/gold) = E^R/E^R, Bl/bl, C/C

E^R/e,(They are black/gold birchen with shoulder leakage)
Bl/bl OR Bl/Bl (blue or black. All black hens will have black offspring, the blue hens will pass the blue gene to 50% of their offspring.)
C/c (They're split to recessive white, but do not look white themselves.)


Lavender Ameraucana x Blue or Black Birchen Marans

Lavender = E/E, lav/lav, bl/bl, C/C
Birchen (blue/gold) = E^R/E^R, Lav/Lav, Bl/bl, C/C
Birchen (Black/gold) = E^R/E^R, Lav/Lav, bl/bl, C/C

Chicks are E/E^R (black w/possible leakage on shoulders and throat)
Lav/lav (split to lavender, but black)
Bl/bl OR bl/bl (blue or black. Half of the offspring of the blues will be blue, all other chicks will be black.)
C/C (Not recessive white.)

I don't really want to mess with wheatens, so I'll refer you to this site. Have fun.
A tip on sexing: Ameraucanas are usually slow-feathering. Due to the sexlinked nature of this gene, boys carry two copies and girls carry one. That means that the boys develop feathers more slowly than the girls do. Marans are the opposite.

I'd play with the Ameraucanas, personally. But I've never had a Marans, so enh.
great stuff but I disagree with you in some thing .you said Quote { there are more .I m lazy } you are not lazy at all .great detail ,great knowledge .

chooks man
 

ChickenLeg

Crowing
8 Years
Feb 15, 2012
1,319
1,325
287
White ameraucanas are typically based off bbs. There's a chance it's based off something else but all my outcrosses showd previous breeders used bbs. So theres a good chance if your white is a true white ameraucana then crossed with bbs marans will give you leaky bbs offspring.

Always a chance the white was based off something else and very unlikely chance its dominant white but if that's the case the offspring would not be bbs.

I attached some blue wheaten bantam males over white and blue wheaten bantam females. You can see the all the non Wheatens are from the white hen. They came out blue and splash split E/eWh so that tells me the white hen was a splash so when crossed with the blue wheaten I got half blues and half splashes all split at the e locus. You will notice the dark feathers in the blues hackles so thats another indication its split for eWh too.

The male blues split at e were all leaky gold due to using the blue wheaten male. If done properly you can do this cross to improve the type of your wheatens but I recommend using a black without the recessive white so you won't have sports popping up in future
 

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