Wheaten and Blue wheaten Marans Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'General breed discussions & FAQ' started by snowbird, Dec 5, 2010.

  1. snowbird

    snowbird Overrun With Chickens

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    I see several people wanting to know different things about Wheaten and Blue wheaten Marans. So I think it might be a good time to talk about Wheaten Marans.

    The most talked about topic seems to be the cottonball at base of tail at the end of back. If this is to be acceptable in the APA SOP the sponsering Marans club will have to say it is acceptable in the Standard or it will be a Fault. Any of these items not cleared up in the new standard will be covered by the APA SOP under cutting for defects. At present I suggest that any one wanting info go to the French Marans website and read what they have to say there.

    Some say that the white wing and tail feathers are not hereditary, mate up a male with the white to some females of the same hatch and see what you get, you will get a very high amout of white in wing and tail.

    The wheaten male should have light slate undercolor and the female should have a whitish cream color.

    So lets hear the comments and any info. anyone has to offer.

    This is just about the wheaten Marans nothing to do with any Marans clubs or what they think or do not think. Don
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2011
  2. Illia

    Illia Crazy for Colors

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    Great topic. I for one think there should be more discussion of this color variety, as not many have it, and it does need a lot more clarification on the standard.

    I've got a Wheaten cockerel who seems to be keeping a single white flight feather, however I'm more focused currently on excess color or darkness/lightness in color and its heredity.

    Now, I know that females can vary widely, but one thing to keep in mind is having at least the three color rule, and to at least have the chest pale, the neck more on the terracotta color, and the back to be the wheaten type color. But, my question is, what if one were to have a Wheaten hen with a very dark coloring? Is it in fact unwanted mahogany or something else? I have a pullet here who is darker than the others, and has a tiny tickling of black at the tip of her secondaries, but will such thing actually pass on? Because her siblings do not have such dark coloring. They vary.

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    And then the next thing is, would such thing affect coloring in the males' chest? Black Coppers have undercoppering and overcoppering, which can easily be bred out and modified, but what over over coloring for Wheatens? I have a Blue Wheaten cockerel with tiny flecks of red on his chest, a Wheaten with red smudging on his thighs and chest, and another Wheaten who's almost entirely red! They're all from the same hatch. Now, if I want to clean up the red on the Blue Wheaten's chest, would getting a pullet with the most creamy wheaten/white in her body help this? Because I would think that a pullet with a chest too dark in color would further push the excess color in a male.

    I'd love some experienced thoughts.


    Here's my over colored Wheaten


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    Here's a red smudged Wheaten. Same hatch.

    [​IMG]
     
  3. snowbird

    snowbird Overrun With Chickens

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    Illia, Will tell you what i believe , I have had the wheaten for three year and heve raised several young and have culled heavy. I no longer breed any of my marans that have white in tail, wing,

    I believe that your darker female looks very nice and I would mainly breed in a male mating and I think she would be good in that mating, I would not use her if I was looking for females though. From what I can see it looks like she is dark all the way around on the bottom half. I am of a belief that these really good type females should be bred someway.

    I believe that we will get more good type and color Wheatens if we single and double mate the choice type Marans.

    I hope we can get some comment from from of the other Wheaten breeders. This wheaten pattern will be different than any other wheaten color already in the APA SOP. Don
     
  4. snowbird

    snowbird Overrun With Chickens

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    Illia, In my breeding of wheatens I myself would not use the male with too much red, This would be like using the BC with brown breast. Don
     
  5. snowbird

    snowbird Overrun With Chickens

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    Just like to ad when I talk about white wing and tail feather I am talking about after Juve molt feathers and will not breed these males. If anyone else would like to breed them in their program that is fine also as you are the one buying the feed and taking care of them. I am only saying what I would do and everyone else feel free to do what you would like. Don
     
  6. Illia

    Illia Crazy for Colors

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    Oh, the all red one is on my cull list. He's not touching any Wheatens.

    And yes, I'm having a feeling I'll be double mating here. I'm working on using my lightest Wheaten to improve the males, the darker wheaten shown I'm going to see where she goes. . .
     
  7. snowbird

    snowbird Overrun With Chickens

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    What bothers me most is the Gene pool is so small it is hard to find something that is not real close bred, I do not believe they are as hardy as I would like them to be.
     
  8. blackdotte

    blackdotte Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Illia, you red cockerel is heterozygous for the Columbian gene, thus he is nearly a Black-tailed Buff.
    Genotype for Wheaten is eWh/eWh s+/s+ and BTBuff eWh/eWh s+/s+ Co/Co.

    There is some natural variation in Wheaten hens, I would find both your acceptable.
    Wheatens should have a solid black (or blue) breast, no ticking.
    White feathers in wings & tail are a fault, as is the protrusion of white at the base of the tail.
    Both can be bred out.
    Good tail set on the females & the dark male.
    David
     
  9. Illia

    Illia Crazy for Colors

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    Actually, the dark male does not have a good tail set. He's crowing in the photo, but otherwise his tail is just close to 90 degrees, but not quite.

    I doubt the red has Columbian in him though. . . He's everything wheaten but for the excess red in the chest, which the other boys even have little bits of red. . . I'm sometimes wondering if maybe he's a "Wheaten" from my black copper eggs. I had some BC eggs hatching with the Wheaties, but I'm pretty darn sure that this guy hatched from a Wheaten egg. They're rounder and I did have them separated.

    All my pullets have good tails, good color - But one of them has a tall, upright, thin tail like my Wheatens here. She also has a more narrow body and a taller, leaning comb. I'm not breeding her.

    The only good male I have, in my opinion, is my Blue Wheaten. He still has faults though, and yes I do know there should be no red in the chest (that's why I brought it up)

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    By spring I'm only going to be breeding my Blue Wheaten and two of my Wheaten pullets. . . The other Wheaten boys will be culled from the program and the extra Wheaten pullet will just be a layer, but eventually sold when I've got someone to replace her. I'd like more than just a couple Wheaten pullets, and I'd like a Blue Wheaten pullet or two again.

    One thing I'd really like to see are my choices for new blood in the flock. I see so few Wheaten breeders out there, but I'd like to see more. Especially with egg color.
     
    2 people like this.
  10. flgardengirl

    flgardengirl Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Sunny side up :)
    I finally found my new camera charger. I will take some pics of my male wheatens tomorrow. I only have one female right now and 3 males. I need to hatch out some more. I was thinking I could add some blue marans females in to take the breeding pressure off my one lone wheaten hen. I have to figure out between two males which one I should use to breed them. The smallest one has a foot problem so I won't be using him. I think the middle one is the best and has the best comb. The third one is the biggest and the prettiest and the nicest but he has 6 points on his comb.
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2010

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