Who knows better than Warren??

Discussion in 'Random Ramblings' started by I have WHAT in my yard?, Aug 15, 2011.

  1. I have WHAT in my yard?

    I have WHAT in my yard? Chillin' With My Peeps

    Jun 24, 2008
    Eggberg, PA
    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/15/opinion/stop-coddling-the-super-rich.html?_r=1


    Job
    one for the 12 is to pare down some future promises that even a rich America can’t fulfill. Big money must be saved here. The 12 should then turn to the issue of revenues. I would leave rates for 99.7 percent of taxpayers unchanged and continue the current 2-percentage-point reduction in the employee contribution to the payroll tax. This cut helps the poor and the middle class, who need every break they can get.
    But for those making more than $1 million — there were 236,883 such households in 2009 — I would raise rates immediately on taxable income in excess of $1 million, including, of course, dividends and capital gains. And for those who make $10 million or more — there were 8,274 in 2009 — I would suggest an additional increase in rate.
    My friends and I have been coddled long enough by a billionaire-friendly Congress. It’s time for our government to get serious about shared sacrifice.
    Warren E. Buffett is the chairman and chief executive of Berkshire Hathaway.

    The entire piece is definitely worth the read!!​
     
  2. Ridgerunner

    Ridgerunner Chicken Obsessed

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    I did not see in the article how much additional revenue from the super-rich to the federal government Buffet was talking about. It would be a nice symbol to tax the super-rich more, but I really doubt it would make a significant difference to our deficit. It is sure not going to solve all our problems. It's just not going to be this simple.

    When your boat is sinking, you plug the leak and bail out the water. We need to reduce spending, but increasing revenue also needs to be on the agenda. Plugging 10% of the leak and refusing to bail is not going to right the boat.
     
  3. jojo@rolling acres farm

    jojo@rolling acres farm Chillin' With My Peeps

    May 15, 2009
    Nebraska
    There are approximately 8,000 people in that tax bracket that would qualify. Even if the government takes ALL OF THEIR MONEY. It wouldn't be enough. We don't need less Millionaires - we need more! We need to make the US business friendly again. Less taxes would mean less jobs being moved to other countries. As a nation - we need to wake up - just like the previous post indicates - there is no easy answer. We are spending way too much on entitlements and pet projects of corrupt politicians - who stay in power much too long. They are able to stay in power because people don't pay attention to voting records - we need term limits. We need to take away their pensions...let's start there with cost cutting. Make it less desireable to stay in power decade upon decade getting increasingly corrupt as time goes on - all at the expenses of the American Tax payer.

    We need an educated electorate that the politicians may start to respect. Currently, they know the vast majority of people don't pay attention to the way they vote. They say and do one thing in DC and act another way back home. They tell us what they THINK we want to hear. Both major political parties share the blame in this mess. We need backbone and we need it now. We need to say NO to special interests we, as a Nation, need to make tough decisions and stop passing the buck to the next generation. Each person needs to know who and what they are voting for. Read, ask questions - know why you are voting the way you are. Stop voting along party lines - vote independentely - force them to sit up and take notice. Right now, they thumb their noses at everyone of us. Most of the time THEY don't even know what is attached to their bloated ridiculous bills. Pass it to know what's in it? That is what Pelosi said about Obama Care.
     
  4. Ridgerunner

    Ridgerunner Chicken Obsessed

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    Actually, there are more like 244,000 in the group Buffet is talking about if I read it right. And he is not talking about millionaires. He is talking about people that make more than $1 million each year. There is a huge difference.

    I'm not a huge fan of term limits. I don't think they solve the problems people think they will. The professional politicians just change jobs, Representative, Senator, Governor, or get appointed to a political position until they are eligible to run again. And I like the idea of institutional memory. The issues are complicated. Actions have consequences. You get idealistic rookies showing up that are going to change the world so they want to do certain things. The members that have been there and went through it already know better what those consequences are. Why do you think so many people change when they get to Washington? They get an education about what the consequences of some of those actions are. They realize many of those idealistic rookie naive positions will hurt the country a lot more than help it. Most of them are reasonably intelligent and most do really care about the country. If they get hit over the head long enough and hard enough with cold hard facts, most of them start to pay attention.

    So why don't they explain this to their constituents? We won't let them. It's complicated, so most of us get bored and won't listen. And by trying to explain cold hard facts, their political opponents can pick out sound bites, take them out of context, put cute jingles with them, and destroy them politically. They commit political suicide if they try to be honest with the electorate. So we get campaign promises that they know they will not be able to follow up on. And, to me much worse, because they cannot honestly discuss the issues and consequences without committing political suicide, we cannot get an honest debate on an issue. If they don't politically posture, they have no chance of getting elected.

    Besides, politics is a craft. When rookies show up in Washington, they don't accomplish much until they learn what is going on. That can take a term or two. It takes skill and knowledge to get a bill through congress. You get that through experience. No, I am not a fan of term limits for my Representatives and Senators. I'm all for it with yours though. Besides, the President is term limited. Has that helped?

    If someone shows up in Washington standing so firm on principle that they will get a hernia if they burp, they are irrelevant. Unless they get everything they want, they are a "no" vote. Nobody is going to get everything they want in a complicated controversial bill that requires 60 Senators and 218 (I think that number is right) Representatives to vote for it and a President to sign it. There is no reason to even listen to them or talk to them. The way a complicated controversial bill gets passed is that enough people get enough of what they want so that they can stomach accepting some of what they don't want. That way, instead of the extremes winning, we get a balanced approach. I think a big part of the problems we are facing is that we have too many people scared to death of burping.

    So why are we in the position we are in? It's complicated and it involves the rest of the world. We are not going to be able to solve it alone. And the politicians we have been electing have not had to face the consequences of their actions. We have been a great robust economy. We have been growing so money has never been a problem. But some things have been going on lately that have changed that. We are aging. We are getting to where we have a greater percentage retiring than paying into the systems that support those retirees. It's not the politicians we have elected that have really caused the problems with pension plans, Social Security, Medicare and all that. It is pure demographics. The politicians have been doing what we wanted them to do. Spend money on us. That's why we kept reelecting them.

    The rest of the world has changed. With the developing world, we now have competition for the natural resources, especially energy, so the cost of doing business has gone up for us. We also have competition in supplying the world market.

    Our demographics have changed and the business model we thrived in has changed. We need to change the way we are doing things. And with us, the voters, not allowing our leaders to have an honest discussion of what the real problems are, I'm really concerned we are not going to find a good answer. These are complicated issues. Rookies with no experience are not going to be able to solve them.

    So back to IHWIMY's original topic, sort of. I consider taxing the super-rich more a logical step, but like term limits, I think it is more of a distraction that a real solution. And I really don’t think term limits is a logic step.
     
  5. caspernc

    caspernc Chillin' With My Peeps

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    And what about a flat tax on consumption! Those who make more consume more and thus pay more! Do away with all other taxes.
     
  6. Ridgerunner

    Ridgerunner Chicken Obsessed

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    Quote:Wouldn't a graduated income tax rate do that, sort of. Not on consumption but on earnings. The ones that can afford to pay more, pay more. Just get rid of the loopholes, often called deductions. The flat tax sounds sexy, but it is a regressive tax. The ones that can least afford it pay a larger percentage of their income in taxes.

    Or if you go that direction, exclude food and water. Yes, I said water. I don't mean bottled water. I mean tap water in residences. Water is a basic necessity yet you'd be surprised how heavily it is taxed. So, yes, I do favor some loopholes.
     
  7. jojo@rolling acres farm

    jojo@rolling acres farm Chillin' With My Peeps

    May 15, 2009
    Nebraska
    So what is your solution? Leave things as they are? Sorry, I don't believe we can leave it to career politicians. We can not keep taxing our way out of these things. We need to make cuts and we need to make them now. The budget deal that was cut several days ago was not a solution. Why did they think they needed to wait to start making adjustments to the budget until AFTER the next election? Because they are afraid to make a stand! We send them there to stand for what the people of our nation want. We need to stop endless aid to other countries. We need to stop nation building outside of our own Nation. We need to enforce our immigration laws that already on the books.
    The government needs to stop subsidizing companies like EXxon Mobile.

    Congress needs to re- learn how to say things in simple terms. They need to write bills that are straight to the point. They need to stop attaching ammendments to bills that have nothing to do with the original topic of the bill. Government is too big and too involved in our lives. By saying that it is "too complicated" for the average citizen or as you say "Rookie" to get involved is a cop out. That is like throwing up your hands and giving up.

    I also think the committe of 12 is a mistake - we do everything by "committee" now and most of the time behind closed doors this is not what our founders had in mind. What happened to the plan of posting all bills on line for review - before the bill is voted on? Another empty promise put forward as window dressing to appease us Rookies I guess.

    They stopped listening to the voter long ago. They break off into their committees - become insulated from the real world and vote the way the special interests tell them to. It needs to stop. Please don't tell me that they try to explain why things are the way they are and we're not listening.They tell us what they think we want to hear. They're the ones that aren't listening.

    Obama is taking a 10 day vacation. Congress is on their break. They all need to get back to Washington, Stop with all the fund raising trips and parties and get back to work. It's called leadership and we need it now - along with a good dose of common sense. The path we're on is not working.
     
  8. caspernc

    caspernc Chillin' With My Peeps

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    N0!A flat tax only taxes things you buy. NOT what you earn. What you buy. We Pay about 49% with the sales tax and income tax. Not to mention all the other taxes we pay. If we payed a flat rate tax EVERYOONE would pay taxes. But how UNFARE would that be......right?
     
  9. chickened

    chickened Overrun With Chickens

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    As I remember the Clintons talked about taxing the rich then got elected and made a fortune on the back of the middle class.

    The federal government should not have any more power than an individual American citizen.
     
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2011
  10. redsoxs

    redsoxs Chicken Obsessed

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    For me there would HAVE to be an iron clad provision that any revenue garnered from "the rich" would go toward and only toward deficit reduction, not more "stimulus." Just my 2 cents.
     

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