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Ayam Cemani - Page 8  

post #71 of 839

There are a lot of breeds already legally in Canada and the USA that could be combined to make a Cemani look alike with some of the alleles found in Oceanic class stocks.   One could take a serama hen and mate her to the smallest dark skinned South American type fowl you can get, and recover larger single combed individuals in both sexes with black skin in the F2.  One of these could be mated to a black sumatra, and the F2 would again yield single combed individuals with very dark skin.  Lavender modern games, especially the dark skinned ones, would work too, if one wanted the slightly gamey look of the Indonesian stocks.  Lavender Moderns, in Canada, have some rapa nuis in them....used to get the dark skin that the European stock of Moderns already has.  It only takes a few generations to breed up size from seramas, when crossed anything else.

Jocelyn

post #72 of 839
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dipsy Doodle Doo 

Oh!  Nice pics!  I like the looks of the heavier-set birds better than the lanky ones.
That is a really unusual comb:
http://images03.olx.co.id/ui/6/57/32/1275938628_98695532_2-Ayam-Cemani-Malang-1275938628.jpg
or is it just a weird camera angle?


Isn't it. It looks almost like a fin. The hen above that photo is from the same website - looks like she is from the same strain of Cemani. It looks like some sort of pea comb (there are the three lengthwise ridges).

Quote:
Originally Posted by jocelynpei 

There are a lot of breeds already legally in Canada and the USA that could be combined to make a Cemani look alike with some of the alleles found in Oceanic class stocks.   One could take a serama hen and mate her to the smallest dark skinned South American type fowl you can get, and recover larger single combed individuals in both sexes with black skin in the F2.  One of these could be mated to a black sumatra, and the F2 would again yield single combed individuals with very dark skin.  Lavender modern games, especially the dark skinned ones, would work too, if one wanted the slightly gamey look of the Indonesian stocks.  Lavender Moderns, in Canada, have some rapa nuis in them....used to get the dark skin that the European stock of Moderns already has.  It only takes a few generations to breed up size from seramas, when crossed anything else.


The Swedish Black Hen (Svarthöna) is another all black, black combed, black feathered breed:

http://user.tninet.se/~pvk356k/svart.jpg
http://www.odla.nu/forums/uploads/1216035356/gallery_12674_1550_120756.jpg

And here's another black fleshed Chinese breed, this one with pretty golden hackles: the Dongxiang (东乡黑鸡, Dōngxiāng hēi jī)
http://i459.photobucket.com/albums/qq314/JocelynClarke/DongxiangBlue-shelledLayers.jpg

Why go to the trouble of trying to breed a simulated Cemani?  There are quite a few all black breeds out there. If you want to "create",  why not try to create a new, unique looking one of your own?  An all black bird of any shape and size is a pretty compelling looking creature.

The true Cemani is notable for the extreme darkness of its interior black pigmentation. It would be sad if a well meaning person "made" a Cemani-looking pet chicken which later was crossed back into a strain of pure Cemani and messed up the bloodline.

edited 12/21/10 to add Chinese term for Dongxiang fowl


Edited by exop - 12/21/10 at 5:21am
post #73 of 839
Quote:
Originally Posted by exop 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DTchickens 

i know two people, maybe more.. That have Ayam cemanis they imported VIA indonesia.. i believe it was indonesia anyway, but won't say they're names.. Wait a couple years and you'll probably see a lot popping up.


This would have been before the outbreak of bird flu?


Don't know honestly, never asked never was told. Just know they had them.. Europe is a place you could get the birds from for a price too, I know they have them there... Pure birds too, not a look alike someone created, which in my opinion would be just that "A look alike."And could never be called a Ayam Cemani.

Fourth generation poultry breeder focusing on Kraienköppe- the breed that won my heart and replaced all others on my farm.
http://www.freewebs.com/dtsfowl/

 

Interested in poultry showing? Live in Mississippi or a nearby state? Check out the Mississippi Poultry Show Club

Fourth generation poultry breeder focusing on Kraienköppe- the breed that won my heart and replaced all others on my farm.
http://www.freewebs.com/dtsfowl/

 

Interested in poultry showing? Live in Mississippi or a nearby state? Check out the Mississippi Poultry Show Club

post #74 of 839

Some of the south american stocks are very dark meat, very black.  They are every bit as black as the swarthons, Swedish black hens.  If one wishes to explore the possibilities of a mirror phenotype, they could form the base.  One will have difficulties with imports for the next while, due to bird flu in Indonesia...so it depends on what you want, which way you go with it.http://i459.photobucket.com/albums/qq314/JocelynClarke/blackbeardedsinglecombedmale.jpghttp://i459.photobucket.com/albums/qq314/JocelynClarke/Betty.jpg

post #75 of 839

Hello, jocelynpei,

Are you the same person whose album picture of the Dongxiang I linked above? If so, thanks. I found that photo on The Coop, and have been fascinated by it ever since. When searching the web for more information about the breed, I've found several scholarly articles about egg pigmentation but no other photos until just now, when I finally stumbled on the correct search term in Chinese. May I ask, where did you find the picture originally? It looks like an extract from a book or magazine.

Are you located in South America?

Best regards, exop


Edited by exop - 12/21/10 at 5:23am
post #76 of 839

Yes, I am the person who originally posted the Dong Xiang picture.  It comes from a paper in the  the Blue Egg Clucker, a newsletter from the Araucana Club of America.  There is a Chinese researcher studying the blue egg gene, and he has asked for blood samples from folks with araucanas, quetros, quechuas, mixed race South American stocks, so we all sent them.  He has not published or gone to peer review, so I can't say more yet. 
I am in Canada.smile

post #77 of 839

And FYI they lay white eggs.
The Cemani dont lay white eggs they are tinted ,And the combs on a Cemani arent pea they should have 7 serations

post #78 of 839

European hobbyists have established their own standard for the Cemani, based on a very small number of Cemani that were imported and bred for uniformity; but in Indonesia they aren't standardised.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tingle 

And FYI they lay white eggs.


You were quoting and rebutting JaydeesLaydee?

Just to clarify for anyone confused about which eggs tingle meant, the Dongxiang are known for their blue eggs:

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:2WZ4MADb-4FbDM: http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:B1kPS-bcQI6vQM:http://www.jxkbjq88.com/upload/20100805155143340.jpg
(Click on either picture for a close-up)


Edited by exop - 12/25/10 at 2:03pm
post #79 of 839

hi, ayam cemani (black chicken) are rare kind of native chickens originated in Indonesia, but neighboring countries also have this one, but its hard to find a 100% pure breed of this black chicken... and nowadays, this chicken is more and more sought after and it takes a lot of people as a condition / requirement for purposes of intent / special interests, then the Chicken Cemani have exorbitant price, really fantastic, and can cost big amount of money... we have some of these here in the Philippines, and were looking for a good buyer in good purpose... big_smile have a great day ahead everyone big_smile

here's something i want to share with you guys big_smile

http://buzz4.blogspot.com/2011/03/information-history-and-efficacy-of.html

post #80 of 839

I have just picked up a Ayam Cemani hen. Beautiful bird. Here are the pictures.

http://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/uploads/112042_2012-01_various_2012-01-02_230.jpg
http://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/uploads/112042_2012-01_various_2012-01-02_232.jpg

She doesn't like to go in the coop with the other birds but prefers to roost alone higher up on a bar in the run.  Has anyone else found this?
http://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/uploads/112042_2012-01_chickens_january_004.jpg


Edited by Bluedwarf - 1/5/12 at 12:37pm
5 Bantums, 2 Buff Brahmas, 2 Sussex (light and reverse), 1 Crested Legbar, 1 Silver Grey Dorking, 2 Legbars (possibly Cream or Cotswold), oh, and a pair of Barb u'duccles
5 Bantums, 2 Buff Brahmas, 2 Sussex (light and reverse), 1 Crested Legbar, 1 Silver Grey Dorking, 2 Legbars (possibly Cream or Cotswold), oh, and a pair of Barb u'duccles
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