Chicken unable to swallow, empty crop, slime coming out of beak (Metrodinazole and Nystatin no effect)

[orelsi]

This is a weird one. I have treated different types of Canker (Thrichonomas) and Sour crop, so I thought I was prepared for everything.

One of my favourite hens had a heavy molt and then in the span of weeks started acting listless and losing weight. She is a 6yo mixed breed, was in perfect health before this.

I thought it was the molt, but then I noticed her opening the beak quite often like something was causing her irritation and some colourless slime coming out of it when she was drinking water. I opened her beak and took a look down the pipe, there was a yellow spongy substance under and around her tongue. I thought Canker and gave her Metronidazole for 5 days, the yellow subtance disappeared, but her condition did not improve. She was having harder and harder time swallowing, having her neck completely vertical in order to do so. It got to a point where her entire mouth and esophagus were covered in colourless slime and she was unable to eat or drink, her crop was empty 24/7, she started losing weight rapidly. I started her on Nystatin 48h ago - my go to for Sour crop, but I don't see a positive change. I have never had a Sour crop case where the crop is empty constantly, but I have read it is possible. She can still swallow the medicine, but can't eat. I fed her a liquid blended mix of yoghurt and boiled egg, 5 or 6 coffee spoons and some water a couple times today just to keep her alive. I also gave her a couple spoons of diluted apple cider vinegar between the Nystatin.

I am out of ideas and don't see her surviving this unless she starts eating. What can cause the above symptoms that is not affected by Metronidazole and Nystatin?

p.s. can't take her to a vet or do any tests on samples, they don't want to treat chickens around here

 

[Certified Chicken Lover]

@Wyorp Rock @Eggcessive @azygous

 

[Eggcessive]

It sounds like canker, but is there a bad odor from her beak? I would cull for canker, since it is chronic and contagious. Many seem to have trouble treating with metronidazole or ronidazole, but most don’t ever get a proper diagnosis from a vet. I haven’t treated it, but some others have used acidified copper sulfate to treat canker and sour crop. Dosage of that is 1/4 tsp per gallon of water for 7-10 days, changed daily. Here is where to purchase it:
https://jedds.com/products/acidified-copper-sulfate-animal-science

 

[orelsi]

I found a copper sulfate seller locally. I'll try it and report back in a couple of days.

 

[Eggcessive]

I found a copper sulfate seller locally. I'll try it and report back in a couple of days.

You cannot use copper sulfate, but it has to be acidified copper sulfate. I would buy the inexpensive packet from Jedds, Murray McMurray, or Jefferspet.com. You can acidify the copper sulfate yourself, but I would not fool with it. Copper sulfate itself is not safe for chickens.
https://www.jefferspet.com/acidified-copper-sulfate/p

 

[orelsi]

You cannot use copper sulfate, but it has to be acidified copper sulfate.

Oh yeah of course, that was just a shorthand. I got the acidified one. Thanks.

 

[orelsi]

Ok, update. Bad news is I had to put her down, her suffering was too much and there was no hope for a cure. Good news is I found out what the sickness was - a fringe case of wet fowl pox also known as chicken diphtheria. I took notes, because I wanted something good to come out of this. Maybe it will help someone in the forum in the future. Let me explain.

Talked to a friend of mine and shared the issue, turned out he had a relative of his as a guest for the holidays who is a retired vet. The man was good enough to come over and examine her. According to him some outlier cases of wet fowl pox are indistinguishable from canker without tests or an experienced vet - both have the slime and it can be colourless in both, although it has some kind of colour in most canker cases. Both have the white-yellow cheesy looking lesion or membrane, it looks different in early stages, but in advanced stages it can look very similar to a point of requiring a specialist to diagnose it. Both have bad smell although in most cases canker smells worse, foul, while wet fowl pox is "only" unpleasant. The wet variant can have no visible scabs on the outside of the mouth/head like the ones from dry fowl pox. Wet fowl pox can infect only the digestive system mouth/esophagus without touching the respiratory system, so it may present without any breathing issues, rasps or gurgling, which it did in this case. The opposite can happen as well - infection only of the respiratory system leading to blockages and suffocation in severe cases. Many chickens catch it and their immune system defeats it without the owner even realizing it, but if the chicken is 5+ years or has had some immunity lowering issue - physical trauma, bad living conditions or heavy molt, like mine did, the disease can take over rapidly and there is no cure. It's a virus, so antibiotics are useless unless there's a secondary infection. You can force feed the chicken and keep it alive, starvation being the primary cause of death, but eventually it will catch something else that will finish it off while suffering constant starvation. Not a good fate. There is also the danger of infecting others in the flock, it's slow spreading, because the hen doesn't eat and drink and can't infect the common areas, but tears, saliva, blood can eventually find their way to a flock mate. The best you can do is separate her in a dry and warm space, food and water if she still can eat, some vitamins and hope she defeats it. If there's no progress in several days it means she won't get better ever and the virus has won.

I was pissed off for a couple of days, so waited to make this post. Even after 20 years of raising chickens I get mad when I can't cure them. Never had a wet pox case before either. So, here's a pic of Yellow Streak or Yellow for short (which was always fun since she had no yellow on her after she grew up) from her best days, I choose to remember those. I hope the above information is helpful to someone.

 

[Eggcessive]

Sorry for your loss. She was a beautiful hen. Are you in the US? Even though the vet of your friend saw her, and guess that it was the diphtheritic or wet form of fowl pox, it would still have been good to have had a state vet necropsy where the pathologist could have confirmed it being pox or canker. They also can do other testing which could be beneficial to knowing what could affect your flock in the future. Hopefully this won’t affect any others.

 

[orelsi]

it would still have been good to have had a state vet necropsy where the pathologist could have confirmed it being pox or canker.

Thought about it, but weather was bad and the closest one is pretty far away. We cremated the remains.