Decrowing Roosters.

[polarbearpilot]

Skink,
I am the proud owner of 2 altered roos. I did purchase them post surgery they were not my "prized pets" I was trying to save.They enable me to hatch new hens for my small farm flock, supply me with a few males for processing, and protect my flock. As I live on a 3 acre lot in a subdivision my neighbors would not appreciate an intact roo....so compromise is necessary. Both roos are still capable of vocals (alarms, here is a goodie ladies, and even crowing) but the sound is reduced and doesn't carry as far. Neither seems bothered by the surgery and live normal lives.
While it seems you will probably not agree I would like to point out this surgery is no different then spaying or neutering. It is standard to dock tails on sheep, ears, tails,and dewclaws on dogs, and de-claw house cats. All these procedures are strictly cosmetic but widely accepted.Countless animals are altered to suit human preference on a daily basis. At least this isn't a cosmetic choice.
Basically I guess what I want to say is if you think it's wrong don't get a decrowed roo. I am against the cropping and docking of dogs so my Australian Shepard still has her tail but I don't voice my opinion on pro docking sites.

X 2

 

[gazoo35]

I would like to have roosters but they are not allowed because of the noise. Do you have a video that shows the procedure so other vets can do this to?

 

[Eburger]

My goodness, I guess you put me in my place. I was selfish and cruel to decrow Wally and I should have found him a new home. Well there goes another of my freedoms. I loved Wally and I would do the same again if I faced the same situation. I also have my male rabbits neutered so they can live with a female companion. I do what I think is best for my animals and will continue to do so within the confines of the law. I think this discussion of decrowing roosters is interesting and helpful and we shouldn't be shamed into doing what you say is the right thing to do.

 

[ChocolateMouse]

Skink, I think if you want anyone to take you seriously you are going to be a little less petty. Referring to everyone who wants a decrowed too basically as a sheeple selfishly chopping up their bird so they can keep them illegally and show them off to freinds as a trophy will win you no prizes and a lot of enemies. So will childishly implying we think youre some sort of PETA type activist. Although you articulate yourself in much the same manner...

The fact is that simple operations put our pets at risk every day. Tooth cleanings for dogs, feeding raw diets, spays and neuters, c-sections, dockings, removal of claws and dewclaws... This is nothing new. Are you saying you have never had an elective surgery on an animal before? Like, say, making sure your dog was fixed? Why should people be allowed to own dogs/cats/rabbits etc if they have to cut them up before they fit into there lifestyle? Why cant they just magicaly rehome puppies like all the people who magically can rehome roosters? And if you cant deal with heat cycles and humping and aggression you shouldn't dare own a dog. They certainly don't need them, especially in a back yard! Pssh!

The fact of he matter is that I currently run a PROFITABLE urban farm and animal raising operation. Not a "hobby farm" that costs me more than I earn, but an honest to god urban farm that feeds me and pays for itself and its own expansion. I am not playing around at farming or looking for trophies, I am completely legal, and a decrowed rooster is an option I am highly considering because shockingly, my urban farm has urban type neighbors. And I have to be within my suburbs ordinances and not disturb my neighbors that live 100ft from my chicken coop. And by raising out a quality Ameraucana rooster I can have a $300 investment into my flock of ten that brings the money I make from selling a dozen eggs go up from $3 to $30 with Easter Egger hatching eggs. That is a chance at a real benefit for my flock. Organic food, lights in the winter, their own hoophouse, a nicer coop... And meanwhile my flock gets the added benefit of a complete social structure for the rooster.

Frankly, nobody looses. And when somebody decides to hold a knife to your throat and give you the option of whispering forever or death... I have no doubt in mind you would choose the chicken option as well.

 

[Phage]

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[akhomesteader]

I am seriously interested in having some of my rooster decrowed. I live in the city(hens only...which is really frustrating) and am recreating a breed of chicken I developed in Fairbanks Alaska 20 years ago called the Alaskan Homesteader. I have to sell or butcher my best males and I hate it. How much do you charge to decrow a rooster. My mom lives in Oklahoma so i could realistically drive from ohio with my birds. If you can do it.

I used to love to sit i my chicken yard for hours, but now the crowing roosters stress me out due to the potential for complaints, so the experience is fast becoming discouraging.

I hope you can help me.

 

[akhomesteader]

I really agree with you whole heartedly. I am trying to re-create a breed of chicken I developed in Fairbanks Alaska called the Alaskan homesteader, but now I love in 1/8 acre in the city. 7ft privacy fence and lots of trees. Perfect for chickens. Mine are illegal, and the roosters are going to get me in trouble. You are right. It is no different that spaying or neutering, or even more similar to de-scenting a ferret or skunk. Glad you posted. Thanks

 

[Victoria-nola]

I am seriously interested in having some of my rooster decrowed. I live in the city(hens only...which is really frustrating) and am recreating a breed of chicken I developed in Fairbanks Alaska 20 years ago called the Alaskan Homesteader. I have to sell or butcher my best males and I hate it. How much do you charge to decrow a rooster. My mom lives in Oklahoma so i could realistically drive from ohio with my birds. If you can do it.

I used to love to sit i my chicken yard for hours, but now the crowing roosters stress me out due to the potential for complaints, so the experience is fast becoming discouraging.

I hope you can help me.

I took our roo up to Dr James and it was great meeting him. I spent the afternoon at a local archeological site while the surgery was being done. I'm sure you'll be able to get this arranged.

 

[Victoria-nola]

I'm re-posting my long story about taking my roo to Dr James for the procedure. My roo is still very happy, the neighbor is happy, we are VERY happy.

But first, to "Skink": You don't know what you're talking about with respect to what this procedure does, the results it creates, nor do you have any idea about why people want to keep their roosters.

-----------Below is my original post on this subject:------------------------------

I apologize for the length of this report, but I figure people might want the information. You should have seen the first draft!

As I’ve mentioned a couple of times, I drove my very sweet, lovable rooster to Dr James to have the crow softening surgery, which occurred June 20, or 24 days ago. We loved his crowing, and all our neighbors loved his crowing, except for one neighbor, the newest one, who’s been heard to say, “I just want more control”.

Deeply concerned, I found Dr James’ thread and read up on this possibility. My partner and I agreed that we really wanted to keep our rooster. I moved Dred (the roo, as in dredlocks) to a foster home in the country, and made arrangements with Dr James. The week prior, I took Dred to the parish (county) extension agent in charge of chickens, who took blood and tested for pullorum, issued a health certificate, and put a band on Dred’s leg. The test was free, the certificate was $24.

Dr James’ office staff were friendly and sympathetic, and I really liked Dr James. You know how vets often have a single animal species that they really resonate with, even though they can treat all animals? Dr James is like that about chickens. He really likes them. He genuinely would like more people to be able to keep chickens and to have the whole life-cycle of chickens if people wish. His desire to help with a crow-softening is purely a desire that more roosters could live out full lives. So number one, Dr James is a really nice, thoughtful person whose heart is totally in the right place, and whose skills are very highly developed (he makes his own surgical implements for this surgery). The idea that some have expressed that he may be only doing it for the money is absurd, considering the amount of time he had to spend to arrange the whole thing with me, and the training and study he’s done, the money is not a lot; and moreover, if Dr James didn’t charge for his services he couldn’t stay in business, and that wouldn’t help anyone.

The procedure was done under proper sterility and anesthetic. I went to visit a local archeological site and returned several hours later to find Dred awake and alert. Dr James talked with me about how it went, what to expect in the next few days, and specifically about clipping the stitch that was holding some bandaging in place but that would need to be released after 24 hours.

During the healing process Dred made various sounds, including some gurgling sounds that came and went, but after the first week the only sounds we heard were his deliberate voicings. The gurgling was part of the healing but isn’t there any longer.

Dr James suspects that the less a rooster crows (or attempts to crow) during the first 3 weeks after the procedure, the more successful the procedure will be. Accordingly, I kept Dred indoors and put him in a good-sized crate, and controlled the light he got to minimize the desire to crow. I cut a piece of foam-core poster board and used zipties to create a false, lower ceiling in the crate in order to prevent Dred from stretching out his neck completely, since one of the suggested ways to keep a roo from crowing is to put the roost so close to the ceiling that the roo can’t stretch out enough to crow. After the first couple of days, he did still find ways to crow, but not as robustly as usual, and the sound was very airy and not loud. I took him out of the crate every day to flap his wings, stretch, and walk around; we also provided him with lots of tempting healthy goodies, including filtered water, organic grain, probiotics and nuturitional supplements, fruits and vegetables, and dried mealworms.

The night we got back I clipped the stitch, and after it came out Dred cuddled his body close against me, put his head on my shoulder, and just hugged me like that for some long minutes.

Suffice to say, we hated keeping him confined but it didn’t make any sense to us to spend all that time and money and then not follow through and give it the best possible shot we could. We wanted Dred to succeed and get back to his family. Dr James observes that older roosters have less easy success with this procedure than younger ones do (they can tend to regain more voice), and our Dred is 2 years old, so we wanted to give him every chance.

After two weeks, we just couldn’t take it any more and I took him outside to his girls. When I carried him out the sidedoor and he recognized where he was, he squirmed and I set him down, and he hit the ground running full bore out to the yard. He was and is still ecstatic, and the girls were stunned to see him-- chicken love ensued immediately. They congregated the instant he showed up and have remained a single flock since then; during Dred’s absence they had disintegrated and didn’t keep together while out ranging during the day.

While Dred was in foster care, we put up privacy fencing on our side of the chainlink fence that separates our property from the controlling neighbor. So once we released Dred back into our yard, the neighbor could no longer easily gaze and watch our business. We have heard nothing from that neighbor (I knock wood) since releasing Dred 10 days ago. So, I cautiously say that it seems to be working.

Sound levels: If anything, Dred’s crow has gotten even softer since he moved outdoors. I don’t know how that could be, but it seems so. We hear him crow, but it’s so attenuated, so airy and light, that it doesn’t carry far, whereas he previously had this huge forceful sound that would carry a long way.

Behavior: The girls still love him. He still does all the things he used to in terms of watching out for them and finding food. He rounds them up when it’s time to roost, and he periodically checks during the day and brings in the stragglers who might wander. He still makes the range of sounds he always did, and he’s still audible enough to communicate with the hens. He’s the same as he used to be on the roost, where he rotates which hen is his favorite.

How do I feel? Well, Dred trusts me now-- he was wary before (and I of him). I had been afraid his personality might change as a result of all this, but it didn’t. If anything, since he now trusts me and got to know, while indoors, that the dogs are harmless, he’s even more laid back than he was.

I wish we hadn’t been forced into this, but we were, and I’m just deeply grateful that Dr James had talked about his procedure on backyardchickens.com, and that I found the discussion, and that I followed through, and that we still have our wonderful rooster. I wish Dred still had his full voice, but that wasn’t possible if he was to stay with his family, and I saw with my own eyes his ecstatic joy when he realized he was back at home with his ladies.

So yes, this is not a procedure for agricultural operations, but presumably such operations don’t have neighbors who have a right to complain. This is a procedure that can allow a rooster to stay in a family who has a pet or backyard chicken coop in the suburbs or the city, or that can allow a family to buy a rooster who has already had the procedure, with the knowledge that the rooster’s calls won’t become a problem in the future. I am grateful, so very grateful.

 

[akhomesteader]

That's wonderful news! I have to get rid of my rooster, because he is very loud and I live in the city where the houses are close. I bought 2 lots and fenced them in totally with 7 ft solid wood fence. I am buying the 2 lots next door and will fence it in, then plant fast growing hemlock bushes that block the view of second story house next door 12 months out of the year. They grow 3-5 ft a year!
I have 20 new babies and want to choose 2 or 3 roosters to keep permanently and they should be decrowed as soon as I know who I am keeping for best results.

I also ordered 25 fast growing hybrid poplars 2 years ago and they are already 18 feet tall, so my yard will be solid forest up to 70 feet in just a few years, and the hemlocks will absorb any extra noise the chickens make, which gives me peace of mind. There is a certain amount of stress that comes from an "illegal" rooster.

So my reason for writing is that I can't figure out how to get a hold of Dr. James to make the arrangements. I also am not familiar with the blood test you are referring to. Is it mandatory for the proceedure? I would appreciate it if you could share that information with me. I was also wondering if Dr. James can also figure out how to silence the hens from crowing ( they will crow if there is no rooster.) Also that loud cackling they do during their egg laying excitement can actually be louder than a rooster, especially if they all start in at once. My entire flock is illegal, due to the ridiculous bureaucratic steps needed to have chickens, then we are only allowed 4, which is not enough fro me. I lived 20 years in Alaska and had 30 acres and lots of chickens!

Thanks for taking the time to read this, I hope you can help me find Dr. James. My Mom lives in Oklahoma, so that would be a nice reason to visit. She was here recently and loved the chickens.

Thanks again,
Tim