Great Pyr and my flock ??'s

[Bear Foot Farm]

If great pyrs don't bond to birds why do so many very successful breeders of chickens and water fowl seem to keep quite a few great pry?

"Keeping" them doesn't mean they are "bonding" to the birds, and being an "LGD " breed doesn't mean you'll be able to train them not to harm birds, since birds don't react to canines the way sheep and goats do

There are probably more successful poultry breeders who keep no dogs at all.

The true LGD breeds were developed over the last couple of thousand years to guard mainly sheep and goats, not birds.

Don't assume a Pyr will be less likely to kill your birds than most any other breed, and don't assume you can let a Pyr "free range" the way birds do.

It's FAR harder to train the LGD breeds to ignore birds than it is to teach them to GUARD livestock​

 

[peteyfoozer]

I don't know how you would define 'bonding', but my biggest Maremma keeps his chickens in his sight constantly if they are out free ranging. He has set up a 'no fly zone' over the yard and was pretty upset when we hauled the meaties off to be processed. He pinned and plucked more than a couple growing up, but now he is their greatest defender. Not all LGD's will guard chickens, but those who do are invaluable. My other dog just ignores them, he isn't nearly as attached and would rather be with the lambs.

I can't think of anything else that will protect them from both ground and aerial predators unless they are totally confined.

 

[TDM]

Quote:
I was out on pasture feeding my birds today. The chickens sent up an alarm, and they went scurrying for cover under the mobile hen houses. My LGD took notice, saw the hawk flying overhead, and began going towards and barking at it. The pyr let up when the hawk passed over the area safely.

 

[Bear Foot Farm]

Not all LGD's will guard chickens

That is exactly what I've been saying all along.

Many seem to think getting one of the LGD breeds means they will have a "chicken protector" when that's just not the case most of the time.

Most think they can treat them like another yard dog, and that's why so many end up in shelters​

 

[Mountain Man Jim]

One doesn't need to "guard" chickens or even bond with them ... they're not going any place. Bonding is needed if the flock is going off to graze in the hills or something. Pyrs work great at protecting chickens because they are great at warding off predators. As long as the chickens are in the territory, job do.

As for training, chicken training is really no different than training for lambs and other young animals. ALL dogs need training around the chickens. Been there, got the t-shirt (several actually).

I would agree that Pyrs are not the only dog breed that one could use to protect chickens; several breeds have the needed guarding traits. But, Pyrs are darn good at the task.

Jim

 

[TDM]

Quote:
Let's not forget that the heavy coat of the pyr allows it to remain on duty during cold temperatures and still remain in comfort.

 

[carolinagirl58]

One reason I chose Anatolian Shepherds is the coat. I live in South Carolina and did not want to deal with the heavy coat that a Pyr has. Anatolian coats can handle harsh conditions too, but their summer coat is pretty maintenance free. Mine don't even use their dog houses even when it's raining outside.

 

[wyoDreamer]

A lady up the road from me raises LGDs, the Maremmas I think (if those are the Italian ones). She has a couple of small herds of sheep just for the dog's, so she can sell started pups. Last year she sold all the pups from the spring litter. Only one came back and that was because it was a chicken killer. She couldn't train that out of the pup, ended up selling it cheap - like $300 instead of the $1500+ that she got for the rest. She ended up selling it at a year old and had it neutered before it left the farm.

She contacted the other buyers and none of them have had any problems with the pups they got. One uses their LGD specifically for homestead protection, and the dog prefers to sleep under the chicken coop.

Just saying, you never know what you are getting until you get it home.

Does the breeder you are looking at have chickens at her house? If not, I would make the caveat that if the dogs prove to be chicken aggressive, you have the right to return the dogs and get your money back. Ask her about suggestions for intro to birds and how to correct unwanted behavior.

If you think you can make enough time to properly introduce the dogs to the birds, then I would say to go ahead and give the dogs a try. It sounds like a nice deal. Just be aware that it may take constant supervision and patience to train those dogs to do what you specifically want from them.

 

[r4eboxer]

Quote:
Thanks for this and all the other posts.

I do know that I will need to train these dogs. I am planning on putting the two dogs in an enclosure outside of the coop and run. The breeder suggested I put some of the chickens soiled hay in with the dogs for scent. I will not be letting the Pyr's free range with my birds as I don't want the dogs to run off.

I need protection at night from predators, I have been told that GP's sleep a lot during the day and are on guard at night. The way my homestead is set up gives my flock many areas for shelter. I have the main house the guest house, a large building that the flock can scurry under and two other buildings right around the house. The chickens free range there and have been safe (except for my own dog) Predators don't come that close to the house. I want the dogs to be of multi purpose. I need them to keep deer out of my gardens ( I lost over an acre of pumpkins to those darn deer this year) I also will use one of the two dogs to guard my livestock once I get them all in place. Depending on how many sheep, pigs and goats I get will depend on how many I keep from subsequent litters.

The two dogs I have the opportunity of getting are not related and it sounds like the breeder wants me to co-own. She said that I would never have to pay for another dog again if I needed to expand my guardian flock as my 4 legged stock grows.

I have decided on GP's for what I need now and in the future. I don't need a bunch of different breeds around. My concern now is for the quality of life I can give these wonderful dogs. I want to be sure they get enjoyment out of exercise and the work I want them to do. I am going to start looking into the types of collars and leashes I need so I can walk these dogs on our rail trails beside the house.

I think I will give the breeder a call tomorrow and ask some of my other questions. She is a widow and 63 years old. I think she would enjoy having someone co own with her. I know I will enjoy learning about the breed, the desirable traits and maybe welp a pup she can take to show. I can tell she wants to get back in the ring so bad but she has some health problems. It sounds like these dogs can be used for my needs on the farm and to also give her some additional quality of life in the future. I see a win/win. I just need to make sure I have adequate fencing. That is my only obstacle, the time to get the fencing up and that is a big one right now.

Oh and yes the 2.5 yr old female has experience with flock guardian. The breeder told me the female will even serve to help train the 6 month old male puppy. That is priceless, I know I will need to do training too and the breeder has offered to help with that as well. I know she must be really lonely and in need of someone like me to work with.

 

[Yonaton]

You better make your fence strong, high and down in the ground a little ways. Great Pyrenees' like to run! The grass is *ALWAYS* greener outside the fence, at least for a day! Yes, they'll guard what they originally see there, but new things they might not do too well with. They aren't the brightest of dogs either. You have to remember that they were on the brink of extinction not too very long ago (IIRR around WWI or II?) so a lot of inbreeding and line breeding was done to bring them back to the large numbers thay are today...that's an awful lot of in and line breeding. Every one I've ever seen had some kind of incorrect bite from minor, to major (ours was major and he had a heck of a time getting dry food out of a bowl or food off a plate). Ours was so stupid he couldn't even be taught to sit...and I can teach dogs to obey hand signals in obedience and other skills. They bark...a LOT, and not always at anything in particular. They *will* have a path worn down on the fence inner perimiter in no time as all they do is run all day and night (barking at the littlest noise!) and sleep a little while and eat some and then off looking for a way out of the fence again (they're also keeping an eye on anything trying to get in the yard, of course). Got a family of wild rabbits suddenly make a burrow on your land? They'll be dead if they can catch them, those and baby birds that fall out of nests. Did I mention that they're really, really dumb? Can't always be trusted with other dogs either. One day, literally out of nowhere, ours attacked my other dog. Just one second he's all happy and getting petted by some friends who were visiting (and had been there a good 10 minutes already) and in the blink of an eye it's attacking my other dog, who is not a fighter and is way too friendly for his own good sometimes. They'd been around each other for 3 years! I was literally kicking the GP in the ribs and anywhere else I could with my steel-toed boots to get it off my other dog and finally ended up punching it in the ribs and that stopped him (I'm disabled with two crushed discs and torn muscles and tendons in my back which never healed correctly and in pain 24/7...I hurt badly after getting this dog off the other one. I *wanted* to shoot it, but mom talked me out of it somehow).

That's a little history of the breed and *my* experiences with them. Take it as you will, but IMO the breed should have been left alone to die off as it was far too gone to have done what people did to it and have what it is now, and all more than likely for their vanity of being able to say 'Look at my big, huge white dog.'