I want to feed them Organic & Non GMO -- but the price is just too high!

[10xmama]

Is it possible to feed Organic & Non GMO at a reasonable cost? The cheapest I have found is $36.50 per 50lb bag of Countryside Organics. The farm that sells it is an hour away from me. So figure the time and gas into it .... and that they only recommend you buy 3 months at a time ... It just seems out-of-the-ballpark!

I have looked into making my own but there again -- the price of bulk grains is just as expensive. I have read so many people pleased with Azure Standard but as far as I can tell on their website they do not have a route here in FL?

I am a bit discouraged with this quest and am thinking I may have to concede to some conventional feed?

What do you feel the best most affordable option is?

 

[chicbaby]

why is organic so much more expensive? lets put the responsibility where it should be. politicians and the farm bills that subsidize junk gmo food crops from giant agro conglomerates. organic farmers are not subsidized. subsidizing these conglomerates should not be allowed. people need to demand that this stop so we can afford organic and healthy foods. we do not need corporate welfare.it doesnt benefit the people. it is unconstitutional, and therefore illegal and unlawful. if you take the time to read where all this money is going it will blow your mind. our republic depends on the people to keep it viable. its our responsibility as American citizens to make sure our public servants are not perjuring their oaths and helping themselves illegally but doing what they were elected to do. uphold their oath to the constitution for the people's well being.

subsidies create an unfair monopoly and deny people their right to choose and the ability to choose what they really would like to have by making it cost prohibitive to many people.

we need a level playing field. without subsidies the gmo crops could not survive. yields are higher for organic and there are many studies out there to show this. this is why they need welfare to continue to profit at others' expense. if gmo crops are so great, why do they need subsidies? its a lie, they are not great. they do not help anyone, they will never feed the world efficiently or cheaply. in fact, many countries refuse our gmo crops and have banned them. even china has labels for gmos on their products on their shelves.

we must vote with our dollars and support as best we can organic farmers and humane to animals, fair trade farms. we must elect public servants, not based on their party, color or gender, but on whether or not they are upholding their oath to the constitution. that is all we need to get our country back to the great republic it was founded to be.


okay crazy talk this will be my last posting to you and i want to firstly apologize to everyone for his creating discord and discouraging discussion and advocating censorship because he doesn't agree with other posters. obviously a forum is meant for discussion and it shouldn't be used to call others liars especially when they have no facts. i wasn't going to reply at all but i will not allow myself to be called a liar and allow someone to deliberately sabotage an important topic. what i am going to say is relevant to the organic vs non organic debate.

i believe a forum is meant for meaningful conversation and a place to share our thoughts experiences and facts that may otherwise be unknown to some. some people when faced with things that are profound and outside of their current level of understanding respond with fear and feel they must attack someone because they dont know what else to do. the intention is to contribute in a positive manner and to encourage discussion. its too bad there is not more of that out there and there are some who like it that way, because things cant change if we cant talk about them. there are those who benefit from the status quo and are threatened by change and anything different. its inconvenient to know things, because then you have to do something about them. so many people choose to remain ignorant and shout down anything that disrupts their "comfort zone"

everything i said in my previous post was based in fact by scientists and studies and also my experience. i find it hard to believe someone would advocate such a pathological way of thinking and insist disease is inevitable. it is not. we have an immune system to keep us healthy and feeling good and because nature is master and we can not begin to comprehend this beautiful harmonious brilliant plan she has. its exciting that scientists are re discovering what many metaphysicians philosophers and scientists knew before the written word. they are finally beginning to find out how important our mitochondria and our digestions and our delicate balance of systems within ourselves and the soil itself, is vital to our health and well being. our immune system is always working and we may not even be aware of it every moment until we are overloaded with toxins and our immune system can not do its job and then dis ease moves in.


what is dangerous about advocating eating healthy whole foods and eschewing chemicals and processes and being kind and thoughtful to others and ourselves? you are what you eat. your choices absolutely have everything to do with your quality of life. 1 in 5 children under the age of 6 are now obese. dont tell me this has nothing to do with food and lifestyle choices. we have dabbled in chemicals and unnatural processes for a very short amount of time and you can see from the change in quality of life, the correlation of increase in disease, both chronic and acute.

what does this have to do with the cost of eating organic or the real cost of not eating organic? everything. we may not realize that our choices do not only affect us, but especially living in America, our choices effect the whole world. its a blessing and also a huge responsibility and one that the large corps deliberately use to create division among the people so they can continue destroying the world indiscriminately and without consciousness and reap more profits. its a distraction and it works. we are not each others enemies. everyone is doing the best they can and i am sure most everyone wishes things were different. i believe in the power and the beauty of the human spirit and that given the information to make good choices, they will be made. the people are not being given true information.

this is why its so vital for everyone to take up the responsibility of educating yourself because no one will do it for you. the status quo wants you to be ignorant and fearful. for then you can be controlled and manipulated. the proper use of knowledge is power. i am exercising that power and taking the responsibility for my own life and choosing to contribute to the world in a kind responsible way.

crazy talk you have no facts to base your derision on or you would give them. i already recommended the mercola website for all of this ground breaking information and research which will benefit everyone. plus the importance of choosing organic, and not disrupting our delicate systems. the dangers of these chemicals and the deliberate suppression of this information is in the news. its not made up. more and more people are coming out and sharing what they were forbidden to share before. i bless them for their courage. an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. i live my life by that principle of ben franklin's.

quality of life is everything. ask anyone who may have a million dollars in the bank but yet they are not healthy and may have a debilitating disease? what would they rather have? a grand quality of life. choosing organic is about quality of life. you can not put a price on the freedom of well being. as i said before, this is our birthright. you can not be free if you are not healthy. our constitution was written by people who understood this. freedom is everything and with freedom comes responsibility. our constitution was written and our government formed for one purpose only ; to safeguard and protect our unalienable god given rights that we were born with. it was written to prohibit the taking away of our rights. if you read the Constitution its very clear about protecting the water and the air and all of these chemicals are in direct violation of our constitutions, both state and federal.

we have a whole generation of people who are abusing their bodies and eating fast foods every day and then expect someone to fix them by giving them pills. they do not want to be responsible or care for themselves. even 20 years ago this was unheard of and it was common sense that eating well, getting plenty of rest, and choosing.laughter is a recipe for a happy healthy life.

we are lucky that we can choose and that we can speak and share our points of view. we should do this with an open mind. since this forum asks for people's opinions, i am glad i can take the time occasionally out of my very busy and happy life to give mine.

 

[chicbaby]

my thinking is i cant afford not to buy organic. the costs for poisonous gmo products is obvious when you look at the destruction of the land, health problems, birth defects, cancer, autoimmune disorders.. the list goes on. glyphosate is an insidious poison and actually interferes with the soil microorganisms so the plants can not take up the minerals they need and it destroys all of these nutrients and microorganisms that are so vital to our health. the bees and butterflies are almost gone. do you know einstein said we couldnt last more than 2 years as a species without the bees?

we are not being told the truth about these poisons, and now they just approved agent orange to be sprayed along with the glyphosate on crops. every year, they have to spray more and more because the bugs and weeds are resistant. only a human is stupid enough to keep doing the same thing over and over when what they are doing is not working.

glyphosate was actually originally patented as a fungicide and you can read more about all of these studies coming out on mercola . com they also did some research linking all of the problem people are having with wheat to the glyphosate, i know if i eat conventional wheat i have digestive problems which i dont have when i eat organic, so we very rarely eat gmo wheat.

its also been shown that our gut microflora, which are vital for us to get anything of value out of our food, is destroyed by eating gmo products. this is why so many people are obese and cant stop eating, they arent getting any nutrition out of the food. we buy as much organic as possible and dont shop at the regular grocery store or buy conglomerate foods.

we pay 30 dollars for 40 pound bags of ranch way organic which is based in colorado. there are also buying clubs which you can get discounts for buying in bulk on line. you could order bulk organic grains seperately and then mix them. you could also ferment your feed, which we do, which makes it last alot longer and its healthier for them too. they also get other things like seasonal veggies, i mix lentils, split peas, wheat berries and oats in as well as boss. you can try health food stores which give discounts on bulk such as natural grocers also. giving your chickens a variety of food is more natural for them and they will be happier and healthier and it can also help you save money. you can even go to restaurants or health food stores and ask for kitchen scraps for chickens. many times they will give them to you.

fermenting is easy and ours only has a small bread smell to it if you stick your head in the bucket. the flies stay away from our chickens even though we have them around our other animals. we are actually going to start fermenting feed for our goats as well and give them a small amount along with their hay and grazing.

our health insurance is eating well and enjoying our positive contribution to the world. i would rather spend a little extra money on food then pay out the nose for crappy western medicine which doesnt even help anyway. plus our quality of life is better. we are not kept functionally ill from chronic issues and feel good.
we are at a crossroads as a species and will eliminate ourselves if we dont change what we are doing. its up to us as people who already want to take a step in the right direction to demand with our dollars a healthy happy life and support farmers who are growing organic grains.

i talked to the people at beeler who raise heritage pigs and they do their best to get non gmo grains and notice a difference in the health of their animals when they cant get them. the more of us who demand better food, the more farmers will start growing the way they used to. their yields are down for the gmo crops compared to organic and they are losing alot of money to monsanto. we need to encourage them to do the right thing and ask for non gmo. more and more farmers are growing non gmo for these very reasons. the prices will go down the more people start growing. this is already happening, if you look at the stats on how much is being spent on and how many people want non gmo. we can create this change with our dollars, for that is the only thing these companies care about. this is why it is vital to support non gmo and organic. our very lives depend on it.

disease is not normal or natural. we have been conditioned to think it is. disease only comes about from imbalance and poisons. its natural to be healthy and to feel good. we have to stop buying these lies. do we deserve to be poisoned and lied to just for some profits? i dont think so.

how important is quality of life to someone? its everything and we have to remember we can have that. we are what we eat. if you are not as healthy as you would like to be, change what you are eating and drinking. i didnt even mention the ground water being poisoned as well. how long can anyone go without water? a day? i choose to live in a beautiful world with bees and butterflies and food that is nutritious and good for you.

buying organic is not just a personal choice, its a choice that affects everyone all over the world. if you look at whats happening in south america and all the birth defects and illness around any giant gmo producer, it will make you think twice and make more of an effort to be able to afford organic. we can create the lives we want and we can decide, we just have to let go of the resistance and judgment which keeps us from having things we may feel are unattainable. anything is possible if you believe it is. life is a self fulfilling prophecy.

these are my feelings and i am glad you brought this up to be talked about. its not right we as individuals should be forced to make these decisions, when it can be difficult, but such is life and we can rise to the challenge and turn it all around. humans have just as much potential for beauty and happiness as they do in creating destruction. its just a choice.

 

[3riverschick]

Is it possible to feed Organic & Non GMO at a reasonable cost? The cheapest I have found is $36.50 per 50lb bag of Countryside Organics. The farm that sells it is an hour away from me. So figure the time and gas into it .... and that they only recommend you buy 3 months at a time ... It just seems out-of-the-ballpark!

I have looked into making my own but there again -- the price of bulk grains is just as expensive. I have read so many people pleased with Azure Standard but as far as I can tell on their website they do not have a route here in FL?

I am a bit discouraged with this quest and am thinking I may have to concede to some conventional feed?

What do you feel the best most affordable option is?

Hi!

,
Well, My heritage Light Sussex do real well on Agway Meatbird, made by Cargill/Naturewise. The "sister product" to it is Naturewise Meatbird crumbles. They are both 22% protein. After doing a lot of looking and listening, I am convinced the protein % is what matters most in these heritage birds. Was told so by an experienced breeder and it has been so for my birds. They subsisted on 16%. Did a lot better on 17% but they just weren't thriving. 18% protein brought a nicer finish. But when I put them on Meatbird 22%, wow! It was like I had a whole new flock of birds! They gained weight, feathers shined more. They were more content. I am a convert. Some of these heritage breeds like Sussex were originally meat breeds. Then they were tweaked to increase egg laying for the home flock enthusiasts. But basically, the Sussex is still a Meatbird and feeding them that Meatbird ration has been the real ticket to thriving birds. Just because we use a lot of breeds for egg layers doesn't mean the layer feed is historically the best feed for that breed. Maybe yes, maybe no. In Sussex, I am finding out it is "no".
That said, even if you free range your birds, who says they will have an organic diet? Chickens eat all kinds of weird things. They even pick seeds out of livestock manure and who knows what feed and drugs those livestock have been given?
I think the best I can so for my birds is feed them the right % of protein for their breed. Plus, I start them out the 1st month of life with Poultry Nutri-Drench or Goat Nutri-Drench in their water to get them off to a strong start. ( I always use the poultry usage and dosage instructions). Then I supplement their feed with Black Oil Sunflower Seeds (BOSS) for shiny feathers. Sprouted oats 4-7 days old fed as green feed( a supplement to their daily ration) is great for bringing the hens into lay and helping the males create more robust sperm, helping to result in more robust chicks. Finally, I use the three sizes of Gran-I-Grit granite poultry grit , try to feed the correct size at the correct age( see BYC Gran-I-Grit review). This can result in their gizzard growing large and healthier which can result in up to 20% more eggs and broilers putting on more poundage during finishing time.
Best,
Karen

 

[Michael Apple]

The real question is.How do people expect 2 million farmers to feed 318,935,000 people and provide them with the cheapest product?

When seeking a product, I don't look at what is cheapest, I look at the quality based upon the price. That is why I'd never eat Foster Farms, Tyson, Butterball, etc..

"American" companies growing birds and having them processed in China is not only based upon greed, it is dismissive of public health. The same goes for Chinese sourced ingredients being used in livestock feeds. Some years ago, it was revealed that Chinese soy was ending up in conventional feed rations by a certain milling company. I wondered who did oversight to ensure none of this soy was ending up in organic rations they produced.They were boycotted and will never get business from me ever again. This is the consequence of international trade. Trade based upon nationalist principles would be the best way to combat this problem. Unfortunately the majority citizenry is complacent and docile, too busy playing with their Iphones, jostling for place amongst the status quo, and believing what politicians and the government controlled media tell them.

 

[Michael Apple]

But most people don't,they want the cheapest.Most people don't understand the difference of chicken breasts at $1.99/LB VS. $6.99/LB.

I really don't care what most people want so long as I have the option to get what I want. I know what I want. This is why meat raised on organic grains, grass fed instead of lot fed, keeping a high standard of practice is so successful and a better quality, better tasting product. It commands a higher price, and when people can afford it, will choose that over the other. At least those who care about their health do. The demand is increasing. That is good news in my opinion.

 

[Michael Apple]

You've implied, and now directly stated that GMO foods are less healthy, and conventional agriculture is less healthy than organic.

Edited by staff

Yeah. Most people with any sense find it less healthy to ingest food containing pesticides and herbicides.

 

[Michael Apple]

What does that have to do with this? Organic uses both insecticides and herbicides.


Here's the USDA organic allowed pesticide list:
http://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-id...rgn=div6&view=text&node=7:3.1.1.9.32.7&idno=7

I'm just posting the link because the list is dozens of pages long.


This conversation would be a lot more pleasant if you'd cease insulting everyone who disagrees with you.

Thank God we have private organizations with certifications of a much higher standard Like Oregon Tilth, rather than reliance upon the corrupt USDA. I'll stick to independent research free of government entanglements.

 

[Bethel3330]

You can tryhttp://hilandnaturals.com/locations.html @10xmama they have some dealers in Florida. My chickens love this brand! They offer non-gmo, organic and soy-free I believe.

 

[CrazyTalk]

SpeckledHen, there was no name calling. The word ignorant means "without knowledge". The post I was referencing shows clear ignorance on the subject of immunology, evolution, medicine, health, and biology in general. Pushing he idea that disease is unnatural and man-made is either ignorance, or intentional, willful deceit. (and it kills people)