mixing flock raiser and a layer feed with roosters

[junior67]

so I have 2 roosters, and younger chicks as well. I give them flock raiser. One bucket has pellets and one crumble....... I was thinking of mixing in poulin layer feed (either the premium which is 16.5 protein or egg production plus which is 18% but this is a crumblet........) with the feed I use now. 1 because it is a big cheaper so will spend a tad less doing a 50lb bag of each then doing 100lbs of flock raiser. Plus I have heard good things about Poulin. I don't want to only do layer because of my roosters so dont' want them getting too much calcium. Would mixing it be ok for the roosters?

I do give oyster shells on the side.

 

[Folly's place]

I just do Flock raiser here, with separate oyster shell. Does Poulin have an all flock feed, and does the price compare? Chicken feed has certainly gone up in price!
Mary

 

[junior67]

I just do Flock raiser here, with separate oyster shell. Does Poulin have an all flock feed, and does the price compare? Chicken feed has certainly gone up in price!
Mary

Not sure if Poulin does or not. My local feed store only sells Purina flock raiser though... Well for an all flock type of feed

 

[Happy hen lover]

so I have 2 roosters, and younger chicks as well. I give them flock raiser. One bucket has pellets and one crumble....... I was thinking of mixing in poulin layer feed (either the premium which is 16.5 protein or egg production plus which is 18% but this is a crumblet........) with the feed I use now. 1 because it is a big cheaper so will spend a tad less doing a 50lb bag of each then doing 100lbs of flock raiser. Plus I have heard good things about Poulin. I don't want to only do layer because of my roosters so dont' want them getting too much calcium. Would mixing it be ok for the roosters?

I do give oyster shells on the side.

I do one feeder "all flock" and another one layer feed. The roosters probably prefer all flock so should leave the layer feed alone. I also add oyster shell on ground daily to my layers. Pullets don't go near it as they are not laying yet.

 

[Brooks_]

Would mixing it be ok for the roosters?

Mixing them would slow the damage done by excess calcium. Mixing two or three parts all flock/flock raiser with one part layer could bring the calcium down to reasonable levels and still save a few bucks.

 

[Apis mellifera]

Mixing them would slow the damage done by excess calcium.

What damage?

 

[Brooks_]

What damage?

To the kidneys. Birds that are not actively laying have a hard time excreting excess calcium. The damage is cumulative -how much/how long. But is more harmful to chicks.

 

[MysteryChicken]

I do All Flock, & Flock Raiser with Oyster shells on the side.

 

[Apis mellifera]

To the kidneys. Birds that are not actively laying have a hard time excreting excess calcium. The damage is cumulative -how much/how long. But is more harmful to chicks.

It's so often repeated that laying feed will sicken birds. I've never seen it in over 20 years. Have you had sick or dead hens or roosters from laying feed? Maybe it should take off the market if it's so damaging over time.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

It's so often repeated that laying feed will sicken birds. I've never seen it in over 20 years. Have you had sick or dead hens or roosters from laying feed? Maybe it should take off the market if it's so damaging over time.

Diesel does damage to a gasoline engine, too, but that doesn't mean it should be taken off the market.

The subject is well studied, and widely accepted in the poultry science community. I've linked many of the studies here on BYC, but short lunch, no time to do so again now.

here's some anecdotes
Merck Vet
From 1979
1981

hopefully that's enough to get you started on your own research

As you've noted, many don't recognize the signs. Initially, as a progressive pathology, they are clinically evident only internally. As it progresses, many of the external signs, such as gout, are erroneously attributed to the aging process. In particularly egregious cases, sudden mortality has been traced to it (as result of miss mix from the mill), and there are some studies finding evidence of bone deformity, particularly in the feet, from long periods of excess calcium intake.

Additionally, not all calcium is the same. Dicalcium phosphate (used much more frequently in the Mediterranean basin than here in the US) as primary source of calcium in feed seems to buffer the effects somewhat - its the extra phosphorus. That's studied, too, but I'd have to search for the link, and I've already devoted more time to this than I should have. Calcium Diphosphate is also used, with similar buffering effect. Oyster shell, popular here in the US, is calcium carbonate of course. Calcium Citrate (i.e, Citrical) is good for us humans, and sometimes offered to chickens needing a fast fix for medicinal reasons, but spikes their blood calcium due to how rapidly they digest it - not recommended for daily use.

@junior67 I do what you suggest, albeit with a different feed brand. I do NOT recommend it. Its educated risk taking on my part. I mitigate that risk, in part, by raising my birds to about 12 weeks on a standard (1%+/-) calcium feed while they are developing (and most susceptible to nutrition - related damage) and by culling my males early. Few make it more than a single season. Most don't get a season at all. Very little time for the excess calcium (my mix averages about 2.8% +/-) to start doing damage.

If you are seriously considering this method, I would suggest you do your own research, weigh the risks you are willing to take in view of your own goals and management style, decide for yourself if the minor cost savings is worth the trouble and the risk, rather than crowdsourcing this answer.