Mottled/Spangled Orpingtons

[jeremy]

There seems to be some newfound interest in this relatively rare color of Orpington (in the United States), I figured I would start this thread in hopes of creating a place where breeders could come together and discuss the genetics behind this variety and their projects, share pictures of their birds, etc.

I currently have a flock of pure Imported English Blue, Black and Splash Orpingtons. I plan on adding the Mottled variety sometime next year (hopefully) and I personally will be breeding towards the British SOP, eventually working with Black and Blue Mottled Orps. I also was considering a Chocolate Mottled project as well.

Let's discuss!

 

[jeremy]

"Mottled" refers to the mottling gene (mo/mo), responsible for the absence of color (white) at the tip of each feather.

"Spangled" is a hobby name given to mottled birds by English breeders.

There is no genetic difference between a "Mottled" and a "Spangled" Orpington, just phenotype. The mottling gene expresses itself in many different ways, with some birds having copious amounts of white mottling, while others have mere specks of white in a nearly all black plumage.

Technically, it is more correct to refer to them as Mottled Orpingtons, as that is what they are genetically.

It would also help to avoid confusion with other birds that are hobby named "Spangled", but have a different phenotype- i.e. Spangled Russian Orloffs, and Spangled OEGB. (These birds are genetically Mille Fleur, with various other genes expressing themselves as well, specifically the mahogany gene (Mh/Mh) that deepens the feather color from gold to deep red.)

 

[125Silkies]

Thanks for posting the wonderful information about what should and should NEVER have been bred into the original imported Mottle/Spangle line...that equates to is that a lot of money has been invested by a lot of people and they did not get what they paid for.

 

[jeremy]

Quote:
The variety is almost nonexistent in the US, there are a few breeders working on Mottled projects though.

Mottled Orps are called Spangled in the UK and there is a small, dedicated following to the birds there.

This is a great website for Spangled and Jubilee Orpingtons, http://www.jubileeorpingtons.co.uk/

 

[matte]

I am on a few waiting lists for mottled orps and I hope to get them this year! I am super excited and ready to get them! I also have a few partridge orps on the way as well! I love the mottled and spangled gene! I have a few O Shamo that carry the mottled gene as well! Love the colors. I only know of 2 breeders in the US that have Mottled Orps. Does anyone else have any? Have a good night.

Nate.

Hi Nate,

I have mottled Orps in Lavender. We hatched ourself ragged in establishing our current flock of Lavender Mottled Orpingtons. I just took some pictures yesterday that show how great mottling can look on Lavender.
I've heard of a few people having a mottled pop-up in their Lavenders, but have not heard of anyone that has developed them into a breeding flock (in the US). We plan to start hatching from our 10 pullets and 3 roos in the coming weeks.

 

[rockinpaints]

Here are some pictures of the a couple of the jubilees that came from my mottled pair and one that is just odd. The darker ones are kind of cool looking so far all the jubs are roosters. They also have yellow legs.

I usually do not stick my neck out about genetic issues and other peoples business, however, I have read this over and over and just wanted to clarify as there seems to be some confusion.

The chicks that are being hatched from the mottled orps that have red bleed through (or straw colored feathers) are not Jubilees. They are Mottled Orps with red bleed through from the Jubilee gene being introduced. To better the Jubilees they can be crossed once to a Mottled Orp every 3-5 years. Then heavy culling would be a necessity to make sure to preserve the Jubilee color pattern and not dilute it to much to black, as the Jubilee is mahogany not black base color. (no black chicks should be used back in the Jubilee pen from this crossing) .

If the Mottled Oprs to the Jubilee cross (to better the Jubilee or for gene diversity) is anticipated, it would be best to find out if it has already been done in the past 5 years, if it has, it should not be done again for that time period.
The Jubilee should not be bred into you Mottled Orp flock - Yes there is a difference in crossing a Mottled to a Jubilee and crossing a Jubilee into your Mottled Orp lines , this is where the confusion lies. There seems to be much controversy on this cross.

With the new varieties comes a lot of genetic questions. Just because one crosses a bird with another, and the offspring "appears to look like" one of the parent birds does not mean it is genetically the same, nor does it mean it will breed true, and a lot of crosses will reek havoc on future generations, maybe ruining the original line altogether. To preserve the original varieties that it has taken much time to finally get here, good records are a must and culling is a necessary evil.

Please don't confuse what I have written with "project birds". I love projects just as much as anyone one else, they are fun and rewarding to get to the finished product. I am referring only to preserving the pure bred varieties. If you have questions or need clarification on what I written please PM me and I will do my best to explain it. This is not my opinion it is the genetic facts from much research and breeders who have raised these two particular breeds for many years.
I am in no way signaling out or pointing my finger at anyone (I hope no one interprets it that way), I am just passing along some much needed information to work with.

 

[Orpy Lady]

Yes to improve the lavender gene and type, we in England breed it to black then the cock birds that hatch are what we call split for lavenders, (they carry the lavender gene) rather than breed the siblings together, we go back to the parents to enhance the colour and type, hope that helps. Sandy

 

[chicken addict]

Can someone tell me what birds are crossed to get the mottled orpingtons? I love the look of them and want to try/start a project of breeding them but have not been able to find anything at all that says what crosses make that color. Any and all help and information is greatly appreciated. Also on the mottled lavenders.

 

[nicalandia]

Can someone tell me what birds are crossed to get the mottled orpingtons? I love the look of them and want to try/start a project of breeding them but have not been able to find anything at all that says what crosses make that color. Any and all help and information is greatly appreciated. Also on the mottled lavenders.

Mottling(mo) is a recessive autosomal gene(recessive means it needs two copies of the gene to be expressed, autosomal means its not a sex linked gene) the fastest way for you to get mottled orps is obtaining Mottled Orps, the hardest way is to introduce the mottling gene from a another mottled breed that has similar sized... for example mottled javas..

say you get your hand on a mottled java, you will need to cross it to a black orp or bue orp or lavender Orp if you want lavender mottled Orps... you do the crossing, all of the first chicks will look all Black because mottling is recessive, you select 2 of the best roos and 2 of the best looking hens(when I say best is the ones that look more like orps than javas) out of this crossing you will be able to get some mottled birds and some that are not mottled, cull the ones that are not mottled, at this stage you will have mottled birds that are closer in looks and type to Orps than the first generation cross...

 

[jeremy]

Quote:
Your bird actually is not Mottled all, she is simply a mix of two colors. Crossing a Blue Orp with a Buff Orp will not produce Mottled offspring. You need the actual gene responsible for Mottling to be present in your birds. She is simply a mixed color that somewhat mimicks a spotted appearance. Though to me it appears to look more like faint barring than mottling.