Mycoplasma Gallisepticum / CRD / Respiratory (gurgling/rales when breathing; no other symptoms)

[ronott1]

Here in CA, there is a free testing service for Back Yard Flocks via Necropsy. It's called California Animal Health and Safety. The will euthanize them for you, so if they are suffering and not likely to make it, you can drop them off and in three days get a very complete report.

You might want to see if there is a service like this in your state. For Commercial flocks, they charge $60.00 per chicken.

I hope your chickens get better soon.

Ron

Quote:

 

[CowgirlJules]

Yes, this is a great service. I suspect in other states with both vet schools and big commercial poultry operations, they'll probably have something similar. It's good for the economy of the state to help backyard owners diagnose diseases like this, otherwise we can end up as an enormous reservoir of the diseases for wild vectors to bring to the commercial flocks, devastating those businesses.

Ron gave me the UC Davis contact information, and I ended up having a completely different disease than I'd thought, but one just as nasty. I've chosen to cull. Good luck with yours.

 

[ronott1]

Yes Jules, I am so sorry yours worked out like this for you, but at the same time it is a great bonus to know what you are dealing with. Commercial flocks are supposed to send in a couple of chickens periodically for Necropsy to make sure all is well with the flock, so this service should be available in all places with commercial egg laying operations. Compared to expensive and iffy vet care, even a $60.00 fee would be worth it. Free for the one at UC Davis is amazing.

My experience was positive. I sent one in last Fall and it turned out she died of liver rupture "indeterminate cause but common in certain breeds". All else was clear (negative for Mareks, Salmonella and etc.). Before the report I kept expecting sudden death of all my chickens. I am still concerned with keeping them healthy. Since I have a breed (Black Australorp) that is prone to fatty liver disease and rupture, I make sure to not give them too much simple carbs, like spaghetti and etc. I also feed them a non corn non soy organic feed with fish meal in it. They stay lean and happy that way.

Best of luck all!

Yes, this is a great service. I suspect in other states with both vet schools and big commercial poultry operations, they'll probably have something similar. It's good for the economy of the state to help backyard owners diagnose diseases like this, otherwise we can end up as an enormous reservoir of the diseases for wild vectors to bring to the commercial flocks, devastating those businesses.

Ron gave me the UC Davis contact information, and I ended up having a completely different disease than I'd thought, but one just as nasty. I've chosen to cull. Good luck with yours.

Edited to correct spelling. Ron

 

[RedDrgn]

Here in CA, there is a free testing service for Back Yard Flocks via Necropsy. It's called California Animal Health and Safety. The will euthanize them for you, so if they are suffering and not likely to make it, you can drop them off and in three days get a very complete report.

You might want to see if there is a service like this in your state. For Commercial flocks, they charge $60.00 per chicken.

I hope your chickens get better soon.

Ron

I started looking for something like that as soon as I read your reply, and haven't found anything like it anywhere near my area yet. I will keep looking, though because a service like that could certainly prove invaluable! Thanks for the tip!

So far, we've only had one bird with any issue and as of yesterday, she was no longer showing any symptoms. Still waiting for bloodwork results, though.

Yes, this is a great service. I suspect in other states with both vet schools and big commercial poultry operations, they'll probably have something similar. It's good for the economy of the state to help backyard owners diagnose diseases like this, otherwise we can end up as an enormous reservoir of the diseases for wild vectors to bring to the commercial flocks, devastating those businesses.
Ron gave me the UC Davis contact information, and I ended up having a completely different disease than I'd thought, but one just as nasty. I've chosen to cull. Good luck with yours.

Unfortunately, it seems as though an enormous reservoir for MG already exists.

I also found some rather disturbing information during my reading and research on this issue this morning. Through our local ag department website, APHIS, and a few other poultry sites I discovered a pattern I didn't much care for and which was summarized pretty well in this BYC thread:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/600566/mg-certified-hatcheries-breeders

We got our five hens all at the same time from Meyer Hatchery. The roo that we added later, we got from a fellow BYC'er who got their whole flock (also at the same time) from My Pet Chicken. I contacted them and asked about whether they'd seen any signs of illness/disease in their flock (they haven't), and then told them about what's been going on with our chicken and that there was the potential that it came from the roo we got from them. So we talked about it (and the potential ramifications) and here's what I found out: We're both currently raising our first flocks. Our birds are kept outdoors, both in runs and free range and other than taking in their extra roo, our flocks consist of birds that never leave our properties or interact with avians other than wild birds. I have absolutely no reason to believe that they are lying to me.

So what this seems to boil down to (and please tell me if I am wrong) is if our chicken comes back positive for MG, then either one or more of our birds or one or more of the roo's original flock's birds got it from one of those two hatcheries or the wild bird population. I guess that narrows it down....sort of, not really.

 

[CowgirlJules]

I would think if a hatchery's birds came back positive for any of these diseases, it would be greatly to their economic advantage to cover it up. I'm not saying that they do, but it would be tempting. Otherwise, they would likely go bankrupt while dealing with it. At least the commercial chicken operations do "all-in, all-out," so one round of disease would hurt them badly, but wouldn't affect their parent stock, as they get those from elsewhere. But for a hatchery to have to spend a whole year raising new parent stock without selling any chicks, I'd expect that to break them unless they have amazing financial reserves. So I'm not really surprised if none of them are certified MG-free.

 

[MadHens]

You're very welcome, and I just updated with yesterday's vet visit. I just hope that we can get to the bottom of this thing and that whatever we find out will be of use down the road. Like you, we had gotten a strong impression that chickens were easy to keep and very hardy creatures (almost giving the impression of invulnerability, honestly....stupid, I know, but there it is). While they are hardy, they're not invulnerable and to some things, they are very vulnerable. It's just figuring out along the way just what their weaknesses are and defending against them.

Holy crap! $100?!? That is just insane and I don't blame you for forgoing it at this point. Persephone whole trip, including the office visit and the testing, ended up being $35. We weren't charged for any of our phone calls with Dr. Gast and he's been willing to talk and answer questions (and was pleased that we had so many to ask and had been taking the initiative to do some legwork and trying to solve the problem) every time. Is there anywhere else you could try (you never know if you may need someone down the road)?

I hope your chicks continue to do well and do recoup. As with most animals, it's always a good sign if they're still eating and drinking. If I were you, I'd contact wherever you're getting your next batch of chicks from and talk to them about vaccinations and make sure you're covered on that front, if at all possible. I know there has been suspicion and general blow off about some vaccinations, but while they aren't 100% effective, many are very very good. Back to our feline leukemia carrier cat...he's indoors with three leukemia negative cats. Those three get tested (to see if they've picked up the disease) and then vaccinated annually - none of them have contracted the disease in the past 5 years they've all been together and the vaccine is listed as 85% effective.

Yes, please keep us posted on your chickens as well! I know I'd like to hear how they fare.

RedDrgn, I'm assuming you didn't get the test results back yet (and it figures it's a holiday weekend). Yeah, so much for chickens being easy to keep! What makes it more difficult, I think, is that this is my first time raising chicks so I have nothing to compare normal health and development to. I swear some of my chicks look smaller than what they should be (maybe due to the feed having that funky stuff in it?) The chick (a cochin) that had the sneeze for a week has cleared up - no idea if it's due to the second antibiotic or if it was just going to happen anyway. I think the sneezing is totally gone from everyone; I had a third chick that had the sneeze for a few days, but I'm not noticing it anymore.

You like that $100 fee for a consult, huh? My husband would have a stroke if I ever spent that much money on a chicken! Now, if I had a large flock that I had invested a lot of time and money into, it might be worth it, but for my purposes, it's definitely not worth it. My husband is still trying to psychologically recover from the $2000 we've spent on our dog in the last 8 months due to a tick-borne illness and god-knows-what-else is wrong with her! I haven't made any phone calls yet to our local university, but someone who works at TSC gave me the name of someone there who they deal with when they have questions so it's worth a shot.

As for vaccines, the only vaccine they have gotten is for Mareks (got my first batch of chicks from My Pet Chicken). The 3 chicks that I got from the feed store were not vaccinated for Mareks because whoever breeds them (a local breeder, not a hatchery) does not vaccinate them. The chicks that I'm getting next month are also from MPC, and they will also be vaccinated for Mareks (except for the 2 bantams that are in that order; I guess they don't do that vaccine on bantams). You know, that has gotten me to wonder if all of the chickens are not vaccinated for Mareks, is it pointless to vaccinate some of them? Something else to ponder...

I'm also learning quickly that you can ask the same question to 3 different people, and get 3 different answers! No wonder we're going crazy trying to find the "right" answers. The guy that owns the feed store where I bought the 3 chicks (where I think the disease may have originated) tried to tell me that "chickens can get colds like humans"! Ummm, no, I don't think so, buddy. He also told me that when he gets new chickens he automatically adds antibiotics to their water just to "start them off" (whether they're sick or not). WTH?!! I don't think I'll be taking any advice from him. I'm definitely going to have a pair of dedicated coop shoes once my chicks are outside, and I will take all other biosecurity measures if I visit any feed store or someone else's coop.

BTW, I love the pic of Persephone at the vet on the scale! What is her breed, and how did you get her to stay still?

 

[Suzierd]

Madhens since you are still getting your new chicks I am very curious on how you will keep them from getting sick? If you plan on vaccinating them wouldn't you need to know what your dealing with for sure? Or just keeping them separate I would think would be pretty tuff. These RD are a epidemic someone needs to come up with a cure! If most all back yard chickens already have it or will be exposed if their on dirt to just keep culling doesn't make since. I wish you the best of luck.

 

[MadHens]

Madhens since you are still getting your new chicks I am very curious on how you will keep them from getting sick? If you plan on vaccinating them wouldn't you need to know what your dealing with for sure? Or just keeping them separate I would think would be pretty tuff. These RD are a epidemic someone needs to come up with a cure! If most all back yard chickens already have it or will be exposed if their on dirt to just keep culling doesn't make since. I wish you the best of luck.

Suzierd - I will only be able to keep them separated for perhaps the first two months. After that, they'll all be together. I'm doing this with the understanding that there is an extremely high chance that the second batch will get the same illness eventually. Whatever they have, it hasn't killed anyone yet (the first chick started showing symptoms about 2 weeks ago, but everyone seems o.k. today). But, if it does start killing off my first batch before I integrate the birds, I will cull what's left of the first batch.

As for vaccines, the only vaccine MPC offers is for Mareks - which to my understanding, is not a respiratory illness. I wasn't planning on having them vaccinated for anything else; I wouldn't even know where to get the vaccines around here.

 

[Suzierd]

This site talks about the vaccine
http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/ps034
I found it very interesting and promising that it said -
More recently, live vaccines have become commercially available that do not spread from bird to bird, do not cause disease in turkeys, and cause a very mild and predictable reaction in pullets. These offer many advantages over the live vaccines used in the past.
It sounds like a good way to go if your going to get more birds. Of course you would have to be sure your dealing with MG. Thought you might find it interesting.
I would think you would probably have to find it on line and order it if your interested.

 

[featherz]

First state vet supply (peter brown/chicken doc's store) has MG vaccine. It's pretty pricey and I know nothing about it, but that's another source. I am sure he'd be happy to talk to you about it if you call him.

http://www.firststatevetsupply.com/store/index.php