Niacin Overdose

[Sarahf95]

@Isaac 0 please can you help or direct me to someone that can? How much of this should I be administering to my 4 week old crested duckling And how often? He’s had a couple of seizures in the last week as per the vets advice I started him on this on Monday and been giving half a tablet in his water. The container I measure his water in is 600ml.

 

[Isaac 0]

Just to show how easy it is to overdose, by my math 3 drops of b complex would be an overdose for a 35g duckling (day old mallard size)

Also if you put one ml in a water dish and you had 4 ducklings, if they drank half the water (obviously spilling the other half) that would also be an overdose.

Interesting that this is in stories guide, maybe its not full of typos just information that is not commonplace?

Not sure I understand what you're trying to say...

Yeah but cyanocobalamin is in durvet b complex, you recommend that all the time.

The study shown above states that it takes several hundred times the recommended dose for there to be any possible side effect, it seems pretty safe to me. Hundreds of people have treated their ducks using Cattle B Complex Brands and to my knowledge, there haven't been any toxic side effects reported yet.

 

[Isaac 0]

@Isaac 0 please can you help or direct me to someone that can? How much of this should I be administering to my 4 week old crested duckling And how often? He’s had a couple of seizures in the last week as per the vets advice I started him on this on Monday and been giving half a tablet in his water. The container I measure his water in is 600ml.

Sorry to hear about your duck.

I'm assuming your vet thinks this is a thiamine deficiency?

Could you post a picture or tell me the brand name of the bottle you have?

 

[Isaac 0]

Wait, I'm confused. The addition of niacin to their diet made the ducks' legs weaker? I thought niacin strengthened the leg bones. What am I missing?

Yes, it appears that giving too much niacin can have the opposite effect.

"Clinical signs for niacin toxicosis in chicks include reduced egg production, growth retardation, short legs and coarse, dense feathering. High dietary levels of niacin (0.75% to 2.0%) fed to broilers were detrimental to dimensions and mechanical properties of bone (Johnson et al., 1992; 1995; Leeson and Summers, 2001). There was no change in the mineral content of the tibia, but bone strength decreased with increased susceptibility to fracture.”"

Interesting isn't it?

 

[Ratchnick]

Not sure I understand what you're trying to say...



The study shown above states that it takes several hundred times the recommended dose for there to be any possible side effect, it seems pretty safe to me. Hundreds of people have treated their ducks using Cattle B Complex Brands and to my knowledge, there haven't been any toxic side effects reported yet.

Yes this is calculated with the dosage the study say

Not sure I understand what you're trying to say...



The study shown above states that it takes several hundred times the recommended dose for there to be any possible side effect, it seems pretty safe to me. Hundreds of people have treated their ducks using Cattle B Complex Brands and to my knowledge, there haven't been any toxic side effects reported yet.

You put that @ 350 mg/kg it becomes toxic. That Is the number i used for my math. Yes 3 drops is many many times the required dose for a duckling.

 

[Isaac 0]

Yes this is calculated with the dosage the study say

You put that @ 350 mg/kg it becomes toxic. That Is the number i used for my math. Yes 3 drops is many many times the required dose for a duckling.

When I said this-

"The study shown above states that it takes several hundred times the recommended dose for there to be any possible side effect, it seems pretty safe to me. Hundreds of people have treated their ducks using Cattle B Complex Brands and to my knowledge, there haven't been any toxic side effects reported yet."

I was referring to B12, not niacin. There are many niacin supplements out there that could easily be overdosed with. Here is one for example that contains 1000mg per scoop, if you were to give that to a week or two old ducklings there'd likely be adverse side effects if the use was prolonged. The same goes for most Cattle B Complex's.

https://www.amazon.com/Nutricost-Ni...coding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=N15Z8PBXP78H2GEKF1C4

 

[BigBlueHen53]

Yes, it appears that giving too much niacin can have the opposite effect.

"Clinical signs for niacin toxicosis in chicks include reduced egg production, growth retardation, short legs and coarse, dense feathering. High dietary levels of niacin (0.75% to 2.0%) fed to broilers were detrimental to dimensions and mechanical properties of bone (Johnson et al., 1992; 1995; Leeson and Summers, 2001). There was no change in the mineral content of the tibia, but bone strength decreased with increased susceptibility to fracture.”"

Interesting isn't it?

Yes, thanks.

 

[Sarahf95]

Sorry to hear about your duck.

I'm assuming your vet thinks this is a thiamine deficiency?

Could you post a picture or tell me the brand name of the bottle you have?

@Isaac 0 The vet didn’t really know to be honest (they rarely see ducks) but said to just give it to him in case it is any kind of deficiency. So I’m really just going off the advice on here too. Sorry it was supposed to attach on my last message

 

[Isaac 0]

@Isaac 0 The vet didn’t really know to be honest (they rarely see ducks) but said to just give it to him in case it is any kind of deficiency. So I’m really just going off the advice on here too. Sorry it was supposed to attach on my last message

Yes, I got the label. Do you have the brand name?

 

[Pollo Blanco]

Cyanocobalamin is one of the ingredients added to most B Complex's for cattle, I wasn't saying it should be given to ducks, simply showing the risk of overdose toxicity. Hundreds of people have used the B complex with their ducks and we haven't seen any signs of toxicity or adverse side effects.

I don't know enough about it to go into further details though, but it seems to be safe in the amounts recommended.

It's a tough one (cyanocobalamin) to find info on. Unfortunately Google filters out natural health information due to their ties to big pharma. Even using Duckduckgo, this information was on page five of the search.

IIRC, it can cause macular degeneration in 15% of the people who take it.

Cyanocobalamin
(Also CN-Cbl, or Cyano B12)

Cyano B12 is a cheap, synthetic, slightly-toxic, inactive form of B12 that is made with a cyanide donor and is used commercially. It is the most stable form, because the cyanide molecule has the greatest attraction to the cobalamin and protects it from extreme conditions (like high temperatures). However, it doesn’t absorb well and requires methyl groups to detoxify it.

Methylation is one way in which your body detoxifies. But it requires methyl groups, which are often in low supply because of our modern life which is full of toxins. To remove the cyanide out of cyanocobalamin, the body uses a methyl molecule. This is why people with methylation problems (like autistic children) can get worse on CN-Cbl but not on other forms of vitamin B12.

https://regevelya.com/vitamin-b12-forms/