Rare Blue Fawn Rouens

[apricotvalleywf]

I am having trouble following this, what do you mean by a silver phased Rouen? If the female was a Saxony and the drake was Rouen or atleast wild mallard colour then all of the ducklings would be split for light phase + heterozygous completely dominant blue.

If you are saying that not all of the ducklings were heterozygous for blue then this couldn't be from a saxony, but rather a blue trout or blue fawn, something with heterozygous incompletely dominant blue.

 

[apricotvalleywf]

Okay, silver phased could mean a variety of different things. If you are saying 2 or 3 out of 10 or so were showing blue then this would make sense that the mother would of had 1 dose of incompletely dominant blue in her.

The odds of this passing this to her offspring with a Rouen drake in the mix is 50%. The 2 or 3 out of 10 puts you exactly in this range. It is not possible for the Saxony / Rouen theory to exist if 50% of the ducklings are wild mallard colour and 50% showing 1 dose of blue.

I suspect that the mother has 1 dose of blue whoever she may be. (this is an extremely educated guess).

 

[Senna95]

Yes, rouens come in a color called "Rouen Clair", which is a trout phased Rouen. Asside from that, I believe that in order to prove that you have pure rouens you will have to do some test crosses because I honestly don't think that most people will believe that you have had 2 similar mutations in one hatch.

 

[dotknott]

I suggest to you, too stop posting all these strange questions and then you wont get replies that are not what your asking for.....I start threads that go no where, because no one really has an answer...
Look after your Ducks the way you want....I do....

Please don't offer advice like this. It's counterproductive to making the forum a better place for sharing thoughts and ideas. If you think the OP could have worded the question better, provide an example of what you think they are asking and point out what makes your wording different from theirs. If you understand the other commenters points that OP is admitting their struggle to understand, then by all means break it down for them. Otherwise your response comes of as quite callous by basically saying don't ask questions since you don't understand the answer.

Incomplete dominance is a weird concept, especially if you aren't familiar with the concepts of Mendelian genetics. It's unfair to expect everyone to know what the other commenter is saying immediately upon providing an answer.

 

[Welshies]

I'm sorry everyone. This thread just isn't as simple as I hoped. Let's not fight.
Anyways, I just texted the breeder. Waiting for a response....

 

[Senna95]

Sure, I have lots of ideas.

If a saxony X Rouen made a white bird, then neither can be a pure saxony or Rouen. There was probably a pekin involved somewhere.

I'm not sure what you mean by "silver grey", except that you may be talking about "blue", as in Cumberland blue, a common color for runners. This, crossed with a Rouen would result in a blue-fawn bird.

saxony X Rouen would also result in blue-fawn.

 

[Senna95]

Since we don't know your breeders' set-up it is impossible to know exactly what outcome should be expected from her crosses. If she doesn't breed in strict pairs, then it is possible that your little flock has multiple moms/dads. It could be that only one of her saxonies, and one of her Rouens or runners carries the white gene, and only when those 2 particular birds get together will you have a white bird, and then only one in four at that. So the possibilities of a white bird would be pretty small.

Now, blue fawn is a pretty easy color to breed for, since it is incompletely dominant, and it is obvious when a duck has this gene (i.e. Your birds). Since both saxonies and blue runners have this gene it is fairly obvious that one of them was involved in making your blue-fawn birds.

 

[Senna95]

That's what I would do. Keep in mind though, that it is very possible that you have some hidden recessive genes going on, such as recessive white, dusky, light phase, among others, so don't be surprised if you get some.....surprises.

If you really want to know and understand what is going on, I recommend you pick up a copy of Dave Holderread's "Story's guide to Ducks", and Mike and Chris Ashton's "Colour Breeding in Domestic Ducks". both are excellent.

 

[Senna95]

Yes, it looks like you may have gotten mixed ducks of mixed ducks. I don't see any that look pure..... Sorry, not even yours. The eye stripe is wrong for a Rouen.

If you yourself are happy with the ducks, and want to breed and sell, by all means, go right ahead. Just don't sell them as pure and put your customers in the same unfortunate, ackward situation that you were in. There is nothing wrong with mixed breeds, but there is something wrong with dishonesty....

 

[buff goose guy]

I'm not trying to be rude either, but rather trying to educate.

What you are suggesting, Buff Goose Guy, would be SO highly unlikely. It would mean that the mutation would have to occur in one of the sex cells before dividing, the hen or drake with the mutation would have had to donate sex cells (eggs or sperm) from the time before and after the mutation (since not all of the offspring had it), and it would just happen to be the incompletely dominant blue gene mutation, out of the hundreds of thousands of possible genes.

Since the breeder has (or had) both blue runners and saxony ducks which carry the blue gene, I think that is a much more likely option. But I guess anything is possible.

No I totally agree that the chances are VERY high for this to happen, but you know it is always still a possibility. It's the same scenario of Albinism and melanism it happens even out of hundreds and thousands of possibilities it does happen. Which is how I have melanistic mallards genetically tested and proven as pure bred, I also have a pedigree going back decades.