Run fencing question & predators

[Missyk0903]

I have a several questions I have 6 assorted egg layers & 6 assorted brahma chicks, my husband and I are trying to build a run for them that will be comfortable enough for them until we can build a much larger one next summer, so what is the min. size you would recommend for all 12 chickens (i know brahmas are extra large) also how predator proof does a run need to be if chickens are only out during the day and secured in the locked coop at night? Should I still do the run as secured as if they were in it 24/7?

 

[21hens-incharge]

Yes to securing it as if they were exposed 24/7. Many predators are active more hours than we think.

A 10x12 will suffice.

While Brahmas are large they are also docile.

 

[aart]

Should I still do the run as secured as if they were in it 24/7?

Mine is not.
It's 2x4 welded wire with an 18-24" anti-dig apron of same mesh.
Mostly for hawks, very effective, but have had fox and coyote run at it during the day and bounce off.
It is in my sight and hearing much of the time (how I witnessed the bounce offs) and can intervene if needed.

 

[Tahai]

How much security you put in depends on your predator pressure. I have a lot of pressure. I have lost 4 flocks over the past 15 years. Each new flock I would upgrade my coop and think I had it secure enough this time. I took 5 years off, and my new coop is named Coop Knox. Because it is. The coop is solid, no gaps bigger than 1/4 inch. The Coop is also located fully inside the run. Predators must breach the run before attemping the coop. The run is fully enclosed in 1/4 inch 16 guage pvc coated hardware cloth. There is a 2 foot wide anti dig skirt around the perimeter. The door has no gaps. The only thing that will be able to get in is a bear and that would take a lot of effort and make a lot of noise.
*Knock on wood* Not too worried since the bears have never messed with my coops or hutches in the past.

 

[Ridgerunner]

trying to build a run for them that will be comfortable enough for them until we can build a much larger one next summer, so what is the min. size you would recommend for all 12 chickens

I don't look at coop by itself and run by itself but the two together as a space system. How you manage them together helps define your needs. And you are in New York, you will have some serious winters. Not so much from the pure cold but from the snow and cold winds, that can make your run unusable for a significant portion of time. People deal with this all the time in different ways. How big is your coop? Is it big enough so the chickens can stay in it without going outside? Many times they can, even if it isn't that big. Often people block of a portion of the run to keep snow and wind out, maybe by putting tarps over it. A covered run can be nice.

I have yet to see a chicken with a tape measure making sure they have a certain number of square feet to call their own. One way chickens have learned to live in a flock is in case of a conflict the weak runs away from the strong. They need enough room to get away. And the weak avoid the strong so there is no conflict to start with. They need room to avoid entering their personal space to reduce the chances of conflict to begin with. Once they are fully integrated and the pecking order is set there is usually very little conflict, that's why so many people do well with fairly little space. But you are going to be integrating young chicks, that takes extra room. I'm glad you are doing that in the good weather months, not in winter.

You can manage this by pure room, free ranging is nice but most of us can't do that. Having separate areas can really help. Don't be too surprised if you see your chicks in the coop when the adults are in the run. When I go down in the morning to let them out I typically find my chicks on the roost while the adults are on the coop floor. They are avoiding each other and getting along great. You can improve the quality of what room you have by adding clutter. That means having things they can hide under, behind, or above (like the roosts in my coop).

How are you building the run? Will it be a fence with posts and wire? If so, you have a lot of flexibility in how you shape it. If you are building something with 2x4's or other lumber, the less expensive sizes are usually 4'or 8' in dimensions. I'd prefer an 8x16 as opposed to a 10x12 run because it is more efficient to build. If you are covering it, the 8' span could be easier to cover with standard 8' lumber and get it to support a snow load. While my personal preference would be bigger, either one should be OK for a permanent run.

how predator proof does a run need to be if chickens are only out during the day and secured in the locked coop at night? Should I still do the run as secured as if they were in it 24/7?

How devastated would you be if something happened to a chick or chicken? That may determine how predator proof you want the run.

Like Aart, mine is not predator proof. My 12 x 32 main run is predator resistant. It is also the 2x4 welded wire with aprons. I have a solid cover over about 2/3 of it and netting over the rest. A raccoon, bobcat, fox, or possum could climb into it through the netting but they haven't yet. I also have an area over 3,000 square feet inside electric netting. That will stop any ground based predator but it is vulnerable to flying predators like hawks, owls, and eagles. I lock mine in a predator proof coop at night and don't have issues then. Over the years I lost one to a hawk and one to an owl in the electric netting area.

I agree, bobcat, mink, fox, coyote, raccoon, and practically every other predator can hunt during the daylight. I even saw a possum eating at my compost pile at 1:00 PM on a bright sunny day. I did not expect that. Most of these are more dangerous at night because there is no human activity to scare them away but they are still a risk.

 

[perkolator]

Why build twice? Do it once, do it right; build the biggest run you can manage, and make it secure. Predators will come at all times of the day. Took me 4yrs and 4 flocks to learn that yes basically any run needs to be like a fortress if you don't want heartbreak, and to free-range only when I'm physically present in the yard. As mentioned, Brahmas are big and docile - we had two, they were some of the first victims when free-ranging, likely because they couldn't get away fast enough. Good luck.

 

[Missyk0903]

Why build twice? Do it once, do it right; build the biggest run you can manage, and make it secure. Predators will come at all times of the day. Took me 4yrs and 4 flocks to learn that yes basically any run needs to be like a fortress if you don't want heartbreak, and to free-range only when I'm physically present in the yard. As mentioned, Brahmas are big and docile - we had two, they were some of the first victims when free-ranging, likely because they couldn't get away fast enough. Good luck.

Well I can not afford to build it as big as i like it this year, I want it to be really big and predator proof which means really big bucks, if i can give them a smaller one but still with enough room to feel comfortable this year it would make more sense. then i can attach the new extension on to it next year and make it even bigger. If I had an endless amount of cash flow then they would definitely be getting the run of their dreams this year.

 

[GCrumb]

Like folks have said -- it depends on your predator load and the type of predators. Also, nothing is predator-proof, and how predator-resistant something is can depend on placement and human activity. If you live out in the woods and are gone all day most days you need something stronger than if you're home and outside a lot, or in a busy neighborhood. A run that's closer to the house will need less than one further away, one in the open less than one that offers nearby hiding spots for predators to case the joint or take conveneint breaks from digging or pulling on wire.

There's somebody home most of the time. Our run's pretty flimsy but covered, there are hawks and lots of things can climb. The little hen-houses are pretty tough. I'd never trust an automatic door not to just let my hens out to some beastie that'd got into the run, though.

 

[David61]

My day time run is 10x30 of 2"x4" welded 6' animal wire. It is inside my fenced-in yard and my bulldog is in the yard so hawks are my main concern. I have a hawk net.
If i were worried about four leg day time threats i would add an electric wire.
100' roll of animal, a few T posts, heavy duty hawk, electric wire, net center post... $400 bucks should get a 10x30 done.
OMG! when did wire fencing go up? $260 for 100'

 

[BarnyardChaos]

The general recommendation for run size is 10 sq. ft. per bird, but that varies depending on your particular needs and challenges, your flock, and the predator threat. Concerning the flock needs, some people can get away with less space if they have plenty of objects to break the line of sight from a bullying chicken. With your Brahmas, I'd be generous with extra space, not less, because they are so docile and heavy. I'd also be generous with predator protections for the same reason.