Shadrach's Ex Battery and Rescued chickens thread.

[ManueB]

Most of the responses from the more experienced keepers tend to state males attacking chics is rare, if it's happened at all for them.

I certainly agree that it must indeed be rare if people like you and Molpet who have had a life time experience with chickens never saw it.
Pure speculation from my part, but suppose there is link between an adult male's rotten behaviour with the hens and being aggressive with the chicks. Most chicken keepers don't keep a rooster that isn't good with the hens long enough to see how he behaves around chicks. Just like in nature, that rooster would maybe not have a lot of chance to become a father ?

If on the other hand such attacking chick is more common than I've portrayed then I would be interested in knowing the keeping circumstances.
I believe one would find that an explanation for the behaviour could be found there.

My keeping circumstances did not change but luckily the next three males that hatched here were not like this. What changed was the flock's dynamic. The aggressive rooster Théo was taken away from his first flock when he was three months old and arrived here in a tight group of six two years old ex-batts who had never seen a rooster ; it was very hard for him to make his place and he was bullied for months. The other males were born in a flock where there was already an adult rooster however horrible Théo was to the first male chick.

I think the problem is that because the behavior isn't activated in the hens it's assumed not to be there. But we know that females carry genes that they pass only to their sons. Although no studies have been done that I am aware of, certain aspects of behavior could very easily be that kind of maternal inheritance.

One thing I do know is that Théo behaviour did not come from having aggressive male genes through his father.
For one thing, the farmer who gave him to me keeps a multi rooster and multi generational flock and any rooster who showed this type of behaviour would be instantly dispatched.
And the other thing is that I have observed countless times many bantams from the same lineage who free range on our village road. They usually stay in couples or sometimes two roosters with two broodies, watching over armies of chicks. The roosters are extremely protective of both the chicks and the broodies.
If genetics was for something in Théo's behaviour it must have indeed come from his standard sized mother.

Follow up:

The chicks are not hiding close to the broody hen any more, but exploring, investigating all areas of the run. I was pleased to see how active they were, despite a drizzling cold day. The older chicks will be two weeks old tomorrow.

This evening before dark I brought a small amount of shredded cheese to the run. The hens milled about, excited about an expected treat. What surprised me was the chicks joining in, dashing in between the hens to snatch a crumb here and there.

Total change in behavior 24 hours post-rooster.

That is good news and I hope comforting you that you did what was right.

 

[ManueB]

Still on the cruelty topic. It's quite obvious they want out and keeping them confined I view as an act of cruelty. I asked the person in the post above what they thought of those years they had been coming to the field knowing the terrible conditions the chickens lived in, complaining to others, but not actually doing anything about it. It's funny isn't it how suddenly everyone elses time is more consuming than yours.


View attachment 3809009

The Sweary Boys are the same.View attachment 3809008

It sort of rained a bit then drizzled a bit on and off all afternoon. They still went out onto the allotments. They eat and then stand by the run gate waiting for me to open it. I keep them in the run while they're eating to try to ensure they all eat enough. If I open the gate and it's quiet out there, they're off like children let out of school.
We got a couple of hours out without getting soaked, just a bit damp.

Mow eating from the green tray. Carbon is usually the one to bully Mow away from the food. Henry lets her eat right next ot him much to Carbons annoyance.
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When the drizzle turned to rain. We all sit there glumly staring out at the grey watching the crows pick up the feed that got scattered on the ground outside, not to mention one very persistant rat trying to get into the coop extension to eat.
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Henry looked cold and tired and he was first off to roost as usual.
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I hope that one person's opinion did not succeeded to hurt your feelings.
While I may not always agree or understand how you see things, I think calling Dig's life cruel is ignorance.
Too bad there has been some talk about the allotment politics on this thread ; because sharing it with some of the allotment holders would certainly be also very educational for them !

 

[L-plate chicken mum]

It is. I can't show the peck hole on Fret's back due to being a hand short. It's not healing up. It's not infected but it's not drying out and scabbing over. I've had similar on my hands, maybe three or four millimetres deep from an open beak that took ages to heal.

Is that the double puncture mark that’s visible but fuzzy in the last picture? Even out of focus that looks sore

 

[LaurenRitz]

I have given away several hens who were aggressive toward chicks. I think that breeding broodiness out of hens may be affecting their behavior toward chicks in general. I am not talking about normal "it's my food, you have to wait" behavior, but brutal, murderous hatred, where a chick is deliberately cornered and attacked viciously.

I will never set the eggs of hens who have violent tendencies.

 

[Ladies-Eight]

Ex Batts good morning one and all!

Tea is ready.

Temperature is in the 60s and sunny.

Have a great day!

 

[fuzzi]

I certainly agree that it must indeed be rare if people like you and Molpet who have had a life time experience with chickens never saw it.
Pure speculation from my part, but suppose there is link between an adult male's rotten behaviour with the hens and being aggressive with the chicks. Most chicken keepers don't keep a rooster that isn't good with the hens long enough to see how he behaves around chicks. Just like in nature, that rooster would maybe not have a lot of chance to become a father ?

My keeping circumstances did not change but luckily the next three males that hatched here were not like this. What changed was the flock's dynamic. The aggressive rooster Théo was taken away from his first flock when he was three months old and arrived here in a tight group of six two years old ex-batts who had never seen a rooster ; it was very hard for him to make his place and he was bullied for months. The other males were born in a flock where there was already an adult rooster however horrible Théo was to the first male chick.

One thing I do know is that Théo behaviour did not come from having aggressive male genes through his father.
For one thing, the farmer who gave him to me keeps a multi rooster and multi generational flock and any rooster who showed this type of behaviour would be instantly dispatched.
And the other thing is that I have observed countless times many bantams from the same lineage who free range on our village road. They usually stay in couples or sometimes two roosters with two broodies, watching over armies of chicks. The roosters are extremely protective of both the chicks and the broodies.
If genetics was for something in Théo's behaviour it must have indeed come from his standard sized mother.

That is good news and I hope comforting you that you did what was right.

I did what I felt was right, after giving the rooster as much leeway as I could. Seeing him full on attacking (not just pecking or short pursuit) was the proof for me that he was the problem, and needed to go.

Monday evening: Martha is to the right, butt facing the camera, not hovering over the chicks. And they're mingling with the hens, dodging small pecks aimed their way.

Looking good.

 

[BDutch]

in the case of animals I also have to acknowledge that they really don't have the ability to suborn their instincts. They WILL give in to their instincts, every time.

I find it hard to believe that we humans know such things for sure.

Its also a bit strange imho to say that humans who misbehave or take control follow their instincts.
Like pestering the kid with the red hair or thick glasses on school. Child abuse. Torturing prisoners. Taking the lead no matter what. Etc.

I believe chickens are not very different in this kind of behaviour than humans. Why do we tend to name it instinct with animals and name humans wo succeed to gain power, clever bastards without us saying its instinct driven behaviour?

 

[MaryJanet]

I find it hard to believe that we humans know such things for sure.

Its also a bit strange imho to say that humans who misbehave or take control follow their instincts.
Like pestering the kid with the red hair or thick glasses on school. Child abuse. Torturing prisoners. Taking the lead no matter what. Etc.

I believe chickens are not very different in this kind of behaviour than humans. Why do we tend to name it instinct with animals and name humans wo succeed to gain power, clever bastards without us saying its instinct driven behaviour?

Actually, we know for sure several species demonstrate empathy for others. Elephants for example. And it's been observed in several other species too.

If anything, humans have become very good at divorcing themselves from empathy through inventing things like organisations and online gaming and enclosing resources etc etc. At present, most developed economies function as poverty factories.

 

[Shadrach]

Can you get your hands on Vetericyn Spray? I had one of the girls with a pretty nasty puncture and she healed up very quickly with this: https://www.chewy.com/vetericyn-plus-antimicrobial-poultry/dp/133993 It seemed to help dry it up and allow healing.

View attachment 3809322

I haven't seen it here in the UK.
I use Hibiscrub for disinfecting and this
https://okfarma.es/4406-thickbox_default/blastoestimulina-polvo-cutaneo-2-5-gr.jpg
for wound healing.

 

[Shadrach]

Is that the double puncture mark that’s visible but fuzzy in the last picture? Even out of focus that looks sore

No, wrong hen. That's Carbon with the feathers ripped out. It's the other one grey one, Fret with the puncture wound but it's under the feathers. I only noticed it because it bled.