The Plymouth Rock Breeders thread

[LindaB220]

The good thing about WRs are that they finish out well on forage and a little feed, whereas other breeds may require penning and a lot of feed. There's a reason why it's WR genetics in the standard broiler CX and not BRs or Buckeyes. Their density of meat fibers and their muscling at the breast and thigh is unparalleled, IMO.

And, a mature, spent layer hen is nearly as big as the cocks of any other breed out there. Here are two carcasses side by side...one is one half of a 6 yr old WR hen(hatchery stock) and the other is a whole carcass of 3 yr old RIR/BO cross cockbird. Note the length and fullness of her breast filets and even the size of the thighs....the hen is on the right. That hen had been living on a few bites of feed only each evening and the rest of her feed was foraged and she had been fed like that for a few months prior to this processing.

That looks great Bee. Something to look forward to.

Lefty, I bought some of Ken Weaver's White Rocks locally. A local BYC buddy had bought eggs. This was last month. Now they are six months old and getting big The cockerel is still a teen.

But the girls are getting red in their combs so pretty soon we'll see some eggs. I have four of the pullets.. I am so fortunate to have found them. I've been looking for over six months. I have my coops coming along and working on getting three breeding pens going. Baby steps though.

 

[emenheiser]

If folks have read this thread or followed it over the past few years, they know my view on these matters and my breeding efforts to address them. Slow, slow, and even slower. It is the plague. 22 weeks for a K to reasonably fill a frying pan? Waiting 36 weeks for pullets to lay a tiny egg? All the while gorging on expensive feed?

Is this really the Plymouth Rock?

Even with Rocks (of any variety) with the "appropriate" growth curve and laying capability (as defined by the Standard and by the performance standards from their heyday), it is difficult (if not impossible) to profitably produce meat and eggsat today's feed costs. This is why most "heritage" breeders rely so heavily on breeding stock and egg sales, or on selling meat and eggs at a price point that less than 5% of the population can afford. There are some opportunities to reduce feed costs using certain byproducts, etc., but there are logistical challenges to that approach, not the least of which is the scale on which a person must operate to be profitable.

There is no arguing that many of the Rocks from yesteryear had superior performance to many of the "Rocks" we have today, and our efforts should most certainly focus in restoring those qualities. However, I'm not convinced that that is far enough. In terms of the economic qualities described in the Standard, I think we largely over-romanticize what that 100-year-old bird is capable of doing in today's economy. This is the reason I concluded that, in making the Blue Rock, I would use the 50 years of genetic selection for economically important traits in the commercial industry to my advantage, rather than attempt to squeeze a bird that was economically viable today from a "heritage" pool that had been essentially let go, and arguably would struggle to be profitable even if it hadn't.

 

[Fentress]

There is no way that standard bred poultry can be profitable. The market wants a natural product, that means a pastured product and there are lot of people out there starting to do that and that is great. they don't care about the SOP aspects and besides people are successfully passing off mongrels as heritage breeds, so that is a loosing battle. I think the future for standard bred poultry is with small holders who appreciate the history/culture of poultry and desire a natural/sustainable lifetsyle that the breed can play a part in. But even at that the d@#+ bird still has to be productive! You can only take it but so far, how sustainable are you when the bird laggs so far behind what it should be. I'm actually optimistic about the future and I don't blaim the exhibitionist for anything, they played a role in preserving what we have. It is a different time and we need a different chicken.

 

[Fentress]

Breeders who show their Standard-bred poultry are called exhibitors, not exhibitionists. And we didn't merely play a role in preserving what we have, we created what we have, and we were the only group who preserved it when no one else cared.

People need to keep in mind that the production traits of the breeds were relative. The Rocks, Rhode Island Reds, New Hampshires, etc of their day were far ahead of what they had available prior to the development of these breeds. They were profitable due to the economics of the time. I submit that they may not have been that much more productive than those we have today, but they simply had nothing better at the time, and so these breeds were the best that was available. The industry went on to continue to develop better commercial layers and broilers, leaving the original breeds behind in terms of production.

My apologies for the word choice, it was a rushed post that was well intended.

 

[LindaB220]

My apologies for the word choice, it was a rushed post that was well intended.

That's okay Fentress. We all have our days of jumbled words. I know I do..

 

[maryhysong]

What chickens did you grow up with? From the folks in my parents generation, who grew up in the country, they all have said they process the fryers at 12 weeks. That was the rule! A hatchery bird will not have any meat on it at 12 weeks or at 16 or 20. Just does not have the genes for it. Too bad. The BR I have now can't be processed at 12 either, but at least they do fill out eventually.

I have read in old farm/poultry books about buying Leghorns and processing most of the males at about 3 months for broilers, so that you could give the pullets more room; I don't know, maybe they grew faster or maybe people just ate smaller birds?

 

[Fred's Hens]

I don't have to read about that time, I lived that era.

We grew out 200 such Leghorns every summer. I was in charge of their keeping, feeding and coop cleaning from the age of 8 years on. I can assure you that we did indeed process Leghorn K's at 16-18 weeks and they made dandy eating. I had a catching hook, a sharp hatchet, and a couple of pails and that was my job, at the stump, on cleaning day.

The reality is? YES. The Leghorn was different then. Simply a more stout bird than today's hatchery and commercial egg laying versions that dominate folk's view of the breed. Finding good, meaty Leghorns is more challenging today, but they ARE out there, if you know where to look and who to ask.

One my first group, circa 1959 or so.

 

[normanack]

In the late 80s I was served a chicken dinner at a good local restaurant (i.e. not for tourists) in the USSR and was surprised to find one super-skinny and tough chicken leg on my plate. Total guess here, but perhaps that represents a more typical eating chicken in our country's past and in much of the world.

 

[rancher hicks]

My mother talked of keeping chickens on the third floor of their house before my time. Had a fire and burned to the ground. I really do need to research that. Might be a news article somewhere.

Anyhow, there are the heritage leghorns being worked on. Don Schrider of the ALBC raises some really nice Browns. I think he's still in NC. If I were to get into them Browns would be my choice.

The ALBC has a list of breeder for many of the old breeds.

I'm sure Fred remembers the days when you bought chickens by purpose/use. Broiler, Stewing and Roasting was on the label.

As a kid I remember the "real" Farmers market here in Syracuse. You'd find live animals for sale. You could take them home to do them or nearby was the slaughter house. You'd by the animal, take it over and get it done up.

Now there are no live animals and the slaughter house is gone. Mostly home made goods and coolers of meat for sale. Retail produce or farm grown. Most folks can't tell the difference.

What I find funny is folks will buy eggs from an old couple, not realizing they're paying more than they would in the store for the exact same eggs. From the exact same egg farm. I volunteer so I know they deliver to the school.

I do have some old farm papers and did share at one time what I felt where interesting stories, but folks bashed it so I didn't do that anymore.

 

[Stse586]

I don't really post much, but I entered five plymouth rocks in FowlFest this weekend, 3 barred and 2 silver penciled. All of my chickens decided to molt late which made things fun this year. Even with the birds I entered, most had feathers still coming in. My barred hen got Best in Breed and my silver penciled cock got Reserve Breed. It is tough to get pictures when they are standing square and not tipped up or down, so most of them are not perfect.

Edited to say, all of the Columbians were molting too hard to even consider entering


The best of breed hen, the tag had a bend so it isn't easily read in the picture