Vertical (gravity) vs. horizontal (spring loaded) watering nipples

[pdirt]

I'd love to hear more from others who have used both systems and have a climate that freezes regularly. Some questions I have:

The horizontal ones are spring loaded. Do the springs wear out (and how long have you been using them)? Do you think the spring is strong enough to cause undue stress on the birds' neck over time? I read that they don't leak. My vertical ones also don't leak but the birds do let a fair amount of water drip as they are drinking. So do your birds leak/drip any water as they drink from horizontal nipples? It looks like they have a very tiny cup for the bird to drink from. I did not realize how much water my birds were dripping until it got to freezing weather here. I now have a mound of ice nearly a foot tall under the bucket and it's only mid December. It is very cold and dry here, 0-20F and 20% humidity, so they have been drinking quite a bit of water. have 12 birds using two nipples on one bucket. I might just find a lid or something to catch most of the ice that I can remove and defrost occasionally but am curious if the horizontal nipples might just be a better solution altogether.

Have any of you switched BACK to the vertical nipples after trying the horizontal ones and if so, why?

As for the neck stress on the birds, I'm sure any nipple system going to cause some small amount. It can't be natural for birds to have to crane their neck to use the vertical ones nor to have to depress the spring loaded thing on the horizontal ones. Just curious if anyone notices a difference in their birds between the two styles of nipples. I see pics of chicks using the horizontal ones so the spring can't be all that strong. FYI, I haven't noticed any issues or neck stress in our birds so far using the vertical nipples but we've only been using them for 7 months.

Thanks for everyone's two cents on the matter!

 

[pdirt]

Update on the horizontal nipples...

I finally ordered some from BYC'r Rich386. He quickly answered all my questions. I just installed them and so far here is what I notice between the vertical and horizontal nipple styles. Mind you this is with the nipples (vertical or horizontal) installed directly into the bucket (no extension tubes, etc.)


Vertical style PROS (photo of this style here):
keeps water clean
fill up a large bucket only occasionally rather than daily for our 12 birds
with an aquarium heater can be used to at least -9F

Vertical style CONS:
The nipples don't leak when not in use but leak quite a bit in use=wet/moldy bedding below the waterer
requires an aquarium heater to keep nipples from freezing rather than a more energy efficient birdbath or stock tank de-icer
can't set bucket on ground lest risk damaging nipples
requires a very specific size drill bit & teflon tape to insure proper fit and no leaks


Horizontal style PROS (photo of this style here):
same pros as the vertical with the bonus that I expect to be able to use my more energy efficient stock tank de-icer instead of the aquarium heater
installation uses standard bit sizes 3/8" or smaller and no teflon tape required (nipples self-seal with hand tightening)
best part is virtually NO LEAKS when in use as birds slurp up all the water instead of trying to drink from a "dripping faucet" as with the vertical nipples
can set the bucket directly on the ground even when full of water, can mount the waterer on blocks or can be hung

Horizontal style CONS:
Birds are slower to adopt to the new nipples since they are used to the vertical ones (both styles are red in color) but I expect this to be only temporary (similar results when I first introduced them to the vertical nipples)
cost is about 2x the cost of vertical ones.


So I see many additional benefits to the horizontal ones and the only real downside is the cost. For our small flock this isn't a big deal, but I can see how it would be if we had hundreds of chickens. Both styles seem very well constructed and should last years of use.

The only other comment is a bit of wash in terms of pros and cons. The vertical ones I think allow the birds to drink more water with less effort but also require them to crane their necks in awkward positions to do so. The horizontal ones allow them to drink in a more natural position but require frequent flicking of the metal lever to release the water. My hunch though on this last one is if they figure out how to hold the lever open while drinking a constant tiny stream of water, not yet sure if that is possible physically or if the birds are smart enough to work in tandem (one holds the lever to release water and the other drinks!) This is just speculation so far and I have little observation to say for sure, I'll update again later.

 

[ladycat]

You could also drill a hole in the little "cup" to allow it to drain, or just cut it off all together.

That's not something I would do. I'm using the horizontals for my Seramas, and I've watched the way they use it. They push the pin until water drips into the cup, then they drink the water from the cup. I don't think they'd be able to get enough water without the cup. Also, if the cup were cut off or had a hole drilled in it, you'd have to deal with water leaking into the litter.

 

[aart]

I've used the thin walled jars/jugs for chick waterers but used 5/16 or 11/32 drill size instead of the recommended 3/8.

BUT

You have to be very careful that the hole is drilled very clean, no nubbins, or scraggly pieces of plastic left hanging.......

......especially if it's the clear harder kind of plastic instead of the opaque softer milk jug/juice bottle type of plastic.

AND

Don't thread it in all the way, just until snug then test by filling with water, snugging a little further if necessary to stop leaks.

 

[Doc7]

I’ve seen 4 of 6 chicks use the waterer to the point of tipping their head back and swallowing so I am feeling pretty good about the transition. Dry bedding is awesome!!

 

[pawtraitart]

Here are baby quail and some chicks using a horizontal nipple. Babies can do it, so adult birds are no problem. It's just about forming a new habit.

 

[WestNashChick]

I bought horizontal nipples and drilled them into a plastic bucket with handle, and hung it from a chain. It works perfectly. I tapped it a few times to show my chickens the water, and they caught right on. No messy water, and it never drips onto the ground.

 

[LoneOak]

It sounds like there may be different mfr's of the horizontal nipples out there. I've only purchased ones from Rich (the Soloway brand) and he said to use a 3/8" bit. He actually said, the bit size wasn't super important, because the threads are tapered...you just screw it in until snug and it will self-seal. I think it would be possible to over-tighten and that might cause a leak. I only hand tightened in a 3/8" hole and have never had a leak. Both in ex-foodservice buckets and quart yogurt tubs.


Again, it sounds like there may be different brands of horizontal nipples...with different threads and hole requirements.

I have searched the internet high and low and can just about assure you that their are only one brand of the horizontal nipples and they are the Solway brand sold by Rich on EBay. You can't by them directly from the manufacture as Rich has exclusive rights to the product in the US. The tapered threads of the nipples is designed so it isn't extremely critical which size hole you have but if you follow Rich's instructions and drill a 3/8" hole you should have no problems what so ever. If you drill your hole slightly smaller like 11/32" or 5/16" they will screw in a tad tighter but if you drill slightly larger like 13/32" or 7/8" they will never tighten up and will leak.

Personally, I like mounting most all mine in PVC pipe and tap the holes with a 1/8" pipe tap to make the holes perfect. The size of the tap is 1/8 x 27npt(National Pipe Thread) and predrill the holes with a 21/64 drill bit. If you tap threads in your holes first and you need to remove the nipple for any reason you should be able to replace it with another one or even a different type with no problems. Stuff like the auto water cups will screw in the same 1/8" pipe thread no problem, I like to have a lot of options.

Take these numbers to your local hardware store and show them to the sales clerk that deals with taps and drill bits and they will hook you up with the right stuff.

 

[aart]

Learned this morning, at 24F, that the little bit of water that can stay in the lip of the HN's will freeze and lock up the spring rendering the HN inoperable.

When I emptied the jug there was skim ice on the surface of water inside and a chunk of ice on the inside end of a couple of the metal pins.

I have a submersible aquarium heater on order, should be here next week, that I will stick in there for the test phase for winter use of this waterer.

 

[Birdinhand]

I should remember where you live......but don't ...put it in your profile?

i'm in the seattle area. we have some pretty uptight local officials who have been known to scour social media to find reasons to make visits. I don't need anyone with a clipboard making mountains out of mole hills around here.