Border collies ? update more help needed

[Beekissed]

He also goes into the other dogs bowls and snaps at them when they try to eat. I correct hijm and put him into his own bowl. I don't know what to do.

This is something that can be trained away. My BC mix is a hog for food and he always caused trouble at meal times because my older dog doesn't gobble her food like he does. Fights would start or he would manage to eat hers when her back was turned and I'd have to feed her again. I finally decided to take control of this behavior......

I take a scoop of food and approach the older dog, I tell her to lie down. She does this and I lower the scoop....if her butt comes off the ground, the scoop is withdrawn. I don't give the food until she is lying calmly. She gets fed first, as she eats slower.

Meanwhile, the BC is standing expectantly. I get his scoop.....I only had to teach him ONE time that I expect him to lie down and remain calm in order to receive his food. He learned it immediately and now he lays down when I approach him. If that butt comes off the ground when I lower the scoop, I withdraw the food. He is a quick learner. Now he lies down and stays down and doesn't move a muscle!!

By the time he is fed, the older dog is halfway through and is finished about the same time as Jake. No more fights, no more shoving or bouncing around at meal times. Only calm expectancy as I walk slowly to their perspective feeding places and give them food. They are not allowed to eat until I say, "Okay!".

Don't underestimate these dog's intelligence.....you can teach them about anything!

This lesson took one 2 min. session!​

 

[Cara]

We have 5 dogs so it's like feeding time at the zoo. They each have their own 'spot' though, and configure themselves when we're putting the food down. They're usually good about not touching each other's food unless one wanders off and leaves it.

They each have to sit before they get their food, and we started that from a young age with each of them. We feed young puppies separately as they tend to be more ADD and need more frequent meals, but move them in to eat with the big dogs when they're ready and the same rules apply to them. Do not stick your nose in someone else's bowl while they're eating!

The most important thing is to have a routine and stick to it, and if they do wrong correct them. We always feed ours in the same order, from most to least dominant, they all have their own different bowl and they know whose is whose. If he's a real pain, it might just be easier to feed him in another room. We allow ours to growl at each other to protect their own bowl, but we do not allow them to bully another dog away from its food or to growl at us. Growling at humans (unless they're strangers near our yard/vehicles) is a big no, and they all know not to.

Something else came to mind. Do you feed them once a day, or more frequently? If they're only eating once a day it can make the problem worse because they are so hungry at feeding time.

 

[Sebrightmom]

I love Border Collies. We use to raise them for years, but don't anymore. I still have my old girl, who will be 11 this Spring. She is a red and white border collie. I showed her in 4-H years ago. We did great together. I also have her daughter that will be 5 this year. She is a red merle. She is beautiful. They are very smart dogs and love to work the animals. I can't say enough good things about the breed.

 

[scrambledmess]

Extremely intelligent!!! Saying they need a job is a huge understatement. Our female has decided her job is to protect our home from trucks and motorcycles. She can run them down and turn to chase one coming back the opposite direction without missing a beat. We have put up electric fence on top of our chain link to keep her in. Now she jumps the 6" privacy fence to get out.

As far as the feeding goes. We feed both our dogs (the other is a german shepherd) at night in their kennels. No chance for any food aggression this way.

What I wouldn't give to have the time to train her in ability or frizbee competitions!!!

 

[legacyln]

Smart dogs, ours is no problem with the chickens, cats or kids, but I have heard from others that the tendency by BCs to nip when they herd can lead to inadvertant chicken injusries. Not a problem for us since our dog' s herd drive is focused on fetching. They are a little neurotic. We throw balls for our guy and go for long walks but it wasnt enough and he created his own job: herding large downed tree branches and rocks. Sounds funny right? Not so funny now that his teeth are prematurely worn and we just noticed he broke one off. We're going to make a vet appt and expect to need an extraction.... Oh yeah-- this dog is the most expense dog I have ever owned- accident prone w/lots of injuries and vet trips!

But we do love him and will probably adopt another someday when he goes to the big ball game in the sky... *sigh*

 

[reveriereptile]

My father-in-law has a border collie and she is a bit skiddish. If you toss food down in the kitchen for her you have to say "ok" a bunch of times for her to eat it since she acts scared to death like we are going to hit her if she touches it. Have no clue why since she only has been yelled at a few times. She loves to try to help get the cows inside the barn by nipping their ankles. She barks often mostly out of excitement or if a stranger comes around. She knows a few commands like roll over, speak, and beg. She does however get overly excited that she will run up to the fence we have our camels in during the winter and bite them, chased the ducks during the summer, and has bitten our smaller dog since she didn't want the other dog to help get the cows in. The biggest problem we have had was two years ago during the summer I got my first chickens/ducks/geese and when we had them outside in a cage during the day for sun and grass (they were about a month old) she would lay beside the pen and not leave and would jump at the cage. We then finally moved them into a huge fenced pen and only would let her come in when we were in it since we wanted to try to get her not to attack the birds. They were out there for a month and then one day I walked in and seen her laying down in the pen (she went under the fence) and I yelled at her and a RIR roo ran out of her mouth. I started freaking out. None of the ducks or geese were touched. I ran all over looking for my chickens and found some that hadn't been caught and got my father-in-law to help me look. We found them laying all over in the pen (grass was 2 feet tall), all over outside of the pen (even the next day we found 1), and some we never found. My father-in-law was out there just an hour before I went out. So the dog got under the fence, attacked, dragged some out of the pen, and killed about 6-7 chickens. Some had bad injuries and one was bad enough that it died choking on its on blood from a neck wound. She got yelled at real good for that one by me, my husband, and my father-in-law. The dog is a nice dog but I wasn't to happy over that one. She has only attacked any of my birds once since then where she might kill it. That was this last summer when a young pullet went through some wire cause it was afraid of the rooster crowing. I yelled just in time when she found it under something before she did any damage. She does kill muskrats and injured some weird beautiful bird that had a long beak that we had to put down. She does good with kids but doesn't really play with them much other than to be pet or have a rock kicked down the road for her to chase. I wasn't around when she had puppies but I heard she didn't do to good at raising them cause she wanted to get the cows in instead and would get stepping all over the puppies and try to leave them. She doesn't bother our cats at all.

 

[Jamie_Dog_Trainer]

Quote:
Hello Jenny

Congrats on the new family member. I just have a few things to add to whats already been said.

First, him not being fixed and "bothering" your bostons--I'm assuming you mean that the BC is mounting your bostons? If this is the case it may have very little to do with him being un-neutered and has everything to do with dominance and/or frustration on his part. The same goes with the feeding time issues you are experiencing, he's asserting himself over your other dogs. Manage feeding times so he does not have the opportunity to do this. If you have to stand and watch the whole time, do that, you can even put him in a crate so he's not allowed to even "go there" with his behavior.

I just scrolled up to see your pups age. 8 months old and he is at the right age to begin climbing the ladder of leadership. Seems he may either be a natural lead/dominant dog (ie, actively seeking dominance) or he's got little leadership to follow so he's in a more passive dominance role (ie, he is taking leadership because he's got no one else to follow). Either way, you need to nip these behaviors in the bud and start teaching him that you are the leader and that he needs to step back and allow you to be that leader in your house.

A dog with the mind of a BC will need more than most dogs. He's already showing signs of lack of leadership and direction. Take the lead show him what you want and how you expect things to go. You will bond with him solidly through training and consistent and fair expectations of him.

If you can, take an obedience class with him. They are fun for you both, can teach you a lot and give you some time away from your house were he might not be so keen to be pushy, there by, giving you some time to establish a new way of thinking for him. "Im the leader and my way is the right way" kind of thinking.

Whatever you do, don't waste his mind!!! He's got a lot of potential and it would be wonderful for him to be given the chance to show you

best of luck.

 

[college town chick]

My husband and I breed Border Collies -- they are a wonderful dog, but like any other breed you have to pay close attention to selecting, training, and housing them in a way that fits the breed and its original purpose in order to see the very best of the breed.

Fortunately Borders are still pretty close to their working roots (and hopefully it stays that way) -- so you won't see as many health and odd behavior problems as you do in some breeds that are unfortunately bred more for their looks. Borders are still a fairly healthy breed (the biggest issues I've seen are some eye and deafness and some are a bit touchy to give wormer and flea meds to -- those are things to check with your vet and/or a previous owner with). As for behavior disorders, those are relatively few, and the ones I've seen with issues have more to do with the owners not taking into consideration what sort of dog they're dealing with than any inherent genetic issue. Of course, as a breed gets more popular, expect to see health and behavior problems -- and this could be the case in some areas of the country with the Borders (which I'd be really upset to see).

Borders need, absolutely require at least basic obedience training! You will have a problem dog without it! From the sounds of it, this dog has some basic obedience issues -- running other dogs off their food is a no-no. These dogs are just too smart and too active not to be trained; as herding dogs they've been selected to have a high work drive and lots of stamina and intelligence; they need a job. If they don't get one, they will invent one -- and then the owners often have trouble, because the job may not be one the onwers would care to have! Also, they must have excercise on a daily basis 0-- they do get calmer when they get older, and some lines are not as hyper as others, but I've yet to meet a Border Collie that truly a lazy couch potato 100% of the time. If they don't get some sort of physical and mental challenge they get bored and fidgety (think cabin fever that we humans get) -- and then you start seeing all sorts of behavior issues. Fortunately, Borders are very smart, do have a good work ethic, so they are pretty easy to train and engage in some activity (they really like to do this, much more than many other breeds who would like to be couch potatoes) -- so even an older Border can be pretty successfully turned around and broken of bad habits IF someone takes the time to understand the genetically selected drives of the breed and trains and works them in such a way as to give those drives some focus.

The American Border Collie Association has some very good links on training your Border at their website, and I highly recommend taking a look, and checking out any local dog clubs for training opportunities with your Border -- with a good dog trainer who understands the breed or at least understands herding dogs and what makes them tick.

Personally, I love Borders -- I sort of inherited them (they are my husband's dogs, I had Dobermans and German Shepherds), and it took some adjustment to the Borders (they are soooo quick, I had to speed up my reaction time during training by about 5 seconds as they were that much quicker than even the two breeds I was used to working with), but they are lovely, lovely dogs. Very loyal and protective, but very pleasant natured, so smart and athletic, and pretty to boot (our male is just so light footed when he moves, and our female has the most intense, gorgeous gold eyes -- plus they look great all dolled up for Christmas in red and green w/ their black and white coats). And they are great stockdogs (and here again, while they are pretty easy to train to that, they just don't do it on their own, unless you want problems, herding dogs have to be handled and trained to do their job correctly and to the owners' specifications -- I can't stress that enough; no herding dog just goes out and "does it" without some education -- they will herd, but they won't herd to the best of their abilities without education).

 

[merry hens]

I love them too! They're great dogs, but they arent for everybody. They are very intense, and extremely loyal, as others said. Mine appears to be laid back and relaxed most of the time, but is like a loaded spring ready to work. Border collie's intelligence and especially their ability to form a herding partnership with their handler is just absolutely amazing. My dog seems to be able to read my mind sometimes. He is good around the chickens. He lets the chickens walk all over him and some of my hens even follow him around! But sometimes he does try to herd them, which just doesnt work on chickens because they are not herd animals, they just freak out! He would never hurt them though. I hope your Border collie works out for you! Can we see pictures?

Mary

 

[Jennyhaschicks]

I gave him back. I didn't feel like I could give him what he needed for training.

The biggest thing is that my Bostons just didn't like him. I was breaking up dogs all day. He would also chase my cats. My poor kitten hid in my closet for days only coming out when I had the dog in the attached garage so the kitten could eat and use his box. My adult cat stayed out for days which is not like him.
If he would have been the only dog I would have kept him and worked on him with the cats. I honestly felt over whelmed and felt like it wasn't fair my my animals. He also spent him time humping my dogs and my son. Which obviously I did NOT like. I would correct him and he would be back at it. My son ended up being afraid of him.
So he went back. Then I found out my bil's ex wife bought him. They have less dog experience then I do, so I am wondering how that is going.

Thank you all for your advice. It was very helpful.